UK - Nurse Lucy Letby Faces 22 Charges - 7 Murder/15 Attempted Murder of Babies #3

[kittythehare]

Applogies if this is completely irrelevant.

She moved into her home in March 2016, and subsequently sold it in December 2019.

It has been confirmed by the prosecution that handover sheets/paperwork were discovered relating to many of the infants involved in the investigation. This included a handover sheet pertaining to Baby B (attempted murder, June 2015). Confirmed in below tweet.

At least one of the handover sheets/documents was from an incident before LL moved house, and thus it’s not as simple as just documentation ‘accidentally’ being taken home and forgotten about. The documentation would have been relocated when she moved home, which begs the question of why she kept them in her possession.

Again, just thinking out loud as I feel there are a number of very questionable decisions/actions that have not yet been answered for. At the very least, they call into question LL’s practice in terms of ethics/confidentiality. Looking at the whole picture at the moment, it’s difficult to see how the defence explain all of these behaviours (the ‘coincidental’ timings, documentation, messages to colleagues, comments to colleagues/patients parents, evidence found at the property, Facebook searches in the months following incidents & the photographs on LL’s phone).

https://twitter.com/x/status/1579486507773353984

I have never in my life had to deal with a missing handover sheet.
The consequences are major.
How come even one did not lead to a mega internal investigation?
That's an entire team affected.
It is simply impossible for it to go unnoticed.

 

[bastien]

I have never in my life had to deal with a missing handover sheet.
The consequences are major.
How come even one did not lead to a mega internal investigation?
That's an entire team affected.
It is simply impossible for it to go unnoticed.

In that case, wouldn't it support the defence's argument of systemic failings at the hospital?

 

[merrypason]

Is that a drawing of a cat top right?? Cat's face in profile.

 

[Marantz4250b]

Do we know what it says at the very top? Only thing I can make out is Not Good Anxiety, but that doesn't really make sense and I don't really think the third word is anxiety.

Not Good Enough.

 

[Marantz4250b]

I have never in my life had to deal with a missing handover sheet.
The consequences are major.
How come even one did not lead to a mega internal investigation?
That's an entire team affected.
It is simply impossible for it to go unnoticed.

Others on here have suggested that they aren't that important and get chucked in the secure waste bin at the end of a shift.

 

[cuecard]

The note is all over the place as I’d imagine you’d expect. Interesting she capitalises “I DID THIS” twice and yet other parts seem genuinely full of despair. I can see why this note will be open to interpretation from everyone who looks at it and will likely divide opinion.

 

[kittythehare]

In that case, wouldn't it support the defence's argument of systemic failings at the hospital?

The failings are pretty well documented prior to defence. They're not new and they're not even unusual for many hospitals .
This is specifically a nursing practice issue.
Patients' records are legal documents.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

I can also read on the last sentence "I don't deserve mum + dad the world would be better off without me" and there are two last words I can't make out

It looks like two additional names

 

[Marantz4250b]

The note is all over the place as I’d imagine you’d expect. Interesting she capitalises “I DID THIS” twice and yet other parts seem genuinely full of despair. I can see why this note will be open to interpretation from everyone who looks at it and will likely divide opinion.

I think I said months back that this trial will have ramifications for absolutely decades into the future; legally, socially, morally, ethically, medically and scholarly. Authors and experts are going to build entire careers around this case. I wouldn't at all be surprised if entire books were written about this note alone!

 

[smucklecrumble]

ok. so I read the whole note and believe this is what it says:

NOT GOOD ENERGY.

I am an awful person. I pay for that everyday.
I can't breathe. I can't focus.
Kill myself right now.
Overwhelming fear/panic. NO HOPE.
Ill never have children or marry. Ill never know what its like to have a family.
I have done nothing wrong.
Police investigation forget slander Discrimination victimisation.
All getting too much everything
Hate myself so much for what this has DESPAIR
Taking over my life everyone
I feel very alone + scared
What does the future hold
How can I get through it
How will things ever be like they were
PANIC FEAR LOST HATE
I DID THIS
WHY ME
I don't deserve to live May cry
I killed them on purpose because I'm not good enough to care for them + I am a horrible evil
Killing me
I don't deserve mum + dad Tom + Matt
Whole world is better off without me
I AM EVIL I DID THIS


Apologies if any words are wrong/misinterpreted. All MOO

 

[kittythehare]

Others on here have suggested that they aren't that important and get chucked in the secure waste bin at the end of a shift.

What others?

Records Management Code of Practice

The Records Management Code of Practice 2021 covers legal, professional, organisational and individual responsibilities for managing records.

transform.england.nhs.uk

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

I think I said months back that this trial will have ramifications for absolutely decades into the future; legally, socially, morally, ethically, medically and scholarly. Authors and experts are going to build entire careers around this case. I wouldn't at all be surprised if entire books were written about this note alone!

This trial will also have ramifications for everyone working in the NHS and healthcare - who is going to want to be a nurse now, a terrifying prospect. In my personal opinion the NHS is already a failing and broken institution that is rapidly heading towards being scrapped and replaced with various privatised mechanisms. This case is not going to help at all.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

I'm curious about the part of her note that says 'slander, discrimination, victimisation'

The note, to my interpretation seems to be a list of her worst fears and what is bothering her. I wonder whether she was already feeling harassed and bullied at work? Is it possible she was being set up for blame every time a child wasn't going to make it?

Are we going to hear from LL herself during this trial? Will she speak? Will she be cross examined?

 

[smucklecrumble]

I'm curious about the part of her note that says 'slander, discrimination, victimisation'

The note, to my interpretation seems to be a list of her worst fears and what is bothering her. I wonder whether she was already feeling harassed and bullied at work? Is it possible she was being set up for blame every time a child wasn't going to make it?

Are we going to hear from LL herself during this trial? Will she speak? Will she be cross examined?

She was also undergoing internal review so this may be some thoughts in relation to that.

 

[Kinderbelle]

I have never in my life had to deal with a missing handover sheet.
The consequences are major.
How come even one did not lead to a mega internal investigation?
That's an entire team affected.
It is simply impossible for it to go unnoticed.

In my NHS nursing experience we were trusted to place handover sheets in the confidential waste before we leave the Ward/Building. I have only ever gone home with them in my pocket twice, but there is no check to make sure you don't leave the building with them here. At least, there isn't in the four separate Trusts I've worked for anyway.

ETA: For further clarification on this, you can only be investigated for "missing" handovers in the event they are found out on the street. If people don't know you have them (and assume you placed them in the confidential bin) then they can't investigate you for taking them. If you don't put your name on the handover they can't trace it back to you.

 

[Powermjp]

The note to me see someone who has a lot of self hatred.

And also lots of self pity, trying to be a victim feeling sorry for herself, when potentially being a murderer.

I don't see any pity of sadness for anyone but herself

Which if she's guilty shows a dark person.

 

[Marantz4250b]

What others?

Records Management Code of Practice

The Records Management Code of Practice 2021 covers legal, professional, organisational and individual responsibilities for managing records.

transform.england.nhs.uk

Can't recall but it was mentioned only a few days ago. Someone on here has said that they'd inadvertently gone home with them and just chucked them in the confidential waste bin the next day they were at work. One person said they'd moved house and found an old one behind a bedside table or something which had been there ages.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

This is about the time she was standing over a baby? when the Dr walked in and saw the breathing tube disconnected and the alarm not sounding and her just standing there. Was the alarm broken? if not, why was it not sounding? If she turned it off then why wasn't she helping the baby? Why didn't she reconnect the breathing tube? this event on its own is suspicous, not 'unremarkable'.

And why was this one incident not subject to an investigation in and of itself? The fact it seemingly wasn't reduced the credibility of the doctor's account IMO. How do we know that LL herself didn't walk in to find the breathing tube disconnected and went into some sort of shock / horror overwhelm 'freeze' response?

 

[kittythehare]

In my NHS nursing experience we were trusted to place handover sheets in the confidential waste before we leave the Ward/Building. I have only ever gone home with them in my pocket twice, but there is no check to make sure you don't leave the building with them here. At least, there isn't in the four separate Trusts I've worked for anyway.

ETA: For further clarification on this, you can only be investigated for "missing" handovers in the event they are found out on the street. If people don't know you have them (and assume you placed them in the confidential bin) then they can't investigate you for taking them. If you don't put your name on the handover they can't trace it back to you.

https://www.nhstaysidecdn.scot.nhs.uk/NHSTaysideWeb/idcplg?IdcService=GET_SECURE_FILE&dDocName=DOCS_059217&Rendition=web&RevisionSelectionMethod=LatestReleased&noSaveAs=1

 

[Marantz4250b]

I'm curious about the part of her note that says 'slander, discrimination, victimisation'

The note, to my interpretation seems to be a list of her worst fears and what is bothering her. I wonder whether she was already feeling harassed and bullied at work? Is it possible she was being set up for blame every time a child wasn't going to make it?

Are we going to hear from LL herself during this trial? Will she speak? Will she be cross examined?

I seem to recall it mentioned that potential bullying might have been going on somewhere. I'm sure back at the time several members here expressed their experiences that bullying was, and is, absolutely rife in the NHS. I've always been of the opinion that she doesn't seem the type who'd handle that kind of thing well from the descriptions of her in the media.

I agree that this note coud very much convey what you are saying. If she mentions "police investigation" in it (I hadn't picked that up) then it suggests that it was written after the investigation started or was likely to start. Although, I agree that it's clearly been added to over time.

But, yes, it could point in either direction, to be honest.