UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, murder of babies, 7 Guilty of murder verdicts; 7 Guilty of attempted murder; 2 Not Guilty of attempted; 6 hung re attempted #34

[cottonweaver]

whistle-blowing student nurse in the news this week. Preston Crown Court trial opened Weds but doubt there's a thread on it.
Well done to that student nurse.

https://www.nursingtimes.net/news/hospital/nurse-on-trial-for-mistreating-and-drugging-stroke-patients-07-09-2023/

 

[Noseyjosie]

whistle-blowing student nurse in the news this week. Preston Crown Court trial opened Weds but doubt there's a thread on it.
Well done to that student nurse.

https://www.nursingtimes.net/news/hospital/nurse-on-trial-for-mistreating-and-drugging-stroke-patients-07-09-2023/

OMG What a nasty pair of b's. So much for the "caring profession"

 

[cottonweaver]

OMG What a nasty pair of b's. So much for the "caring profession"

IDK what the solution is.
Has to be a combo, I suppose. ( Nurses themselves will know better. I don't normally read the Health/NHS section of the newspaper)

we already have a shortage of nurses

? Better pay & conditions, root out the dregs & improved vetting, closer supervision and better management, ensure they can't just move onto other trusts or agencies, publicise whistle-blowing campaigns to force faster change?

 

[notsure]

OMG What a nasty pair of b's. So much for the "caring profession"

Unfortunately, this doesn't surprise me at all.

I've had bad treatment while on a hospital ward. The night shift nurses always seemed particularly ghoulish at the hospital where I was a patient. They treated the ward as their own personal gossip space and treated the patients as a nuisance. Nothing caring in their behaviour whatsoever.

When my elderly mother was in hospital towards the end of her life, she pressed the buzzer for a nurse to help her to the toilet. She said the nurse was very impatient with her, refused to take her to the toilet, and instead forced her to go on a bedpan, resulting in bruising to my mum's back. The nurse objected to being disturbed while she was chatting with her lazy colleagues. If I could get my hands on that evil "nurse," I swear I would wring her neck.

 

[notsure]

IDK what the solution is.
Has to be a combo, I suppose. ( Nurses themselves will know better. I don't normally read the Health/NHS section of the newspaper)

we already have a shortage of nurses

? Better pay & conditions, root out the dregs & improved vetting, closer supervision and better management, ensure they can't just move onto other trusts or agencies, publicise whistle-blowing campaigns to force faster change?

Cameras at each bedside, recording everything. I know it won't necessarily prevent nurses over-sedating patients, but at least they know they're being watched.

 

[LadyL]

Wish granted!

"While she awaits her sentencing hearing on Monday, Operation Hummingbird remains active with the force recently recruiting more detectives to join the team.
"I'm sure the public would expect us to look at the entire footprint of Lucy Letby's career," said Det Supt Hughes.
This includes admissions on to the neonatal unit at the Liverpool Women's Hospital while Letby was on placement there.
The families of babies who are a part of this investigation have been informed.
"From 2012 through to 2016, there were more than 4,000 admissions of babies into the neonatal units of both hospitals for us to work through," said Det Supt Hughes.
"This does not mean we are investigating all 4,000.
"It just means that we are committed to a thorough review of every admission from a medical perspective, to ensure that nothing is missed throughout the entirety of her employment as a nurse.
"Only those cases highlighted as concerning medically will be investigated further.
"We want to be confident that when we get to the end of Operation Hummingbird and say we have identified every offence if there are more."

Lucy Letby: Investigating UK's most prolific child serial killer

Detectives who closed the net around Lucy Letby tell of their dealings with the "emotionless" killer.

www.bbc.co.uk

tysm!

thankful to them

 

[Trebor5591]

Cameras at each bedside, recording everything. I know it won't necessarily prevent nurses over-sedating patients, but at least they know they're being watched.

That would violate the privacy of the patients and create a storage nightmare, IMO.

 

[notsure]

That would violate the privacy of the patients and create a storage nightmare, IMO.

There is little privacy on a hospital ward, and the increased sense of security would outweigh any other considerations, IMO.

 

[Parker Knoll]

I totally agree. There must be accountability and if that’s cctv then so be it.

 

[Davieson]

Installation of cameras would have enormous resource implications, which would need to be met out of already overstretched health budgets , resulting in even less money going into treating patients.
Sounds like using a sledgehammer to crack a nut to me.

 

[notsure]

Body cameras are being used more and more by health care workers, police, and even retail workers to protect them from attacks. Something like this could be used during any interaction with patients to protect both parties.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Body cameras are being used more and more by health care workers, police, and even retail workers to protect them from attacks. Something like this could be used during any interaction with patients to protect both parties.

I have a theory about body cameras and guarantee it will come true.

Employers, employees, and members of the public will start wearing body cameras that record continually and stream data to a cloud.

In the future, an employer will be able to access your video stream to review it and they'll also be able to log onto it to see exactly what you're doing from the POV of your own camera. (in the same way as in call centres they can listen into your call).

Next up monitoring will be done by checking where you are and what you're doing from your own body camera. There will be other aspects to this. People are effectively already doing this when they do 'walkabouts' and livestream their interactions onto youtube but it's going to be the next generation of tech media. Watching things through other people's eyes. We've already seen various types of this exist already - a chef in a big kitchen streamed his work shift by a camera fixed to his forehead. People put cameras on their pets collars and upload their daily activities for entertainment.

This will be the future of work / security / safety.

 

[mrC]

what i cant understand is that there were 17 deaths at that unit when she was but she was only charged with 7 deaths what about the other 10

 

[Dotta]

Good healtcare depends pimarily on human factor.
All disturbing behaviours, any deviations must NOT be ignored.
Alarming signals must be checked immediately.
Supervision and monitoring staff should be priority.

JmO

 

[PoirotPink]

Cameras at each bedside, recording everything. I know it won't necessarily prevent nurses over-sedating patients, but at least they know they're being watched.

That would violate the privacy of the patients and create a storage nightmare, IMO.

There is little privacy on a hospital ward, and the increased sense of security would outweigh any other considerations, IMO.

There would need to be strict safeguards about who could access / view recordings, perhaps no-one is authorised to view unless there's a complaint and patients could request their own footage and deletion from the system when they leave. Patients could also be given a choice as to whether or not they want to turn off recording at any time of their choosing, with a passcode that is functional until they leave or are moved (recording would restart when a new patient is admitted, with a reset). Designed in such a way that staff would not be aware whether it's recording or not. This could all be incorporated into a digital patient data recording system, instead of those clip-board notes they have at the end of the bed.

I value privacy, I would never install a smart camera in my home etc. However, I would not be opposed to video surveillance (with appropriate safeguards and security) in hospitals because patients are often in a vulnerable condition. For staff, the knowledge that you may be under surveillance is in itself a deterrent and would also give the patient / their families peace of mind. It might actually improve the service, because I've witnessed lots of lax care from nurses when visiting relatives in hospital. Doing the rounds would mean actually doing their jobs rather than just clocking in and "getting a time stamp" on the patient's clipboard.

The only risk is that once organisations, like the NHS, start collecting data, the purpose of collecting that data is often forgotten over time. When a certain party gets into power, cough, and they find they have all this video surveillance footage that could be monetised and sold to the lowest bidder...

 

[Davieson]

Any surveillance would need to apply to private hospitals as well and of course care homes. Perhaps more so for the latter as there seems to many cases of abuse of the elderly in these places.
Not sure patients/customers would want to pay for this in addition to paying for their care.

 

[Parker Knoll]

They should of been installed years ago before this sorry mess and maybe it would of been avoided. The figures mentioned by the time all the civil and negligence claims are resolved are estimated to be in the region of 60m. That’s a LOT of cameras and systems that could of been put in place.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

what i cant understand is that there were 17 deaths at that unit when she was but she was only charged with 7 deaths what about the other 10

As I understand it, they brought to court the deaths where there was enough circumstantial evidence as well as technical proof and staff and parents accounts to show that LL caused the deaths intentionally.

I think that is because the NHS, LE, Crown Prosecution and the state wanted to ensure conviction. Now we know beyond reasonable doubt that LL intentionally killed and injured babies, then other cases can be viewed through that lens and it may be that more cases will be charged against her.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Good healtcare depends pimarily on human factor.
All disturbing behaviours, any deviations must NOT be ignored.
Alarming signals must be checked immediately.
Supervision and monitoring staff should be priority.

JmO

I was severely injured in a Central London NHS hospital last year in a procedure that should not have been attempted (it was literally unlawful) and perpetrated by someone who had no experience regardless. I assume the whole thing was some attempt at cost cutting surgical costs back to the bare bones and treading the line of coercing a patient into agreeing something that they (the NHS) know damn well is not quite legal and certainly isn't ethical and then when it all goes wrong saying 'you consented'. Now I am disabled and waiting for a huge surgery, I cannot find a solicitor to take the case thus far as it isn't cut and dried like they chopped the wrong leg off or something (which by the way they do all the time these 'never events'). Also it's my word against their's and the surgeon who acted alone is lying about it to cover up. So, basically I'm screwed.

I believe all surgery rooms must be covered by CCTV and so must all wards, most especially children / babies and vulnerable elders or mentally vulnerable people. There's some very sick people out there who so happened to have trained as doctors or who hold nursing qualifications.

 

[cottonweaver]

ITV interview with Karen Rees, have only just seen it . Apparently this was her only sit-down interview. The fuller interview is at the ITV link but the sound wasn't great for me.

https://www.itv.com/news/granada/2023-08-22/ex-nursing-boss-wasnt-given-enough-information-to-remove-lucy-letby

IDUnderstand how someone of this calibre makes it to her position ( Head of Nursing at the Countess of Chester Hospital's urgent care division )
She also claims that LL was expressing devastation on a weekly basis over the 2 years since she was removed from the NNU. KR viewed the emotions as an indication of innocence. ( also implies that KR was in contact with LL weekly throughout)
KR is going to have a tough time at the Inquiry