Found Deceased UK - Lindsay Birbeck, 47, Accrington, 12 Aug 2019 *Arrest* #4

[Alyce]

Teacher's evidence
Mr Fenhalls is now referring to the jury to evidence provided by the defendant’s teacher.

The barrister said if he was willing to do something he would do it or grunt, or if not then shrug his shoulders and say no.

He said: “He is plainly a young man who makes his mind up and either does something or no.

“His teachers gave up his records straight away and spoke to the police straight away.

“You can be sure that these teachers are honest and are doing their best.”

 

[Jartykarate]

What’s surprising to me is that the defence didn’t put forward an autism expert As a witness who may have put across how someone with his level of autism would act or think, especially as he has just referred to it. But maybe then his level of autism would have been exposed by cross examination.

 

[HongKongPhooey]

Don't know why Lindsay went for walk
Mr Fenhalls said: “We don’t know why she chose to go out for another walk that afternoon. She had already been for a run that morning.

“Maybe she was going out to clear her head, we don’t know. But out she went and somebody killed her.

“Is it really credible that [the defendant] could have killed her?

“We don’t know where he was between 2.20pm and 6.20pm.”

Clear her head??

Again, introducing a third party situation IMO

 

[Alyce]

Teachers said he was 'compliant'
Mr Fenhalls said: “”His teachers spoke of what the experts say was ‘his suggestibility’ and his difficulty in communication.

“He is in a sense compliant and if set to a task would complete it.

“That’s why you might think [the teacher] volunteered in his witness statement that he had a gut feeling that the defendant could have been asked to move the body by somebody else.

“That is in truth what both teachers thought might be possible. It’s not what any of us in this courtroom would have done.

“But the people who knew best instinctively thought that about him before they knew anything more about that case.

“That opens the door to the possibility that [the defendant] unlike any of us might have responded to a request that he bury this body.”

 

[Alyce]

His teachers spoke of what the experts say was 'his suggestability' and his difficulty in communication.

"He is in a sense compliant.

"If set to a task he would complete it.

"And that's why you may think, his teacher volunteered to the police, that he had a gut feeling, unprompted that the defendant could have been asked to move that body by someone else.

"And that's what his teachers thought would have been possible.

"They instinctively thought that about him before they knew anything more about that case.

 

[SpursGyal]

What’s surprising to me is that the defence didn’t put forward an autism expert As a witness who may have put across how someone with his level of autism would act or think, especially as he has just referred to it. But maybe then his level of autism would have been exposed by cross examination.

It surprised me they put forward nothing and noone. Could they not find ONE character witness for this boy?

 

[Alyce]

So far I pose a series of questions about why it can't be the defendant.

"Who else could it have been?

"You already know anyone could've gone in and out of the Coppice.

"It's an open area.

I turn now to Zoe Braithwaite.

You remember how she described how she was on the higher path and someone was on the lower path and she slowed down and at the start of her walk was just three metres behind the man.

"She gave a vivid account of what she felt about what happened.

"You may need to remember what people feel and what people say.

"She didn't really think about saying anything at first.

"Until August 19.

What does she see from three metres behind?

"A young man in a hooded sweatshirt.

"I'm not going to make any point about the number of men in their teens or twenties who have a grey hooded sweatshirt.

"There's nothing to identify it - no brand.

"But she does say she saw a blue flash on the bottom of the shoes, or on the heels.

"So far you may think she's not given you much detail.

"But what does she say about this man, and she does say 'man', about 20-25.

"In her police report she said he was around 6"2.

"That was her original description.

"That is a tall man and someone who is substantially taller than her.

"When you are stood three metres behind someone you can say whether they are taller than you.

"And she is absolutely certain about that.

"That man, 20-25 was certainly some inches taller than her.

"What was that man not? He was not a slight teenage boy.

"And if Zoe Braithwaite had seen the defendant up there, she would be describing not a man but a 16-year-old slight man who was shorter than her.

"She is describing somebody different. That is the inevitable conclusion that her evidence drives you to.

"She may have seen the 6"2 man who killed Mrs Birbeck.

"But she is describing someone who is not the defendant.

"The description she gives is of a completely different person, from a distance of three metres away.

"And that, I suggest is a compelling and important piece of evidence and that you cannot be sure the defendant is the killer.

 

[Alyce]

Zoe Braithwaite evidence
The jury is now being referred to the evidence of Zoe Braithwaite who was walking in the Coppice around the time of Lindsay’s disappearance.

Mr Fenhalls said: “You must always be careful of what people have come to learn or think rather than what they were feeling at the time.

The barrister said when she went home she didn’t immediately report it to police.

The jury heard that she was initially 3m behind the man and later cut across the open moorland while the man went around the park.

She next saw him about 100-120m away.

Mr Fenhalls said: “You might think describing somebody from that distance is not easy.”
Mr Fenhalls said they jury should concentrate on the description give of the male when he was 3m away.

He said: “She said the male was in a hooded sweatshirt. I’m not going to make any point about the number of men in their teens or twenties who have a grey hooded sweatshirt.

“A grey hooded sweatshirt not take you very far.. There is nothing about distinguishing marks on the clothing.

“She does say she was close enough to identify a blue flash on the shoes.”

Mr Fenhalls she was later shown trainers from the defendant later in the year and they didn’t match.

Description of male on the Coppice 'is not the defendant'
Zoe Braithwaite described the male she saw on the Coppice as between 20 to 25 years old and 6ft to 6ft 2ins.

Mr Fenhalls said this would mean he was taller than her who was around 5ft 8ins.

He said: “That man 20 to 25 was certainly some inches taller than her.

“What was that man not? He was not a slight 16-year-old-boy who was [smaller than the description].

“If Zoe had seen the defendant at the start of the walk she would not be describing a 20-25 year-old 6ft man, not a slight boy.

“Zoe is describing somebody different. That is the inevitable conclusion her evidence drives you to.

“She may have seen the man who killed Lindsay Birbeck. It may have been her good fortune to avoid him.

“But she is describing somebody who is not the defendant.

“That is the absolutely critical feature of her evidence.

“That is a compelling and important piece of evidence which means you cannot be sure the defendant was the killer.”






https://www.lancs.live/news/lancashire-news/lindsay-birbeck-murder-trial-daysix-18704469

 

[Jartykarate]

It surprised me they put forward nothing and noone. Could they not find ONE character witness for this boy?

I think that by saying nothing the defence was basically saying there is no case to answer so we bring no witnesses. The defence then shouldn’t start mentioning his autism really, as the legal counsel aren’t qualified to comment on it as a reason for what he may or may not have done.

 

[KB20]

I don’t know if this has been asked previously. But would his parents / friends/ relatives have been questioned at all? Would they have been asked about his whereabouts etc? I’m asking as I’m not sure if it would be part of the police investigation or not.

 

[Jartykarate]

I don’t know if this has been asked previously. But would his parents / friends/ relatives have been questioned at all? Would they have been asked about his whereabouts etc? I’m asking as I’m not sure if it would be part of the police investigation or not.

I am sure they will have been asked, whether they gave any meaningful answers is another matter.

 

[Alyce]

"All the evidence points to the fact the defendant is guilty of count three.

"He has admitted that he buried Lindsay Birbeck.

"And you have heard about the exhaustive job the police have done.

"The police conducted detailed searches of his home.

"And if there had been any evidence of her you would've heard about it. There is nothing.

"The only evidence of where her body was comes from his voluntary statement, when he uses the phrase 'an area of Burnley Road'.

"There is no actual evidence from the police as to where she died.

 

[Alyce]

No evidence showing defendant was the killer
Mr Fenhalls said: “All the evidence points to him being guilty of count 3 [burying Linsday Birbeck].

“You have heard about what an exhaustive and comprehensive job the police have done and you can be sure everything in front of you is what there is. There’s nothing else.

“They conducted detailed searches of his home. If there was any piece of evidence giving a motive or link to the killing you would have heard about it.

“The only evidence of where Lindsay’s body was is from his statement where he uses ‘an area off Burnley Road’.

“There is no actual evidence of where she died.

“The pathology evidence is not consistent with defensive wounds if Lindsay had been attacked by a stranger, certainly not the boy who was the same weight and shorter than her and against.

“If he attacked her, she would no doubt have fought vigorously.”


https://www.lancs.live/news/lancashire-news/lindsay-birbeck-murder-trial-daysix-18704469

 

[Roostercat]

It surprised me they put forward nothing and noone. Could they not find ONE character witness for this boy?

I guess the only people they could have realistically asked were his teachers and they had already been called by the prosecution. The other alternative would have been someone who knew him but the likelihood is that for someone to know him well enough they would be from the traveller community, and I am not sure how much emphasis a jury would place on that?

 

[Alyce]

The pathology evidence is not consistent with the sort of defensive wounds you might expect if Lindsay Birbeck had been attacked by a stranger.

"Certainly not a boy. And against who, she would have fought vigorously.

"The evidence given to you by Mrs Bibby takes you no further.

"If it was red material or red fabric how long had it been there and where did it go?

"You can't be sure.

"You can be sure though that from the comprehensive searching that if there had been damage to vegetation or a struggle from a fight, the police would have told you about it.

"If the defendant killed her, why has he made repeated trips up there and why has he not buried her up there?

 

[Alyce]

The pathology evidence is not consistent with the sort of defensive wounds you might expect if Lindsay Birbeck had been attacked by a stranger.

He is really struggling now with this argument - how many trials have we followed where someone is murdered by a stranger and there are no obvious defensive wounds on the victim

 

[Alyce]

Why has he made repeated trips?
Mr Fenhalls said: “If the defendant killed her, why has he made repeated trips up there [the Coppice] and why has he not buried her up there?

“Why go back to your own house, collect a wheelie bin, find a way to transport her across the main road and into a public cemetery using plastic from his own house and leaving his gloves?

“That is not the action of somebody who has killed her.

“You might have thought it was deeply improbably somebody asked him to bury Lindsay Birbeck.

“His teachers of their own accord obviously thought it was possible he could be asked to bury Lindsay Birbeck and if he agreed to do it he would do it.

“The people who believed him best thought it was possible.”

Mr Fenhalls said if Zoe Braithwaite was describing the killer then “she was describing a different person.”



https://www.lancs.live/news/lancashire-news/lindsay-birbeck-murder-trial-daysix-18704469

 

[Alyce]

Why did he go back home and collect gloves?

"That is not the actions of someone who killed her.

"You make think it implausible that he was asked by someone else to move the body.

"We do not know what went on between Lindsay Birbeck and the person who killed her.

"But what we do know is that the defendant's teachers of their own accord thought it would be possible he'd been asked to move Lindsay Birbeck's body.

"The person who knew him best knew it was possible.

"If Zoe Braithwaite was describing the killer, she was describing a different person.


"However improbable it may seem, the evidence takes you to a place where you cannot be sure that he killed her.

"The person is a candidate but he is someone different.

"All of his actions are consistent with his guilt on count three and the guilt he has entered.

"So thinking about that, the prosecution cannot make you sure he is the killer.

"And as I said to you at the beginning anything less than sure will not do.



LIVE: Jury expected to retire to consider verdict as Lindsay Birbeck murder retrial comes to an end

 

[Alyce]

Defence summing up concluded
Mr Fenhalls has now concluded his summing up.

He told the jury: “All of his actions are consistent with his guilt on count three and the guilt he has entered.

“So thinking about that, the prosecution cannot make you sure he is the killer.

“As I said to you at the beginning anything less than sure will not do.”

The jury have now been sent away for a 30 minute break.

The trial will resume at 12.30pm when the Judge will start summing up the facts in the case

 

[Alyce]

The trial will resume at 12.30pm when the Judge will start summing up the facts in the case

They are really pushing it through this time