UK - Libby Squire, 21, last seen outside Welly club, Hull, 31 Jan 2019 *ARREST* #19

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Given his previous offending and the way in which it had been escalating, it's not unreasonable to think that rape, perhaps not murder, was the logical culmination and absolute pinnacle of his fantasies. He'd lusted after this for a long time. You'd imagine his actions would be frenzied, making the short window of time during the second visit very realistic. He'd flee quickly as some sense of perspective returned. In subduing her, probably by some type of compression, this attack would leave the victim badly hurt and/or unconscious. The bitter cold would render her helpless.

I really think that it wasn't until the third visit, after a period of what passes as pragmatic thinking in this case, that PR returned to the park, likely to the area around the old boat shed and abandoned buildings, and put her body into the water.
 
It would have to be something like
2 mins to walk Libby out of the car, through the gate and 150m into the park.
2 mins to get her bottoms off and rape her.
2 mins to run her 200m to the river carrying her over his shoulder, navigating the trees and the steps in the dark.
1.5 mins to run back without the 'baggage' of carrying her.

If you'd been in that park you probably wouldn't buy it either. If he has entered through the gate I think he has, it's sort of one of those one way S type entrances. Taking the most direct route, it is then open space with path through to the end where it meets the river. But you have to go over a dirt track mini mound type thing and through thickish trees/bushes to actually get to the river. I just can't see all that ground being covered with an unwilling participant in that time.
 
Just a recap in what the prosecution said in the opening statement, I think we're going to get some accurate timings on this:

Relowicz allegedly left the playing field around seven-and-a-half minutes later without Libby.

Mr Wright said this was "more than enough time" for him to have "taken or pursued Libby out into the playing fields, sexually attacked and killed her, put her body into the river, and then run back to his car."

Libby Squire screamed 'don't leave me' before she was 'raped and murdered'
 
Actually, if she ran away from him when she got out of the car straight away and ran directly to the river herself with him in hot pursuit, it would be more feasible then. They have already reached the end destination at speed so enough time for him to do his business and chuck her in.
 
mrazda71 said:
After initially thinking that Libby dying was not wholly premeditated, I'm beginning to think otherwise.

If he was just wanting to rape someone, to rape Libby as she's his target - he could easily have JUST raped her. She was already intoxicated & disoriented, he didn't even have to drug her himself - he could have raped her in the Endsleigh place, he could absolutely have raped her in his car then shoved her out anywhere and the liklihood is that she would've gone home eventually and potentially not even remembered being raped or reported it if she did realise - the vast majority of women who are raped whilst drunk don't report it because they will not be believed. We know this. Many of his previous victims didn't report the crimes.

Park visit 1 - familiarise with the plan route in the darkness - THOUGH less dark than usual as the covering of snow always illuminates to some extent. At this point, Libby isn't his target, any drunk and or lone female is the intended target.

Park visit 2 - to rape, kill and dispose of body.

Park visit 3 - to check Libbys body had been taken by the tidal flow or to put her in the water at high tidal flow - he'd be aware of the tidal flows as a fisherman.

Drone flying over Park- to check the body hadn't been caught up and was visible.

He didn't care that Libby saw his face, she wouldn't be telling anyone. He didn't care that his DNA was inside her - she was going in the water and wouldn't be found for a long time.

I wouldn't be surprised if this wasn't his first rape.
Click to expand...

I'm tending to agree with the majority of this. The earlier visit to the oark suggests he had a plan for the night and was checking out this location and best route etc as if course the shorter timescale he could carry out the act, the easier it is to convince people believe it couldnt happen in that time.

He had no issue of people seeing him and leaving evidence so rape with someone drunk I don't think would phase him to leave her somewhere afterwards.

If you're worried about someone in a vulnerable position and in the cold you wouldnt wait 2 hours to look for them to check they were ok. My opinion is that he either went to dispose of her body knowing evidence would be found if he left her there, knowing she'd not died of the cold, or to check that her body had been swept away
 
mrazda71 said:
After initially thinking that Libby dying was not wholly premeditated, I'm beginning to think otherwise.

If he was just wanting to rape someone, to rape Libby as she's his target - he could easily have JUST raped her. She was already intoxicated & disoriented, he didn't even have to drug her himself - he could have raped her in the Endsleigh place, he could absolutely have raped her in his car then shoved her out anywhere and the liklihood is that she would've gone home eventually and potentially not even remembered being raped or reported it if she did realise - the vast majority of women who are raped whilst drunk don't report it because they will not be believed. We know this. Many of his previous victims didn't report the crimes.

Park visit 1 - familiarise with the plan route in the darkness - THOUGH less dark than usual as the covering of snow always illuminates to some extent. At this point, Libby isn't his target, any drunk and or lone female is the intended target.

Park visit 2 - to rape, kill and dispose of body.

Park visit 3 - to check Libbys body had been taken by the tidal flow or to put her in the water at high tidal flow - he'd be aware of the tidal flows as a fisherman.

Drone flying over Park- to check the body hadn't been caught up and was visible.

He didn't care that Libby saw his face, she wouldn't be telling anyone. He didn't care that his DNA was inside her - she was going in the water and wouldn't be found for a long time.

I wouldn't be surprised if this wasn't his first rape.
Click to expand...

I agree with all of this, including it wasn't his first rape.
 
14:27
Relowicz asked about account he gave to friends

Relowicz was asked in his police interview about an account he gave to Rafal Mrowczynski.

An officer asked Relowicz whether anything sexual happened between him and Libby the night she disappeared, Relowicz replied: “No comment.”

Relowicz was asked about another friend Darius Chrostek who he saw on February 1.

He was told: “Not just one, but you told two friends about something sexual that took place that you have never mentioned.

“What do you think?”

He replied: “No comment.”

Pawel Relowicz 'held Libby's hand' after 'seeing her staggering' - trial
 
tigerowl said:
Actually, if she ran away from him when she got out of the car straight away and ran directly to the river herself with him in hot pursuit, it would be more feasible then. They have already reached the end destination at speed so enough time for him to do his business and chuck her in.
Click to expand...
That would account for the screams sounding like they were moving too.
 
<modsnip: Quoted post was removed>

She was hypothermic and drunk. If she 'passed out' in those conditions in temperatures of minus five she probably wouldn't have come round.

And why exactly would she suddenly pass out in those conditions - unless someone was causing it? Something stopped her screaming.

Who is that likely to be? The guy raping her or somebody just passing by who sees a crying girl and decided to get her to pass outn

He's done far more at this point than masturbate in the street. Even for that he was locked up for 8 1/2 years for his because the judge said they weren't on impulse but more like campaigns to scare women.

And at the point we're referring to he had actually abducted and raped someone. Hardly mild perversion.

He was also at that park earlier in the evening - why?

He also returns 5 minutes before high tide in the river? Why? What convenient timing don't you think?

Somebody earlier on said their friend could get from the edge of the park to the river in about 1 minute. Having slowly ambled from Libby's bench to his house in less than 5 minutes I would agree. The map is quite deceptive. It's also likely he wasn't using the paths but travelling a more direct route.

I'm not quite sure why you think he doesn't have time to put her in the river in either that trip or the subsequent one. He's fit. He's certainly goes to gym. He claims to run - which is probably true. And he's probably pumped up with adrenaline. She's not exactly large
 
Last edited by a moderator:
14:31
Relowicz asked why he never heard screams
It was put to Relowicz that Sam Alford, who lives in a home among the trees in Oak Road, saw someone running in clothing similar to what Relowicz was allegedly seen on CCTV wearing earlier that evening.

Relowicz was asked if he could explain why he “could not hear screams” other witnesses could.

He said: “No comment.”

Pawel Relowicz 'held Libby's hand' after 'seeing her staggering' - trial
 
14:33
Relowicz denies taking Libby to 'isolated' spot
Relowicz was asked if he was aware of the River Hull and whether he went near the pond, Barmston Drain or the River Hull.

He replied: “No comment.”

Relowicz was asked if he took Libby there intentionally because he knew the area was isolated to attack her.

He said: “There are cameras aren’t there? Everywhere there are cameras.”

Pawel Relowicz 'held Libby's hand' after 'seeing her staggering' - trial
 
14:37
Other witnesses heard screams
Relowicz was told about two other statements from people living in Claremont Avenue.

He was told the two witnesses described how they had their bedroom windows open and heard screams coming from the playing fields.

The officer said: “They said they heard three periods of screaming.”

Relowicz said: “I want her to be found. I’ve never been so honest in my life like I have been like this.

“I have said everything.”

Pawel Relowicz 'held Libby's hand' after 'seeing her staggering' - trial
 
jamjim said:
14:37
Other witnesses heard screams
Relowicz was told about two other statements from people living in Claremont Avenue.

He was told the two witnesses described how they had their bedroom windows open and heard screams coming from the playing fields.

The officer said: “They said they heard three periods of screaming.”

Relowicz said: “I want her to be found. I’ve never been so honest in my life like I have been like this.

“I have said everything.”

Pawel Relowicz 'held Libby's hand' after 'seeing her staggering' - trial
Click to expand...
Ah so more than one witness heard the screams
 
Newthoughts said:
She was hypothermic and drunk. If she 'passed out' in those conditions in temperatures of minus five she probably wouldn't have come round.

And why exactly would she suddenly pass out in those conditions - unless someone was causing it? Something stopped her screaming.

Who is that likely to be? The guy raping her or somebody just passing by who sees a crying girl and decided to get her to pass outn

He's done far more at this point than masturbate in the street. Even for that he was locked up for 8 1/2 years for his because the judge said they weren't on impulse but more like campaigns to scare women.

And at the point we're referring to he had actually abducted and raped someone. Hardly mild perversion.

He was also at that park earlier in the evening - why?

He also returns 5 minutes before high tide in the river? Why? What convenient timing don't you think?

Somebody earlier on said their friend could get from the edge of the park to the river in about 1 minute. Having slowly ambled from Libby's bench to his house in less than 5 minutes I would agree. The map is quite deceptive. It's also likely he wasn't using the paths but travelling a more direct route.

I'm not quite sure why you think he doesn't have time to put her in the river in either that trip or the subsequent one. He's fit. He's certainly goes to gym. He claims to run - which is probably true. And he's probably pumped up with adrenaline. She's not exactly large
Click to expand...

I think some worry about the timings based on the distances quoted by the Prosecution..then looking at walking vs a fit running speed etc ..I feel the prosecution themselves are aware of how tight it is ...hence them mentioning it at opening
 
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