GUILTY UK - Louise Smith, 16, Havant, Hampshire, 8 May 2020 *Arrest*

[HollyHunter9]

I don't what the weather is like elsewhere today, but where I am its very cold, dark and wet today. I did think to myself this morning what a sombre day for the jury to visit the location

 

[scapa]

I've heard of similar things in rape cases in documentary programs and stuff i've watched over the years. (one particular case that I seem to remember was of a young boy who raped and killed a female child and inserted sticks inside her after the attack). Stuff like that has also been referenced in certain crime programs over the years (I think 'cracker' with Robbie Coltrane was one of them)

I'm no psychologist, but from reading, I gather that at least in SOME of the cases like that, it's like an act revenge in a way. A kind of 'closure'. The idea that some of these women hating men feel like her vagina gives her so much power - the source of their pain, amplified in cases of unrequited lust. The want to degrade and destroy it

I think this is a very astute, if horrifying, analysis. When I was in school I had a Law A-level option, and we had a field trip to our local court (my dad was a judge at the time). By pure chance we saw the closing of a trial in which the prosecution, wielding a knife (I kid you not) in examination of the prisoner succeeded in getting him to confess what he had done and how he did it, in the process standing up and screaming that he had first murdered the young woman and then injured and degraded her post-mortem because "the **** had made me kill her, and now she had to pay." I think that the accused in this case may have acted similarly -- this was rage, and any other thinking involved may have been beside the point.

* As a sidenote, my law teacher was white-faced when we left, and a letter went home in apology. My father was not impressed, and many of us had nightmares for a good while after.

 

[Alyce]

Short update re Jury visit yesterday. Photos at link


The 12 men and women trying the case were taken to Havant Thicket, Hampshire, and shown the secluded spot Mays is said to have 'lured' the teenager to before carrying out the 'sexually motivated' killing.


Jurors retrace Louise Smith's final steps at murder trial of uncle | Daily Mail Online

 

[Alyce]

The Crown Court
at Winchester

Daily Courtroom List for Tuesday 01 December 2020
FINAL 1

WINCHESTER

Court 1 - sitting at 10:30 am

THE HONOURABLE MRS JUSTICE MAY DBE

COUNSEL TO ATTEND COURT UNLESS SPECIFICALLY STATED OTHERWISE


Trial (Part Heard)
T20207045 MAYS Shane L
44PC0407020 PORTM Crown Prosecution Service
defendant to be produced

 

[Alyce]

Not seen any live reporting as yet - which is odd as I think SM is giving evidence today ?

 

[Alyce]

Nothing showing on the court lists for Court One, perhaps been delayed for some reason ?

 

[Legally Bland]

14:07JAMIE PHILLIPS
Good afternoon
Welcome to our coverage as the prosecution in the murder trial of Havant teenager Louise Smith is expected to conclude its case against defendant Shane Mays.

14:12JAMIE PHILLIPS
Awaiting proceedings to start
We are currently awaiting this afternoon's proceedings to get underway.

14:30JAMIE PHILLIPS
Proceedings underway
This afternoon's proceedings are now underway.

Prosecution junior Andrew Houston is running the jury through the route that Shane Mays says he took on the day he left the flat with Louise Smith at around midday on May 8.

He is also running through routes Mays took while looking for her following the teen's disappearance.

Louise Smith murder trial updates as prosecution case to conclude

 

[Legally Bland]

14:33JAMIE PHILLIPS
6km covered in search for Louise Smith
Mr Houston tells the jury that 6km was covered by search teams from Hampshire Constabulary officers and Hampshire Search & Rescue volunteers.

She was found shortly before midday on May 21.

Louise Smith murder trial updates as prosecution case to conclude

 

[Harchmare]

Thanks for the updates @Legally Bland! If you need a hand, let me know.

 

[Legally Bland]

Thanks for the updates @Legally Bland! If you need a hand, let me know.

Thanks for the offer, will do.

 

[Legally Bland]

14:43KEY EVENT
Ignitable fluids found in Louise's body
Mr Newton-Price QC is now running the court through various objects that were found at the scene where Louise was discovered in Havant Thicket. He adds that a forensic scientist's report concluded that ignitable fluids were found in Louise's body.

The items found include a small piece of burnt metal from a cigarette lighter, where the court has heard attempts were made to possibly burn the body.

Louise's phone was also found by a police officer on June 4, around 70 metres from her body.

Louise Smith murder trial updates as prosecution case to conclude

 

[Legally Bland]

15:00JAMIE PHILLIPS
Police searched area for shops selling accelerants
Mr Newton-Price QC tells the jury that police attended all premises that sell accelerants, that is substances that can be used to escalate a fire, within a reasonable walking distance of where Louise was found. However, no purchases were found to correlate with her death.

CCTV was also seized within a reasonable distance by police.

Louise Smith murder trial updates as prosecution case to conclude

 

[Legally Bland]

15:03JAMIE PHILLIPS
Clinical review of Shane Mays
A clinical review of Shane Mays found he had an IQ in the "extremely low range" of 63. This puts him in the bottom one percentile, meaning 99 per cent of people at his age range are functioning at a level above him.

He also scored in the 0.1 percentile for memory range, which tests his ability hold information over a short period of time. This means that 99.9 per cent of people at his age have a stronger working memory than him.

Louise Smith murder trial updates as prosecution case to conclude

 

[Bogyo13]

15:03JAMIE PHILLIPS
Clinical review of Shane Mays
A clinical review of Shane Mays found he had an IQ in the "extremely low range" of 63. This puts him in the bottom one percentile, meaning 99 per cent of people at his age range are functioning at a level above him.

He also scored in the 0.1 percentile for memory range, which tests his ability hold information over a short period of time. This means that 99.9 per cent of people at his age have a stronger working memory than him.

Louise Smith murder trial updates as prosecution case to conclude

Wow. Just wow.

 

[Legally Bland]

15:29JAMIE PHILLIPS
Court rises for the day
It was expected that the prosecution would finish its case today, but court has risen for the day.

Mr Newton-Price QC will finish the prosecution's case when court sits at 10.30am tomorrow (December 2).

It is expected that the defence will begin its case then, too.

Louise Smith murder trial updates as prosecution case to conclude

 

[polerina]

15:03JAMIE PHILLIPS
Clinical review of Shane Mays
A clinical review of Shane Mays found he had an IQ in the "extremely low range" of 63. This puts him in the bottom one percentile, meaning 99 per cent of people at his age range are functioning at a level above him.

He also scored in the 0.1 percentile for memory range, which tests his ability hold information over a short period of time. This means that 99.9 per cent of people at his age have a stronger working memory than him.

Louise Smith murder trial updates as prosecution case to conclude

Ok so that is interesting. An IQ of 63 would be considered very low. I don't know much about intellectual disability and criminal culpability, i'm wondering what his defence team will do with this? I would imagine the forensic psychologist or psychiatrist who assessed him for court conducted further psychometric testing, i'd be interested to hear more from them.

 

[Skigh]

Be interesting to learn how accurate the tests are and whether SW would be able to deliberately under perform in order to lower his score.

 

[polerina]

Be interesting to learn how accurate the tests are and whether SW would be able to deliberately under perform in order to lower his score.

From what I know I believe the tests are statistically valid and significant. However, it is always possible to answer falsely. I would imagine it is difficult to consistently decieve the psychologist / psychiatrist across multiple interviews and tests which may last hours. I would hope an astute one would be able to detect a deliberate deception or attempt to manipulate the results of the test. I believe each side is permitted to submit a report from an expert witness, so the prosecution will have been able to bring in their own forensic expert to re-test wherever appropriate.

I wondered if his short term memory issues were relate to his cannabis use? I believe that does affect short term working memory? It'd be a stretch to say that his memory issues accounted for him telling multiple different stories about what he did and where he had been, maybe he forgets what he had for tea, but I doubt you'd forget the basic details of the horrific murder you just committed.

 

[Alyce]

Be interesting to learn how accurate the tests are and whether SW would be able to deliberately under perform in order to lower his score.

I agree Skigh, it would be very interesting to know if any wider information was obtained regarding his mental abilities.

 

[Bogyo13]

Be interesting to learn how accurate the tests are and whether SW would be able to deliberately under perform in order to lower his score.

My thoughts exactly!
I don't think it was ever mentioned whether CJ has similar capabilities?

JMO these are just my musings :I don't think so, then wondering why she was with him? If she is a mother goose type then surprised there are no children yet although that depends on health etc as well.MOO