Found Deceased UK - Libby Squire, 21, last seen outside Welly club, Hull, 31 Jan 2019 #13 *ARREST*

[lilmissd33]

Yes, second time at the Magistrates Court, when he had just been charged with the further seven offences, it was stated that he was a flight risk, and at high risk of re-offending. No application for bail was made at the later 2 Crown Court hearings.

Thanks for confirming, I'm sure it was discussed quite a bit a few days ago and you confirmed then also, so was certain he hadn't applied.

 

[Joolz1975]

Libby Squire's last confirmed sighting caught on CCTV as she stumbles towards Hull nightclub | Daily Mail Online

Relowicz's mother Marzena, meanwhile, says she has been left devastated ....
The mother of eight said she was desperate to travel to England to see her son, but said she could not afford the air fare.

'I was told by my daughter we had to get £2,000 for bail money but we do not even have those means. I do not have that money.'

Mum has been misled or has misunderstood for sure, or maybe hoping someone in the media would pay for flights over if she dropped hints (that's the suspicious me thinking).

 

[Joolz1975]

I think it's quite likely that PR saw Libby and GreyBeard from his car (may even have seen GB drive away) and he decided to take a closer look; the timing fits perfectly.

Exactly my thinking.

 

[lilmissd33]

I think it's quite likely that PR saw Libby and GreyBeard from his car (may even have seen GB drive away) and he decided to take a closer look; the timing fits perfectly.

Just a thought and would love your thoughts on it but could the loitering PR have been what alerted GB to Libby in the first place as ive seen it discussed why he felt compelled to stop and ask and even how he noticed her as bench wasn't the most obvious at a glance. I'm sure a concerned resident of an area would notice a man loitering near houses late on a freezing cold night .... well that's my opinion on one possible scenario thoughts??

 

[Joolz1975]

Just a thought and would love your thoughts on it but could the loitering PR have been what alerted GB to Libby in the first place as ive seen it discussed why he felt compelled to stop and ask and even how he noticed her as bench wasn't the most obvious at a glance. I'm sure a concerned resident of an area would notice a man loitering near houses late on a freezing cold night .... well that's my opinion on one possible scenario thoughts??

Libby wasn't at the bench I don't think when grey beard saw her.

She was on the corner of Beverley road and Beresford Avenue (sure someone will corect me if I am wrong) which is across the road.

I think it's kind of assumed he maybe helped her over to the bench but don't think that's confirmed.

 

[Skigh]

This is an awful though but one I can't shake but as above, what if Libby became unresponsive in his car and he panicked thinking she was dead so disposed of the "body" to make it seem as an accident if/when she was found. Maybe no obvious marks on her body thus it potentially becoming a manslaughter case.

Whatever happened that night, this wasn't an accident IMHO. Someone was involved and I hope justice is done.

Libby Squire's last confirmed sighting caught on CCTV as she stumbles towards Hull nightclub | Daily Mail Online

Relowicz's mother Marzena, meanwhile, says she has been left devastated ....
The mother of eight said she was desperate to travel to England to see her son, but said she could not afford the air fare.

'I was told by my daughter we had to get £2,000 for bail money but we do not even have those means. I do not have that money.'

Thank you for finding this. I was sure I had read she said they could not afford bail.

 

[Steleheart]

I suspect that the subject of the searches off Paull was her, and it was bad luck they didn't find her then.

Do you recall what day the search off Paull was? The distance from Paull to Grimsby is so much greater than the distance from the River Hull to Paull.
Curious how long it took from place to place in that 7 weeks. Kind of indicates she was actually up river, IMO.

The Humber visibility in the water is not good due to turbidity and that is because the currents/tides are so strong. I am not local so don't take my word all the way from US, lol but found this - https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0272771405003549

I can't see the tide tables from before today but highs are just over 12 hours apart regardless and the high/low differences are a wide range. like 5-6 metres.
BBC Weather - Tide Tables - Grimsby

Pardon my interruption, LOL

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Libby wasn't at the bench I don't think when grey beard saw her.

She was on the corner of Beverley road and Beresford Avenue (sure someone will corect me if I am wrong) which is across the road.

I think it's kind of assumed he maybe helped her over to the bench but don't think that's confirmed.

I don't think I've heard that, Joolz. Always thought she was on the bench side of the road.

 

[Steleheart]

There were very high tides mid March. No idea if this is relevant in the later discovery.

From what I have read here re: the bends and course of The Hull wouldn't more river searches have been appropriate?
I do understand fully what happens when a body enters water, particularly a tidal water course, but if it was thought Libby was in the Hull I seriously wonder why there were not more river searches further along its course.
I'm not a local so apologise if my questions are inappropriate. TIA

Wondering the same. And on the day that she was found I think I recall vans from the Police Marine Unit at the playing fields earlier in the day.

 

[lilmissd33]

I don't think I've heard that, Joolz. Always thought she was on the bench side of the road.

Me too but as I wasn't sure I waited to see if anyone knew, I am sure it was discussed recently what drew GB attention to the Bench are for him to notice Libby or vice versa, I therefore thought she was at bench. Happy to be educated if Im mixed up

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Me too but as I wasn't sure I waited to see if anyone knew, I am sure it was discussed recently what drew GB attention to the Bench are for him to notice Libby or vice versa, I therefore thought she was at bench. Happy to be educated if Im mixed up

I think she was near the bench, on the pavement or even the road, and GB helped her get to the bench.

 

[Joolz1975]

I think she was near the bench, on the pavement or even the road, and GB helped her get to the bench.

Sure I've seen corner of beresford/Beverley mentioned along with grey beard.

Might have got them muddled up will check.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Wondering the same. And on the day that she was found I think I recall vans from the Police Marine Unit at the playing fields earlier in the day.

I think they were looking in a drain or cess pit in the old boathouse.

Maybe the police already suspect she was put in the water elsewhere, hence a lack of searches at the park end of the river.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Sure I've seen corner of beresford/Beverley mentioned along with grey beard.

Might have got them muddled up will check.

Very early on there was talk of Libby being seen at 12:05 on the corner of Beresford & Bev, but it hasn't ever really been perpetuated by police or media. That's the same corner the tools and lipgloss were found though.

 

[Miss_French]

Libby wasn't at the bench I don't think when grey beard saw her.

She was on the corner of Beverley road and Beresford Avenue (sure someone will corect me if I am wrong) which is across the road.

I think it's kind of assumed he maybe helped her over to the bench but don't think that's confirmed.

I've seen Libby was ON the bench and NEAR the bench.

The police said the man with grey beard stopped and helped Libby "on Beverley Road near to Beresford Avenue", but that's still not totally clear as to where Libby was, or where he pulled up in his car. He could have been on the Beresford side of the road, or this was used to pinpoint the location during the appeal for witnesses because it's a major junction and more people were likely to have seen something in that area than being around Haworth St.

 

[lilmissd33]

I think she was near the bench, on the pavement or even the road, and GB helped her get to the bench.

I thought so too, but I've seen today the timing of PR arriving and somehow hadn't realised before today the timings make overlap possible so was thinking PR and his loitering ways may have alerted GB to her rather than GB drawing PR attention as such .... a gent would worry a lady being hassled and felt he had to check she was not trying to escape which I doubt she was at that point,
To be honest it's just an idea as of today and was putting it out there as much to be told how it wasn't possible etc

 

[ChiCubs2016]

He won't get locked based on what is written here though! That's a nonsensical statement. The police must already have had a lot of evidence to question him for the full 96 hours allowed. It is very difficult to get courts to agree to that without presenting new bits of evidence

This is NOT a court of law. We do NOT have the evidence the police have. Nor are we party to his defence. His trial will be held away from Hull.

I'm not sure why a jury would be blood thirsty either. They are told to keep emotions out and look at facts. They are specifically instructed to ignore anything said outside of the courtroom

It won't be one piece of forensic science that will convict or absolve him it'll be lots of different pieces of evidence. CCTV, phone pings, witnesses, DNA, fingerprints, soil samples, footprints, cause of death etc. His defence will have access to ALL that information as well.

The bar for beyond all reasonable doubt is very, very high! Lots of bits of evidence all having to point the same way.

To get 'certainty' as you are proposing then every citizen would need to be accompanied at all times by a police officer with recording equipment. Actually make that 2 police officers in case one lies and maybe an member of the public to check they don't collude.

Your claim that forensic science is loaded with pseudo science and untested claims is simply the most dangerous thing I've ever heard. It is run by qualified scientists. It's been tested and retested. But I'm willing to read any peer reviewed papers you are party to that have managed to discredit the whole DNA sampling, fingerprinting, CCTV, dashcam, pollen analysis, medicine etc along with every scientist involved. I have a science degree so only proper peer review will do for this.

Lastly there is simply no motive for anyone to 'fit' PR up for this crime. If it is him then the police have a duty to protect other young women and their families and prove it. If it isn't him there won't be proof. And in between there will actual guilty but presumption of innocence which will be your guilty man walking free.

I also hold to the better 10 guilty men go free than 1 innocent suffer quote. Thats why we have Independent courts, trial by jury, chances to appeal, right to a defence and a beyond all reasonable doubt!

This is just a discussion form to discuss ifs and buts.

And to add to disagreement that forensic science is loaded with pseudo science and untested claims, DNA and other types of forensic science has also proven people innocent who were falsely incarcerated when we did not have such technology. Some after more than 20 years. It may not always be perfect but it is much better than 30-40 years ago.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

I thought so too, but I've seen today the timing of PR arriving and somehow hadn't realised before today the timings make overlap possible so was thinking PR and his loitering ways may have alerted GB to her rather than GB drawing PR attention as such .... a gent would worry a lady being hassled and felt he had to check she was not trying to escape which I doubt she was at that point,
To be honest it's just an idea as of today and was putting it out there as much to be told how it wasn't possible etc

It's not impossible at all. All we know is that PR parked up on Haworth at approx 11:49 and left at 12:09. Where he was immediately before that, we don't know.

 

[Audiohoney]

Thank you for finding this. I was sure I had read she said they could not afford bail.

Yes I had recalled it being stated. Couldn’t remember whether it was a SM rumour. But as @efhds has kindly shared, it was the interview she did with MSM.

Regardless of whether she said it, it’s simply not true. No money is required to post bail in the UK. I do agree with the suggestion here that his mother might have alluded to this in MSM in the hope they’d fund her airline ticket or help contribute towards a legal defence for her son. The interview with his sister and mother are hard to take as fact because so much could be lost in translation.

 

[Joolz1975]

Very early on there was talk of Libby being seen at 12:05 on the corner of Beresford & Bev, but it hasn't ever really been perpetuated by police or media. That's the same corner the tools and lipgloss were found though.

This is the article I saw and it was very early on so maybe information changed or maybe I've misunderstood it (happens often)



Doesn't state which side of road so could be interpreted either way.

It is a direct quote from LE though.