UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, Faces 22 Charges - 7 Murder/15 Attempted Murder of Babies #27

[ColourPurple]

I also noticed this bit (bolded) about LL showing the message of praise from YG to another colleague and asking how to respond. I hadn’t noticed this detail before and find it unusual that she’d actually want to know how to respond to a compliment. IMO it almost seems it was done to gloat or show off that she’d received this message. This is JMO though I just found it strange as it seems LL wanted others to know that she’d been complimented IMO. Even the colleague was surprised?

Yeah I took it as read that she just wanted to share it with her colleague tbh. I thought the same when she was asking her colleague if she thought Doc Choc was being odd when he messaged her.
JMO

 

[Dotta]

Yeah I took it as read that she just wanted to share it with her colleague tbh. I thought the same when she was asking her colleague if she thought Doc Choc was being odd when he messaged her.
JMO

As if hungry for praise and appreciation IMO.
Those with low self esteem usually behave like this - mainly teenage girls.

JMO

 

[Moll]

I hoped the information that LL had recently been on a course about air embolism (gaining a certificate shown by the prosecution) would be mentioned at the same time as her 'confirmation' that she didn't know much about it, which I think was in Monday's reporting.

 

[marynnu]

I hoped the information that LL had recently been on a course about air embolism (gaining a certificate shown by the prosecution) would be mentioned at the same time as her 'confirmation' that she didn't know much about it, which I think was in Monday's reporting.

The course was about giving drugs through a long line, not about air embolism I think. They no doubt mentioned the importance of avoiding injecting air, but she would have known that anyway.

 

[DinerMite]

I also noticed this bit (bolded) about LL showing the message of praise from YG to another colleague and asking how to respond. I hadn’t noticed this detail before and find it unusual that she’d actually want to know how to respond to a compliment. IMO it almost seems it was done to gloat or show off that she’d received this message. This is JMO though I just found it strange as it seems LL wanted others to know that she’d been complimented IMO. Even the colleague was surprised?

This is after baby H’s first collapse, and just hours before baby H’s second collapse. If guilty, IMO this could feed into the idea that LL was thriving off the attention she was getting for being involved in these incidents, and may have caused more in order to prove herself as ‘the best nurse’…
All MOO

Yes, I definitely agree. I can't recall the exact conversation it refers to but it was with JJK I believe and JJK responds along the lines of "well we all work hard". It was another one of LLs 'look at me, look how good I am' moments.

All moo and totally irrelevant.

 

[katydid23]

I mean no disrespect here but I'm struggling with what seems to me, from your posts, like jubilation at the idea that LL, if found guilty, might lose control and provide high drama in the courtroom. Is that actually what you want to see? What you need to see? In order for you to feel that she's getting her just deserts?

As someone on the fence from the off (albeit not someone wearing a blindfold or with my fingers in my ears singing lalala to drown out the evidence noise), I just want justice to be done. And I feel it will be. If she's guilty and found guilty of what she's been charged with, then that's enough for me. I don't need to see her face when the verdict, if guilty, is read out.

I just don't get this need to see her fall apart publicly in the way you seem to want her to.

Everyone's different. You don't feel the need to see her 'face the verdict.' Others might. No right or wrong, just different.

 

[Dotta]

Everyone's different. You don't feel the need to see her 'face the verdict.' Others might. No right or wrong, just different.

Live and let live

 

[Moll]

The course was about giving drugs through a long line, not about air embolism I think. They no doubt mentioned the importance of avoiding injecting air, but she would have known that anyway.

Thanks, marynnu. Being a non-medical person I only remembered the prosecution's deduction from her taking the course, which I've just gone back to find in 20 June's reporting:

'2:40pm

Mr Johnson says the judge directed that the questions given by counsel are not the evidence, but the answers.
He asks if Dr Jayaram and Dr Harkness 'made up' their observations for Child A and Child B to blame Letby.
He says before the cases of Child A and Child B, Letby had completed a course on IV lines, which highlighted the dangers of air embolus. Mr Johnson asks if that was a "coincidence".'

LIVE: Lucy Letby trial, June 20 - prosecution closing speech​

The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

 

[Dotta]

Thanks, marynnu. Being a non-medical person I only remembered the prosecution's deduction from her taking the course, which I've just gone back to find in 20 June's reporting:

'2:40pm

Mr Johnson says the judge directed that the questions given by counsel are not the evidence, but the answers.
He asks if Dr Jayaram and Dr Harkness 'made up' their observations for Child A and Child B to blame Letby.
He says before the cases of Child A and Child B, Letby had completed a course on IV lines, which highlighted the dangers of air embolus. Mr Johnson asks if that was a "coincidence".'

LIVE: Lucy Letby trial, June 20 - prosecution closing speech​

The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

Dangers of Air e. is nurses' ABC.

They give intravenous injections every day - imagine they pumped the patients with air!

No way!

 

[marynnu]

Thanks, marynnu. Being a non-medical person I only remembered the prosecution's deduction from her taking the course, which I've just gone back to find in 20 June's reporting:

'2:40pm

Mr Johnson says the judge directed that the questions given by counsel are not the evidence, but the answers.
He asks if Dr Jayaram and Dr Harkness 'made up' their observations for Child A and Child B to blame Letby.
He says before the cases of Child A and Child B, Letby had completed a course on IV lines, which highlighted the dangers of air embolus. Mr Johnson asks if that was a "coincidence".'

LIVE: Lucy Letby trial, June 20 - prosecution closing speech​

The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

Well found! It obviously was an aspect of the training. Whether she knew any more detail after this course is impossible to say. Either way she knew it was to be avoided.

 

[Moll]

Well found! It obviously was an aspect of the training. Whether she knew any more detail after this course is impossible to say. Either way she knew it was to be avoided.

Thanks. NJ KC implied there was a significant connection, simply by asking if it was a coincidence that LL had been on the course.
Naughty of him, perhaps?

 

[nyvictoria]

I missed a good deal of the testimony and I’m curious if Letby had good things to say about any of her nursing colleagues. Was there anyone on the nursing staff that she looked to as a mentor or aspired to emulate?

I get the impression that Letby felt she was superior to the other nurses. JMO, and if guilty, she had an awful lot of resentment bottled up inside.

Thanks again to everyone posting testimony!

 

[Jazmania]

Thanks. NJ KC implied there was a significant connection, simply by asking if it was a coincidence that LL had been on the course.
Naughty of him, perhaps?

I think the point was that this course allowed her to treat itu babies and work in room 1 more. Plus being able to deliver drugs via long lines would give her cover to be near the long lines, which she could use to dole out dollops of air.

 

[nyvictoria]

DBM double post. But now that I’m here…

Does anyone else feel that there may be some infertility issues at play here?

 

[Kemug]

Sometimes LL comes across as being very needy, both needing and seeking praise. I wonder why? As an only child she didn't have to compete against siblings for attention, as so many do. It puzzles me.

 

[katydid23]

Sometimes LL comes across as being very needy, both needing and seeking praise. I wonder why? As an only child she didn't have to compete against siblings for attention, as so many do. It puzzles me.

Right, so she would be very used to getting lots of solid praise from her doting parents. So when she worked on a unit, she might feel under appreciated and unnoticed---and worked hard to try and get more attention any way she could?

 

[Dotta]

Well balanced adult person would never run to a colleague to show a text from a bf or a boss.
If it happened in my place of work I imagine ppl would think it strange.
Also, fishing for compliments is a big red flag concerning somebody's personality.

But then, it is formed in (early) childhood.

Exorbitant demands (too difficult for a child to meet) usually result in "not good enough" perception of oneself.
And always seeking approval of others.

But approval should be in ourselves, not the eyes of other people.

JMO

 

[squish]

For me, one of the biggest pieces of evidence for baby H was that her mum and dad and grandparent were with her until very late, the dad left just before midnight, and after they'd all gone LL reported to Dr Ventress that baby H had had a few serious desaturations in the last two hours and been seen by the SHO, which the parents didn't see happening and wasn't recorded by the SHO either, and there were no concerns shown in her observations charts that evening either.

So the prosecution say she invented the deterioration she reported to Dr Ventress to build up to her later collapse after midnight, and it's yet another case where her account is different from the parents' agreed evidence. The prosecution say she pulled out one of the drains after the parents left, causing a desaturation, because Dr Ventress saw it was almost out and had to push it back in.

Didn’t LL go on about the chest drains only being taped on instead of stitched in, like she’d seen in Liverpool? Almost like it had occurred to her the chest drains could easily be tampered with, and she was setting the scene.

This reminds me of something about Baby J: Letby banged on and on about the dangers of stomas and how no one had enough experience with them. This was around a the time of Baby J’s desaturations and a few hours before her seizures.

Baby J’s mum reported that one day, she found her baby covered in feces and wrapped in a towel. It would fit the pattern that LL (if guilty) tried to tamper with the stoma, realised that it wasn’t actually that dangerous, and messier than she’d like, and abandoned that method.

 

[CS2C]

Doesn't look like Chester Standard are there today

EDIT...They are there

 

[CS2C]

Cancel that, Chester Standard have put the red light on. All systems GO