UK - Libby Squire, 21, last seen outside Welly club, Hull, 31 Jan 2019 #21

[mrjitty]

feb 1st...you go in that river ur freezing dead in seconds if ur already ill with hypothermia.

When i was a schoolboy, we had a river which flowed through our school and i walked over the bridge winter mornings in a 3 degree frost with steam coming off the river

There was a crazy dog owned by the caretaker, which used to jump in there at 8am and splash around before getting out. Of course the river was warmer than the air temperature.

The idea you die in seconds is simply not true. But when you get out, that water that is on you will freeze eventually if you stay outdoors

But the idea you die just like that? It's not true

 

[mrjitty]

He has the presence of mind to adapt his lies to work in with the prosecution evidence too. Today, he says Libby was screaming at the time screams were heard for instance. I dont personally think he is stupid, but I do think he is a very dangerous predator and a natural born liar, if not a very good one.

JMO

RSBM

Admitting to the screams is a disaster. This is why he never should have testified.

 

[Offaly]

1. I find it more plausible than the other lies. A tenfoot with no people around and his easiest opportunity to rape her. No need to go into the park to do what he came for.
2. Do you know ORPF personally? I don't mean this snottily. I just think that if you have actually walked that bit of the park regularly and are familiar with the river access there you couldn't not have an issue with the timings.

I thought the prosecutor's argument about there must have been some other woman screaming and being attacked near the river and some other man walking quickly away from the river at the same time PR says he and Libby were having consentual sex (the same river Libby ended up in) was a great argument that has stuck in my mind (hopefully the jury's too). Mr Alford heard all this screaming yet PR didn't, despite him being virtually in the same place (outside his house) at that time.

 

[Corneileus]

That's exactly what I think and wrote earlier - PR started and sb else finished.

nice one

 

[mrjitty]

It can take just seconds for someone to become unconscious during strangulation, but minutes for them to actually die.

This might fit with the coroners suggestion that Libby didn’t “fully” drown, which the autopsy would show if she fell in herself fully conscious.

I wonder this as well.

He incapacitated her, panicked, and threw her in

 

[HongKongPhooey]

RSBM

Admitting to the screams is a disaster. This is why he never should have testified.

Yah. But thank goooooodness he did! What a day in court this was

 

[Corneileus]

Who knows what creeps meet there at night? Sb mentioned here this is a "dogging site".

look around the location.. its very remote considering in the city, who knows eh...but those timescales DO NOT FIT EVER EVER.I wish they did!

 

[astheworldfallsdown]

Who knows what creeps meet there at night? Sb mentioned here this is a "dogging site".

Would there not be cctv of other people coming and going though? Like there is of PR coming and going? It's only him charged with her murder so I doubt very much there's any other suspects. JMO

 

[porkypies]

I think they said that was all they could see. Skirt probaly hid them and as they didn't get her out of water and a specialist boat did unlikely they saw more.

Edited to add in case anyone from U.S pants means knickers not trousers.

I was waiting for the knickers to be mentioned, I had thought that his story about her removing them herself early in the event, was to cover for her body being found without them, seems I was wrong. But either way, I have noted no mention til now, and think that detail has been purposely withheld all along in order to trap someone.

 

[HongKongPhooey]

That's exactly what I think and wrote earlier - PR started and sb else finished.

What was sb else's motive though? Not rape - no other DNA was found.

 

[mrjitty]

I thought the prosecutor's argument about there must have been some other woman screaming and being attacked near the river and some other man walking quickly away from the river at the same time PR says he and Libby were having consentual sex (the same river Libby ended up in) was a great argument that has stuck in my mind (hopefully the jury's too). Mr Alford heard all this screaming yet PR didn't, despite him being virtually in the same place (outside his house) at that time.

This is the power of circumstantial evidence. It's why we need to look at all the evidence at once, instead of nitpicking individual evidence points

It is simply too coincidental.

 

[Vera_dci]

When i was a schoolboy, we had a river which flowed through our school and i walked over the bridge winter mornings in a 3 degree frost with steam coming off the river

There was a crazy dog owned by the caretaker, which used to jump in there at 8am and splash around before getting out. Of course the river was warmer than the air temperature.

The idea you die in seconds is simply not true. But when you get out, that water that is on you will freeze eventually if you stay outdoors

But the idea you die just like that? It's not true

Yes I agree. Libby's core temperature would have been lower too, so I think it would be less of a shock . You only have to watch that celebrity SAS programe with Ant Middleton. He has them constantly jumping in cold water . Cant see them allowing celebrities to do it that if it was lethal.

 

[Skigh]

So if he didn’t murder her, but left her there to potentially die, knowing how vulnerable she was, is that not murder?
He said he drove off immediately after sex and she was shouting for him to come back. But he left her there in that state
That in itself is disgusting.

I think that is another of his stories. After he has had a day off tomorrow to think about things we might get version 6 on Friday!

 

[mrjitty]

I think that is another of his stories. After he has had a day off tomorrow to think about things we might get version 6 on Friday!

exactly

 

[astheworldfallsdown]

Yes I agree. Libby's core temperature would have been lower too, so I think it would be less of a shock . You only have to watch that celebrity SAS programe with Ant Middleton. He has them constantly jumping in cold water . Cant see them allowing celebrities to do it that if it was lethal.

Shows like that are heavily supervised by experts and conditions are never as shocking as they make them out to be

 

[Corneileus]

I think that is another of his stories. After he has had a day off tomorrow to think about things we might get version 6 on Friday!

when is the day for scientific factual tested timescales?? cheapest piece of evidence to get and would really weld things together..why not? they do not work. il keep repeating this everywhere. i want to make them work, can you please?

 

[ElementalLaura]

This post lands at random.

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[Offaly]

RSBM

Admitting to the screams is a disaster. This is why he never should have testified.

why is admitting to the screams a disaster? probably me being confused there, but i dont understand what you mean.

 

[wilkela]

So if he didn’t murder her, but left her there to potentially die, knowing how vulnerable she was, is that not murder?
He said he drove off immediately after sex and she was shouting for him to come back. But he left her there in that state
That in itself is disgusting.

no it would be manslaughter(if anything)
I don't believe in his story ,he is just lying without any sense (he doesn't want to admit rape that's why he made up this shouting for him to come back )
he clearly don't want to be found guilty of rape (maybe he is scared he will have hard life in the prison or his family will disown him?)

 

[Vera_dci]

I'm getting a lot of stick for my tv reference lol I know its a ridiculous show but my point was in reference to somebody saying if you go into very cold water you will drown due to the shock of the cold water. I was trying to highlight, not always, as shown by pampered celebrities. The river was 10c if I recall correctly. Yes that's cold but its not freezing temperature.