GUILTY UK - Katie Rough, 7, killed by teen, Woodthorpe, York, 10 Jan 2017

[SaberTooth]

The chds throat wasn't slashed she was stabbed twice and we don't know why but what you all forget is it has be a tragic case of luck in where she hit main artery as she hardly had time to premeditate that at 15 or in hour half max after school.

There are conflicting reports on her exact wounds, I guess we will know for definite when the autopsy report has been released. But definitely interesting point, she could have very well not understood her own strength or where she would cut would lead to this girl passing away. For arguments sake, she could have researched it, still questionable as to why she had a Stanley knife. However as others suggested she could have been self harming. I'm sure we will know more as the case develops.

 

[Nobodyinparticular]

<modsnip> Although the police were there working on Katie and ambulance as he with other neighbours, only 6 houses in the close asked if they needed any assistance and they said not and cordoned off the close, the same neighbour saw Katie lying face down on floor of side entrance of his house near the towpath. As for Bulger murders I was there when it happened 2 streets away staying at my aunties as my child was in alderhey hospital, although Thompson and Venables codnt be named as right said it was chd A and chd B everyone knew who they were and immediate neighbours burned down their families houses and they were put in places of safety. Same thing happened to the parents if a 18 mth d baby raped on an estate I lived on in Warrington when the step father raped the 18 mth old girl in front of the babies mother and grandmother and my midwife also my godmother was on duty and in a and e when the baby come in and died. My midwife also my godmother and friend had to have time off work to have therapy over what she saw with the babies injuries. People on the estate tied the door handles with the mother and grandmother in and burned it down. They got out and the mother was housed approx 10 miles from there but neighbours soon found out and did same again. This is not anything like the Katie rough case it's more like the Venables Thompson Bulger case but like Katie's case and a case I saw myself near where I lived in another part of Oxford in which a trivial row ended up with an ex army lads throat slashed in a spontaneous way as carrying a knife which is very common in teens inparticular and there's many stabbings across the UK every hour or more with kids carrying knives gang or non gang related and in seconds their lives and the dead child's families is ruined which has been highlighted many many yrs now over the Stephen Lawrence murder. Yet nothings changed as it's ingrained into society and fruends to carry knives either for self defence in fear of attacked or to fit in with gangs or so called friends, more a fashion accessory for some.

 

[Nobodyinparticular]

<mod snip> Why you all think that this was a diverse act with intent to kill. Fits of rage are not intent to kill why we have manslaughter nice plea bargaining. The initial charge has to be murder as there isn't another that's what laws we have. I know them very well. When I didn't understand them like few on here I went and studied it instead. I have lectures on domestic violence and on child mental health with 15 yrs experience of actual chd mental health issues relating to child dynamics and instead if being a text book parent i had to suffer it to study it and lecture it.

 

[Nobodyinparticular]

Sorry for many typos, they not when write but after posted they are

 

[SaberTooth]

<mod snip> Why you all think that this was a diverse act with intent to kill. Fits of rage are not intent to kill why we have manslaughter nice plea bargaining. The initial charge has to be murder as there isn't another that's what laws we have. I know them very well. When I didn't understand them like few on here I went and studied it instead. I have lectures on domestic violence and on child mental health with 15 yrs experience of actual chd mental health issues relating to child dynamics and instead if being a text book parent i had to suffer it to study it and lecture it.

Its pure speculations, I'm not saying she intended to kill her. I've previously stated it could be due to her having a mental illness and did not receive treatment after it was sought for. Secondly experience does not necessarily mean expertise as I too have studied this and am qualified. She could have just as willingly killed her with intent to kill as the complete opposite. We do not know, we are just developing theories to try and make sense of what has happened.

 

[flourish]

There are conflicting reports on her exact wounds, I guess we will know for definite when the autopsy report has been released. But definitely interesting point, she could have very well not understood her own strength or where she would cut would lead to this girl passing away. For arguments sake, she could have researched it, still questionable as to why she had a Stanley knife. However as others suggested she could have been self harming. I'm sure we will know more as the case develops.

I'm finding parts of your posts confusing, so I apologize if I'm wrong here. Saber didn't say she SHOULD have researched arteries, but that she COULD have.

In the states, legally premeditation can occur very quickly, so I'm not comfortable saying acts during rage can't be premeditated.

(modsnip) Why you all think that this was a diverse act with intent to kill. Fits of rage are not intent to kill why we have manslaughter nice plea bargaining. The initial charge has to be murder as there isn't another that's what laws we have. I know them very well. When I didn't understand them like few on here I went and studied it instead. I have lectures on domestic violence and on child mental health with 15 yrs experience of actual chd mental health issues relating to child dynamics and instead if being a text book parent i had to suffer it to study it and lecture it.

 

[LietKynes]

Rest gently, little Katie !

 

[Sillybilly]

This family is living a nightmare.

The accused cannot be identified by law and their connection to the deceased is not established. Please stop the speculation and sleuthing/posting on possibly innocent people.

:wave:

 

[Lola68]

Anyone find it unusual that the parents were both on the scene so quickly? And the girl was arrested on the spot (i.e. didn't try to run/hide)? I'm thinking one of the following scenarios:
She phoned the parents to tell them what she'd done - motivation could be revenge, panic, or not realising the consequences of her actions
The parents usually picked Katie up from school and when they realised she'd been picked up by someone else, they had a very good idea where she would be and were sufficiently concerned to race over there
The parents had reported Katie missing when she wasn't at school and the police told them they'd found her (pretty unlikely IMO as I would think they would want to assess/secure the scene first before contacting the parents - and the parents arrived separately by their own means)

 

[policyoftruth501]

Anyone find it unusual that the parents were both on the scene so quickly? And the girl was arrested on the spot (i.e. didn't try to run/hide)? I'm thinking one of the following scenarios:
She phoned the parents to tell them what she'd done - motivation could be revenge, panic, or not realising the consequences of her actions
The parents usually picked Katie up from school and when they realised she'd been picked up by someone else, they had a very good idea where she would be and were sufficiently concerned to race over there
The parents had reported Katie missing when she wasn't at school and the police told them they'd found her (pretty unlikely IMO as I would think they would want to assess/secure the scene first before contacting the parents - and the parents arrived separately by there own means)

I've wondered how the mother arrived on the scene so quickly, even before medics or police, and how she knew where to go. And in a previous post I mentioned a curiosity about the accused girl still being there on the scene as well. However, some of these details may never be known.


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[Lola68]

And I think it was premeditated - I know many people have commented that it's not uncommon for teenagers to carry knives,<modsnip>
And even if it was heat of the moment/she didn't realise her own strength, you would expect her to show some remorse in court (unless she really is so severely psychologically affected that she can't)

 

[FlossyMay]

If it was not the girl's intention to kill the child, she might be in shock.

 

[nothinonyou]

I've wondered how the mother arrived on the scene so quickly, even before medics or police, and how she knew where to go. And in a previous post I mentioned a curiosity about the accused girl still being there on the scene as well. However, some of these details may never be known.

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do we know how far away they lived from the scene of the crime?
My guess is that this girl was walking Katie home from school so I thought they might not live very far hence the quick time the parents got there

 

[Lola68]

I know we're only allowed to reference MSM but I am fascinated by the impact of social media (for good and bad) and how it is increasingly infiltrating our lives.It must be like gold dust for the police

 

[Diamba85]

do we know how far away they lived from the scene of the crime?
My guess is that this girl was walking Katie home from school so I thought they might not live very far hence the quick time the parents got there

I read the child was half a mile away from home


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[LietKynes]

Can we link the FB of the girl arrested for the crime?

RSBM

Was wondering that as well.

 

[katydid23]

RSBM

Was wondering that as well.

I was told a resounding NO! :blush:

 

[FlossyMay]

We cannot mention her name, post her pictures or link to her facebook because she has not been identified by law enforcement. That's the way I understood it at least.

 

[Cherwell]

I know we're only allowed to reference MSM but I am fascinated by the impact of social media (for good and bad) and how it is increasingly infiltrating our lives.It must be like gold dust for the police

It's certainly had a detrimental effect on journalism. Why bother to interview people when you can copy random tweets and facebook posts?

 

[LietKynes]

@ Nobodyinparticular ; no offense intended --but it might help to break up your post into sections/paragraphs and use puncuation..
I found your post interesting--especially that last bit.
I agree with your final sentences... my .02 would be this might have been inspired by jealousy.

Did/do you know the family on a personal basis ? You might be able to be a 'verified insider'. :thinking: .
I couldn't tell that there was only the one bridesmaid from the photos... there aren't that many ....and tbh; I thought Katie was a flower girl.

The deceased's family keep referring to Katie as their 'princess'. Which is normal considering what happened --they are grieving !

<modsnip>

So SAD !!!

:moo: