CS2C
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I think what they recovered from her home and her devices was the most interesting aspect for me.
UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, murder of babies, 7 Guilty of murder verdicts; 8 Guilty of attempted murder; 2 Not Guilty of attempted; 5 hung re attempted #35
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Parker Knoll
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Good question !
So many sweep but yes I agree the evidence from her house and garage would be my answer on this.
So many sweep but yes I agree the evidence from her house and garage would be my answer on this.
Parker Knoll
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Yawn …. Here we go again.
www.independent.co.uk
Child serial killer Lucy Letby to bring further conviction appeal bid next month
Judges will consider the case at a hearing on October 24, according to court listings.
www.independent.co.uk
Tortoise
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The most interesting part of her trial for me was her demonstration of how a psychopath/sociopath operates right under the noses of the people who will decide her fate.
She should be being studied by esteemed psychologists for her giveaways, but I am afraid they are just the same old same old tired and frankly boring and uninformed TV personalities doing the rounds, parroting that she is just ordinary and appears to have had an ordinary beige life. I mean for goodness sake, her police interviews and her testimony was gold, and it's absolutely no wonder to me that she lived in a beige house with teddies on her bed, and not a sewer or a dungeon with pictures of Hannibal Lecter on her walls. She put on a nurse's uniform every day - there is no higher level of deceit than that. They need to be able to look past the 'show' and pull out all the tells for those who would want to learn something from this most heinous rampage of terror. They weren't bothered to get themselves into a hotel, and park their bottoms in court every day for just a few weeks of her testimony, content instead to rely on the journos to give them a few soundbites, journos who are trained to be balanced and non-inflammatory so as to not prejudice a trial.
How Letby operates is how psychopaths/sociopaths manipulate people into refusing to "think the unthinkable", even when babies are dying and natural causes can't be found.
However, what I wanted to say was that she did not fool the jury who studied her. That is not to say that it made their task any easier, for although they decided unequivocally that she was lying, they then had the difficult task of having to discern whether they could convict her across the board merely on the basis that they could disregard her testimony.
I would suggest that part of deciding that Letby was deceptive, apart from the more obvious instances of her dubious narratives such as wearing pyjamas and saying she didn't have a shredder, was that she did not comport herself in court in the way of an innocent person being accused of a litany of murders of babies. Would an innocent person feel quietly sad, and view cross-examination as a sort of game of pitting of intellects, or would they be a tad or even mightily angry that they were being falsely accused of all manner of outrageous acts and had lost everything they worked for? The jury might just have assimilated that she believed, and was very well-practiced at, being smart or clever with her replies, verbalising strings of nonsense, or that sometimes even just her superior demeanor alone if she couldn't recall anything, was sufficient to get her out of any situation, and she would be acquitted because she was superior to those she was always fooling. She thinks like the person she was, an arrogant, 'successful', omnipotent serial-killer, who had everyone blindsided. I dare say she worked to hide her anger, for she did have some in her personal notes, because she thought it would be used in court to show she was an out of control enraged killer. Secondly, there is more arrogance on display to think people will just accept her defence of a massive conspiracy of reputable medics, parents, extending to police, experts and the CPS.
Letby would have done well to follow Ben Myers KC's lead. He displayed the levels of outrage on her behalf in his speeches that at times made me think might confuse the jury into thinking it was her emotion. But it needed to come from her, and I think she had already planned ahead of her trial to do what she is a master at. Cool and calculated deception.
As an aside, for anyone interested there was a recent televised trial in America (Law & Crime Youtube channel), where Robert Telles, a businessman/public official, was convicted of the murder of an investigative journalist. He also took the witness stand and the similarities with Letby (IMO) are just jaw-dropping. He sobbed like Letby did when they showed photos of the mess police left in his house after conducting their search, he was calm and cocky with his replies to the prosecutor on the stand, his defence was based on a conspiracy against him as large as Letby's and also involving the DNA lab planting his DNA under the fingernails of his victim and elsewhere, and planting photos on his phone. But there were many other tells in his demeanour, just like Letby. He also said 'I'm not the type of person who would murder', just like Letby said 'I'm not the sort of person that kills babies', and was having an extramarital affair with a co-worker at the time he murdered. I don't know which one wrote the playbook. The Behavior Panel (also on YT) has also done a video on him, and I think there must be very many similarities in personalities between Telles and Letby, from a behavioural analysis point of view, even though he only committed one murder.
MOO
She should be being studied by esteemed psychologists for her giveaways, but I am afraid they are just the same old same old tired and frankly boring and uninformed TV personalities doing the rounds, parroting that she is just ordinary and appears to have had an ordinary beige life. I mean for goodness sake, her police interviews and her testimony was gold, and it's absolutely no wonder to me that she lived in a beige house with teddies on her bed, and not a sewer or a dungeon with pictures of Hannibal Lecter on her walls. She put on a nurse's uniform every day - there is no higher level of deceit than that. They need to be able to look past the 'show' and pull out all the tells for those who would want to learn something from this most heinous rampage of terror. They weren't bothered to get themselves into a hotel, and park their bottoms in court every day for just a few weeks of her testimony, content instead to rely on the journos to give them a few soundbites, journos who are trained to be balanced and non-inflammatory so as to not prejudice a trial.
How Letby operates is how psychopaths/sociopaths manipulate people into refusing to "think the unthinkable", even when babies are dying and natural causes can't be found.
However, what I wanted to say was that she did not fool the jury who studied her. That is not to say that it made their task any easier, for although they decided unequivocally that she was lying, they then had the difficult task of having to discern whether they could convict her across the board merely on the basis that they could disregard her testimony.
I would suggest that part of deciding that Letby was deceptive, apart from the more obvious instances of her dubious narratives such as wearing pyjamas and saying she didn't have a shredder, was that she did not comport herself in court in the way of an innocent person being accused of a litany of murders of babies. Would an innocent person feel quietly sad, and view cross-examination as a sort of game of pitting of intellects, or would they be a tad or even mightily angry that they were being falsely accused of all manner of outrageous acts and had lost everything they worked for? The jury might just have assimilated that she believed, and was very well-practiced at, being smart or clever with her replies, verbalising strings of nonsense, or that sometimes even just her superior demeanor alone if she couldn't recall anything, was sufficient to get her out of any situation, and she would be acquitted because she was superior to those she was always fooling. She thinks like the person she was, an arrogant, 'successful', omnipotent serial-killer, who had everyone blindsided. I dare say she worked to hide her anger, for she did have some in her personal notes, because she thought it would be used in court to show she was an out of control enraged killer. Secondly, there is more arrogance on display to think people will just accept her defence of a massive conspiracy of reputable medics, parents, extending to police, experts and the CPS.
Letby would have done well to follow Ben Myers KC's lead. He displayed the levels of outrage on her behalf in his speeches that at times made me think might confuse the jury into thinking it was her emotion. But it needed to come from her, and I think she had already planned ahead of her trial to do what she is a master at. Cool and calculated deception.
As an aside, for anyone interested there was a recent televised trial in America (Law & Crime Youtube channel), where Robert Telles, a businessman/public official, was convicted of the murder of an investigative journalist. He also took the witness stand and the similarities with Letby (IMO) are just jaw-dropping. He sobbed like Letby did when they showed photos of the mess police left in his house after conducting their search, he was calm and cocky with his replies to the prosecutor on the stand, his defence was based on a conspiracy against him as large as Letby's and also involving the DNA lab planting his DNA under the fingernails of his victim and elsewhere, and planting photos on his phone. But there were many other tells in his demeanour, just like Letby. He also said 'I'm not the type of person who would murder', just like Letby said 'I'm not the sort of person that kills babies', and was having an extramarital affair with a co-worker at the time he murdered. I don't know which one wrote the playbook. The Behavior Panel (also on YT) has also done a video on him, and I think there must be very many similarities in personalities between Telles and Letby, from a behavioural analysis point of view, even though he only committed one murder.
MOO
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CS2C
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More tax payers money on this utter GHOUL.Yawn …. Here we go again.
Child serial killer Lucy Letby to bring further conviction appeal bid next month
Judges will consider the case at a hearing on October 24, according to court listings.
Sweeper2000
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Any reasons why? I'm assuming your not talking about the commode. We talked about the commode over about three threads
@Tortoise
"Would an innocent person feel quietly sad, and view cross-examination as a sort of game of pitting of intellects, or would they be a tad or even mightily angry that they were being falsely accused of all manner of outrageous acts and had lost everything they worked for?"
I agree with this so much, there is stoic and then there is still she was the latter and we didn't see anything over repeated and numerous statements from kc Johnson. Not a hint of anything. There's thoughts behind the face imo.
Parker Knoll
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It brought forth so much “ information “ about her and the case I think my answer would be.
With all the evidence collected for the case at her home aside it was probably the most enlightening look into who she actually was.
The babyish bedroom and the bland furnishings, the spare bedroom still decorated as a nursery and the motivational quotes on the walls were at complete odds as to what lurked under the beige veneer that was actually Letby.
With all the evidence collected for the case at her home aside it was probably the most enlightening look into who she actually was.
The babyish bedroom and the bland furnishings, the spare bedroom still decorated as a nursery and the motivational quotes on the walls were at complete odds as to what lurked under the beige veneer that was actually Letby.
DianaWW
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So she has another appeal hearing on 24th October for baby K.
katydid23
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And I still can't get over the fact that her bedroom windows looked out on the babies graves in the children's cemetery.
I know, I know, her neighbours all looked over that cemetery too. But it still niggles at me. I think the neighbours may have shrugged and accepted the price cut from overlooking a cemetery---whil LL probably saw it as an added bonus, IMO.
AlphaJDelta
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Because we have no definitive reason for why she committed her crimes and we may never truly be given one, the discussion has instead been moved to doubting that her trial was conducted properly. Like picking a scab. Frankly it's insulting to the victims that people on social media are entertaining the idea she is innocent. The jury were exposed to the evidence for 10 months, and took over three weeks of deliberations to render a verdict. Not to mention the clear evidence against her which we are all widely aware of. Guilty. Justice was served.
Tortoise
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I would be really interested to hear from anyone who knew her during her formative years. Teachers and playmates. And see her school reports, her stories and art work. I'm not so much interested in the friends who knew her as a teen/young adult, because she was well into deception and gaslighting by that age, IMO.
Tortoise
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Tut tut!. Sarah Knapton must have been napping during LL's testimony.
"The Telegraph has seen a risk register report from the Countess of Chester which shows that between March 2015 and until at least June 2016, the blood gas analyser was faulty. [...]
The jury at Letby’s trial was not told about faulty equipment."
www.telegraph.co.uk
The jury was told by Letby herself -
12:04pm
Mr Myers asks about blood gas tests for babies.
A blood gas test result for Child Q is shown to the court.
Lucy Letby explains the process on how a blood gas test is obtained, causing a prick on to the heel and getting the blood sample into "a very small tube". A second member of staff would run the sample through a machine outside of the nursery rooms, to obtain the result.
"It would usually be a different member of staff" as the first nurse would stay with the baby to check the bleeding stops.
The blood gas machine would be "down the corridor from room 1". Occasionally, if the machine was broken, an alternative machine on the labour ward would be used.
www.chesterstandard.co.uk
"The Telegraph has seen a risk register report from the Countess of Chester which shows that between March 2015 and until at least June 2016, the blood gas analyser was faulty. [...]
The jury at Letby’s trial was not told about faulty equipment."
Critical baby monitor at Lucy Letby hospital was broken during infant death spike
The Telegraph has seen a risk register report from Countess of Chester which shows a blood gas analyser was faulty between 2015 and 2016
www.telegraph.co.uk
The jury was told by Letby herself -
12:04pm
Mr Myers asks about blood gas tests for babies.
A blood gas test result for Child Q is shown to the court.
Lucy Letby explains the process on how a blood gas test is obtained, causing a prick on to the heel and getting the blood sample into "a very small tube". A second member of staff would run the sample through a machine outside of the nursery rooms, to obtain the result.
"It would usually be a different member of staff" as the first nurse would stay with the baby to check the bleeding stops.
The blood gas machine would be "down the corridor from room 1". Occasionally, if the machine was broken, an alternative machine on the labour ward would be used.
Recap: Lucy Letby trial, Tuesday, May 2 - defence begins
The trial of Lucy Letby, who denies murdering seven babies at the Countess of Chester Hospital neonatal unit and attempting to murder 10 more, is…
katydid23
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I can't find it now---I'll keep looking----but I do remember reading a mainstream news article with an interview from a childhood friend, talking about Lucy in early years---like elementary school age. And this friend described Lucy as being very interested in her health, and that she carried around a little notebook where she kept notes about health concerns and symptoms, etc. And she had first aid stuff in her book bag, just in case? Does anyone else remember that?
It also talked about her mom being a hypochondriac. IIRC
ETA:This is not the same article, but something similar:
A friend who knew her since secondary school told the BBC, "She'd had a difficult birth herself, and she was very grateful for being alive to the nurses who would have helped save her life".
Lucy Letby - Wikipedia
Sweeper2000
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I do. Think this is it. Doesn't have te bit about her carrying first aid kits and stuff though.
"She was part of a group of girls, many of whom were interested in a career in nursing,' one said. 'I remember going to a careers day with Lucy and some of the others where jobs in the health and social care sector were being bandied around.'"
"When Letby's friends circulated a post on social media inviting people to tag each other as characters from a spoof Mr Men and Little Miss series, they named her 'The Innocent One'"
www.dailymail.co.uk
"She was part of a group of girls, many of whom were interested in a career in nursing,' one said. 'I remember going to a careers day with Lucy and some of the others where jobs in the health and social care sector were being bandied around.'"
"When Letby's friends circulated a post on social media inviting people to tag each other as characters from a spoof Mr Men and Little Miss series, they named her 'The Innocent One'"
Lucy Letby: Church-goer dubbed 'The Innocent One' by friends
With toys in her bedroom, doting parents and the nickname from friends 'The Innocent One', no one could have thought Lucy Letby was Britain's worst ever serial killer.
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Could that possibly have been sarcasm? Maybe when several of them got up to mischief, the teachers never believed Lucy could have been part of it.
CS2C
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Ahh thank you Tortoise!
MamsBestGirl
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Any chance this can be uploaded as a podcast Jon? I feel a few days intense dog walks (in the rain) coming on
Thank you for all your work in spreading the truth, among the nonsense. You’re my no1 YouTuber
Thank you for all your work in spreading the truth, among the nonsense. You’re my no1 YouTuber
CS2C
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I am going to look at that being a possibility because I also have the cross examination which totals 15 hours but Youtube's limit is 12 which is incredibly annoying. I will let you know. Thank you for the kind compliment.
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