Found Deceased UK - Libby Squire, 21, last seen outside Welly club, Hull, 31 Jan 2019 #12 *ARREST*

[Vermont24]

I am not 100% sure on the bench, but this is the most likely - indicated by red arrow 1

I agree with you here.

 

[Vermont24]

Can I just check that the route into the park you illustred is the one where you'd park on or near Beresford road? As illustrated earlier by Vermont24?

I hope @Strontium69 doesn't mind me clarifying here -it's the same route, yes. The park house he mentions is immediately next to the car park. There's actually only a couple of designated footpaths in the park - and they lead right to the bench and abandoned buildings by the pond/river.

 

[JosieJo]

1

2

These two pictures are two of the most important for me -

I am not 100% sure on the bench, but this is the most likely - indicated by red arrow 1

These two cops picking something up was from that area behind this bench - red arrow 2.

Also indicated the route into the park, and the coverage for the windows at the back of the house,

What led them to this area? Did the dog indicate the bench? If I was the Police with a strong indication of entering the park along this path, then the natural suspicions would lead to the abandoned buildings, the pond, the river and the woods even without any physical evidence directing in that direction.

But I believe that something OTHER THAN screams/running man has led them to the park. I think the dog has indicated this bench.

I also think this is the entrance that was used to get into the park ...the path leads directly towards the pond and river.
Its possible he parked in oak rd close to this gate near where the road becomes a path

 

[JosieJo]

The discussion last night around no lighting in the park got me thinking. Is there a particular area of the park that when in the open the surrounding infrastructure may give enough light to at least see roughly what you are doing?

 

[Vermont24]

The discussion last night around no lighting in the park got me thinking. Is there a particular area of the park that when in the open the surrounding infrastructure may give enough light to at least see roughly what you are doing?

You'd suspect that the closer to Croda and/or the river you are, the more light there would be.

 

[JosieJo]

You'd suspect that the closer to Croda and/or the river you are, the more light there would be.

That's what I was thinking..presumably amongst trees etc you would not see your hand in front of your face but in certain more open parts of the park you would be able to see enough to function

 

[Vermont24]

I sincerely hope Libby's case does not end up unsolved after a decade, like Claudia's. I wouldn't wish it on any family and honestly can't see that the Lawrences experience will be any comfort to the Squires at this point in time. Too soon.

I'm sure I'm not the only one thinking that this has no similarities with Claudia Lawrence.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

I'm sure I'm not the only one thinking that this has no similarities with Claudia Lawrence.

I agree, not sure why her mum seems to think there are similarities. Now, Leah Croucher, that one is definitely more a "Claudia" case.

 

[kate2931]

I did some reading up on Claudia this weekend, as previously mentioned on this thread it appears there is strong suspicion of who is responsible but due to Claudia’s numerous affairs, witnesses have been less than forthcoming. The reddit thread’s available are very interesting, take from them what you will. Don’t think they could be more disimiliar if you tried. Hoping for some more clarification regarding PR this morning. Thinking of Libby’s family today x

 

[CoverMeCagney]

The discussion last night around no lighting in the park got me thinking. Is there a particular area of the park that when in the open the surrounding infrastructure may give enough light to at least see roughly what you are doing?

You'd suspect that the closer to Croda and/or the river you are, the more light there would be.

Strontium went down there at night. I had asked if it would be possible to accidentally run into the river in a panic and he said there was sufficient lighting from the industrial units across the river to at least be able to see the water. I imagine the rest of the park is pretty dark and it was a quarter moon that night so wouldn't have helped much.

 

[Newthoughts]

@Strontium69 and @Vermont24 do you think the sets of steps to the river behind the derelict buildings would be well known to locals? It looks very grim there so I'm guessing not the place many people head to for a picnic in the park.

Could PR have known about them just from taking the kids to the park or would he have needed to do a bit of snooping around.

I know the buildings are derelict but are they used at all by dealers / smokers / youffs. What I'm saying is how secure would PR be in thinking he'd be undisturbed if he went there. Possibly after being at the bench

I'm still trying to feel whether everything happened as an accident or whether Libby was just the victim of a plan to escalate his tastes. If it was accidental would this be an obvious spot for a panicking person?

 

[Vermont24]

I agree, not sure why her mum seems to think there are similarities. Now, Leah Croucher, that one is definitely more a "Claudia" case.

I did some reading up on Claudia this weekend, as previously mentioned on this thread it appears there is strong suspicion of who is responsible but due to Claudia’s numerous affairs, witnesses have been less than forthcoming. The reddit thread’s available are very interesting, take from them what you will. Don’t think they could be more disimiliar if you tried. Hoping for some more clarification regarding PR this morning. Thinking of Libby’s family today x

Speculation is natural, but trying to make connections were there aren't any is just silly.

Elsewhere, I've seen someone say that nine people have gone missing within 6 miles of Wellesley Ave over 33 years (!) - as though that suggested a possible connection. One of these people almost certainly ended up in the River Hull, and another's car was found abandoned near a known suicide spot.

Again, I'm glad we can talk about LS without making too much of a sideshow of other cases.

 

[Newthoughts]

Strontium went down there at night. I had asked if it would be possible to accidentally run into the river in a panic and he said there was sufficient lighting from the industrial units across the river to at least be able to see the water. I imagine the rest of the park is pretty dark and it was a quarter moon that night so wouldn't have helped much.

Is it the sort of spot where it would be easy to run into the river? It looks overgrown and not the sort of place you'd be and to run far enough and fast enough? Plus Libby was drunk.

We had a student accidentally drown nearby in the river Severn. But where he was last seen there was a paved path right by the river and well kept park area all around. It would be very easy to get to. His body was found just over a week afterwards very close to where CCTV had last picked him up. Looks like Libby would be struggling through long grass and weeds in a short skirt

 

[Marulinka]

Forgive me this morbid question. I hope it doesnt come across as insensitive. But how soon after death occurs can cadavre dog actually 'smell' dead body? Im guessing its some specific gasses that body starts releasing post mortem? How soon after death is the process triggered for the dog to pick up on it?

Again apologies not trying to be insensitive. This is purely general question out of curiosity.

 

[Strontium69]

The discussion last night around no lighting in the park got me thinking. Is there a particular area of the park that when in the open the surrounding infrastructure may give enough light to at least see roughly what you are doing?

In my experience - there is no ambient light along the path.

The only ambient light is around the area of the pond and up on the embankment. The lights from Croda give a little bit of light over the pond.

To the other side, up on the embankment, the lights from the industry on the far bank provides a blinding glare. This means that you cannot see the ground at your feet, but there is enough light to see colours along that part of the bank.

I went along here at night but the camera cannot show what the human eye is seeing int those terms.

 

[Strontium69]

That's what I was thinking..presumably amongst trees etc you would not see your hand in front of your face but in certain more open parts of the park you would be able to see enough to function

Yes that's right, along the path and the wooded area at that side it would be pitch black. However, on the riverbank behind the abandoned buildings and around that bend in the river the ambient light from the other side is enough to

a) blind you in its glare - when I was walking, even though I could see well due to the lights, the glare meant I could not see the ground beneath my feet and I nearly stumbled and fell head first into a bramble patch. HOWEVER, once on the bank, those lights mean that the shape of the river is perfectly picked out.

b) along that bend in the river, and a little way into the woods the light is strong enough from the far bank to see colours and to read by.

 

[Strontium69]

From being down there at night this is a rough estimation of how the light from the far bank shines on to that part of the park.

The back of the buildings and the bank are well illuminated. Down in the trees in that part of the wooded area there is enough ambient light to read by.

It's tricky up on the bank because the lights are blinding meaning that even though you can see your environment you cannot see your footing. However, when you get close to the bank you can see the river in front of you.

It would be easy for a drunk person to fall foul along here, particularly at the steps, lose their footing and fall. BUT how would a drunk person get all the way along the path to that spaot, negotiate the abandoned buildings, and get up onto the bank in the first place.

 

[Vermont24]

Updates here:

Live as Pawel Relowicz set to enter pleas in Hull Crown Court

 

[MsMiniSleuth]

Live as Pawel Relowicz set to enter pleas in Hull Crown Court


A man charged with a dozen offences is back in the dock at Hull Crown Court today.

Pawel Relowicz , 24, was initially arrested on Wednesday, February 6, as police shut off his Raglan Street home.

He was charged with voyeurism, outraging public decency and three counts of burglary and made his first appearance at Hull Magistrates’ Court on Monday, February 11, where he denied all five charges.

Two weeks ago, Humberside Police announced Mr Relowicz had been charged with seven more offences . Those included two counts of burglary, two counts of voyeurism, two counts of outraging public decency and one of receiving stolen goods in connection with seven alleged incidents that were committed between 2017 and 2019 in Hull.

He has not yet entered a formal plea for the seven additional charges after appearing at Hull Crown Court for the first time last week.

His first Crown Court appearance last Monday saw his barrister indicate Mr Relowicz will plead not guilty to the charges.

He is set to appear before the same court again today, where he is expected to enter formal pleas for the first time.

 

[Vermont24]

@Strontium69 Am I right in thinking that the steps are part of the old boating clubhouse? Hazy childhood memories...