Found Deceased UK - Sarah Everard, 33, London - Clapham Common area, 3 March 2021 *Arrests* #14

[thoughts101]

New user, and shaken by this matter. I have myself walked that route alone at night.

Two comments:

1. I had not appreciated the location of the vehicle which was seen on the CCTV as being located at the corner of A205/Rodenhurst. Ms Mini Sleuth on page 10 of this thread posted a crime scene video.

This is quite a location with few witnesses on either side of the road. If the alleged, and as allegedly seen on CCTV, had chosen this spot to intercept SE, this must surely go to premeditation rather than some accident along the road, or otherwise.

2. Recent conversation on this thread has assumed that the road back to Kent is straight on with the A205 East. However, if the alleged had wanted to avoid detection, turning right would seem like the best thing to do. I believe that a perpetrator would take side streets and keep off main routes where possible.

I remember that the initial investigation also included sites at Tooting Bec so in my opinion the alleged drove this way and police were looking for evidence of car stops or discarded items, en route out of London.

All my own honest opinion.

 

[GlitteryFluff]

New here. Apologies if I do anything wrong! Thinking back to the still from the cctv showing the white car where we’re discussing the passengers position - the driver looks to have long hair or is that my eyes? Looks to either be holding the seatbelt with one hand and facing towards passenger or possibly hand resting on chin, looking out the window to their right? But whichever way I look at it I see shoulder length hair? Though I haven’t watched the moving clip because I cannot get along with that website at all!

 

[Delboy]

New here. Apologies if I do anything wrong! Thinking back to the still from the cctv showing the white car where we’re discussing the passengers position - the driver looks to have long hair or is that my eyes? Looks to either be holding the seatbelt with one hand and facing forwards or possibly hand resting on chin, looking out the window to their right? But whichever way I look at it I see shoulder length hair? Though I haven’t watched the moving clip because I cannot get along with that website at all!

JMO - The only certain thing about the footage is that there appears to be several minutes missing (the important minutes).

 

[Commoner]

I don't know London that well but is Tooting Bec Common a place you could go to do something and not be noticed at night?

Yes, quite a lot of it. But set against that:

a) lack of reports of police searching the area. And as they'd tracked the car out of London (maybe slower time via ANPR and other traffic cams along the route) they'd know if the car had been there. And I can't believe LE would have omitted to search if they thought there was time missing from the car movements in its vicinity

b) it's really boggy when it's wet (as it was that night, coming on the back of a lot of earlier rain and ground already saturated) and if familiar enough with the area, and IMO you'd know how bad it is underfoot - would put off others from being there but also that you'd be bound to end up with mud on you that could tie you to the place. If anticipating time for clean up, then I suppose that might matter less.

 

[OrlandoJames]

I don't know London that well but is Tooting Bec Common a place you could go to do something and not be noticed at night?

Yes it is.

 

[asyousay]

So I have a question


If the police in Sandwich are looking for specific items why have they not asked the public for help?


People out on walks are more likely to spot something if they know what to look for.

 

[Blanche]

So, the incredibly inappropriate “meme” that the officer guarding the body discovery site sent has been revealed by the Daily Mail. I’ve attached it below.

<modsnip: MSM has removed the referenced image>

Cop at Sarah Everard crime scene sent vile parody of Highway Code to seven officers | Daily Mail Online

what the hell was he thinking !

 

[Mandalas]

That meme. Just awful. I'm struggling with the fact that the probationer felt as though he had latitude to send it. It's worrying that that he did so, and that he was comfortable thinking that fellow officers would find it acceptable. The holes in the screening process for new recruits need to be closed, quickly.

The fact that this could happen in this way speaks volumes about the organisational culture doesn't it....

 

[Mandalas]

Correct, this is not an Astra for 2 reason. White door mirrors on all models except the "Griffin" model which has a black roof. Checked Vauxhall website and Autotrader for all Astra's up to 3 years old to confirm this. Some new "Elite" models just out have black door mirrors (unlikely to be hire car spec) but see 2nd reason:

2nd reason the photo shows indicator lights on the door mirrors - Astra's don't have them on the door mirror, they are on the front wing behind the wheel instead.



The second white car is a Nissan Juke - easily spotted by the 6 lights. 1st car is too blurry to identify.

Fantastic sleuthing, so we can put that one to bed now.

 

[asyousay]

what the hell was he thinking !

Yep as I have the image on my phone as I screen grabbed it before bed and I just looked at it and it’s so specific that I can understand completely why her family had to be informed about the tasteless meme as it would be upsetting to her friends and family if it leaked out which it did.


You can also see where he has altered the original image to write his own words in his 6 Steps guide.

 

[Missylou]

Interesting - did you screenshot it? I guess not - but if you remember finding something you probably did - the detail could have been removed if it was needed for court possibly? MOO.

I think a few threads back there was a lot of discussion about the possibility of Poynders or some other midweek "pad" and can't remember what came of that.

But now I personally am thinking it seems quite logical (now we know he finished at 7am that morning) and a room or apartment was searched at Poynders (need the link for that again) and the car was at Poynders and there's a car park round the back. That the alleged perpetrator could have ben there all day. What seems strange is the time of night when the kidnap took place in that case. Unless he was going to be staying there for another night but then when there was a body to deal with, decided to travel back to Kent.

I guess we'll have to wait till the trial for a lot of this. All speculation, MOO

 

[Armchair_Defective]

So I have a question


If the police in Sandwich are looking for specific items why have they not asked the public for help?


People out on walks are more likely to spot something if they know what to look for.

If it's something small like a phone they won't want 1000s of people traipsing all over the scene. It could be a potential 1st or 2nd assault site with potential forensics there.

 

[Missylou]

No, unfortunately I didn’t screenshot it and have regretted this. I’m 99.9% sure I got a match but I think it’s odd that the accused‘s name would now be removed from that database. It would be a matter of public record, so I can’t see what reason there would be to remove the name. And also, wouldn’t him living there (or using a flat there from time to time when working unsociable shifts) prompt a more extensive search there?
If true, it does give rise to the fact he could have been living a different life away from the family home with much more freedoms and excuses not to be around.

 

[Urbanfox1]

I

I wonder if what they’re actually investigating is his version of events.

Perhaps he explained his reason for placing her in the car (if indeed he did) was because he’d accidentally hit her.

Maybe what they’re doing is gathering evidence to rule out his excuse?

This would presume he’s talking, which I’m not sure he is. But in Libby Squires case for example, PR admitted to having Libby in his car but gave an excuse as to why she was there. Maybe WC has tried to offer a legitimate reason for needing to assist Sarah into his.

JMO

think you might be on to something. Time will tell. Stay safe everyone. Thank you all so much for being here. I think this thread kept me sane with all the fear and sadness I seemed to be experiencing last week through projecting and a very strange sense of survivors guilt living a couple of miles away and regularly making similar walks or runs on or around south circular or A3 to “get my steps in”. She was just walking home and things need to change.

I’m not sure how much there will be to say now as is sub judice... we’ll see. I will see you here maybe at plea stage.

 

[Urbanfox1]

New user, and shaken by this matter. I have myself walked that route alone at night.

Two comments:

1. I had not appreciated the location of the vehicle which was seen on the CCTV as being located at the corner of A205/Rodenhurst. Ms Mini Sleuth on page 10 of this thread posted a crime scene video.

This is quite a location with few witnesses on either side of the road. If the alleged, and as allegedly seen on CCTV, had chosen this spot to intercept SE, this must surely go to premeditation rather than some accident along the road, or otherwise.

2. Recent conversation on this thread has assumed that the road back to Kent is straight on with the A205 East. However, if the alleged had wanted to avoid detection, turning right would seem like the best thing to do. I believe that a perpetrator would take side streets and keep off main routes where possible.

I remember that the initial investigation also included sites at Tooting Bec so in my opinion the alleged drove this way and police were looking for evidence of car stops or discarded items, en route out of London.

All my own honest opinion.

Just announced my departure BUT just to say, side streets in London so narrow, esp in that area you usually have to pull in to let cars go past or get stuck if you don’t. Still quite a lot of ubers about IMO so I think that would have transpired as vvvv risky as you get pretty up close to the other car when passing. JMO

 

[thoughts101]

Just announced my departure BUT just to say, side streets in London so narrow, esp in that area you usually have to pull in to let cars go past or get stuck if you don’t. Still quite a lot of ubers about IMO so I think that would have transpired as vvvv risky as you get pretty up close to the other car when passing. JMO

True that, but that might be why a perpetrator would attack late at night due to there being fewer cars on the road. A main road would undoubtedly be "worse" for cameras and other vehicles..

 

[arrogantcat]

So, the incredibly inappropriate “meme” that the officer guarding the body discovery site sent has been revealed by the Daily Mail. I’ve attached it below.

<modsnip: MSM has removed the referenced image>

Cop at Sarah Everard crime scene sent vile parody of Highway Code to seven officers | Daily Mail Online

Thank you mods for updating my post and removing the image - I just came back to do the same thing after seeing that the Mail had taken the full thing down.

 

[Joolz1975]

This is how I perceived the image and it looks normal to me.

Yeh me too, we have had this on other cases before people interpret images differently. I doubt any of the images that have been found from TFL cameras feature WC and Sarah. And if they do i am not sure putting them on a public website before a trial has occurred is a good idea anyway.

 

[mrjitty]

I wonder if what they’re actually investigating is his version of events.

This is an extremely astute observation.

This would presume he’s talking, which I’m not sure he is. But in Libby Squires case for example, PR admitted to having Libby in his car but gave an excuse as to why she was there.

We touched on this topic in the Libby discussions, but it is a safe bet under UK procedure he has said some things. Most likely in a written statement.

Just as a hypothetical example, let's say your car is tracked by CCTV cameras in a way that could harm your defence, but actually you were driving to the local McDonalds. You could elect to simply say nothing to explain that pre-trial. But under UK law reform about pre-trial statements, your reasons for being in the area might qualify as something that should have been reasonably disclosed.

So unlike the US, there are significant tactical reasons under UK procedure that might compel the accused to volunteer his movements pre-trial.

Failure to do so could lead to adverse comment from the judge.

The reason is that otherwise you can listen to the entire prosecution case, then announce you were going to McDonalds, but because it is months later, the Crown had no chance to check drive-thru CCTV etc

This is very common with alibi defences.

So I would guess you are correct. There is a good chance the accused has offered an account of his movements, such that he can rely upon that version at trial.

IIRC @Angleterre has significant expertise on this topic having conducted numerous pre-trial interviews.

02c, disclaimers etc

 

[Armchair_Defective]

Update on the Bromley Bones. It's not MSM so no link but it's from from 'Biggin Hill Councillors'

"" Police were called at 11:01hrs on Thursday, 11th March, to reports of bones found in a wooded area at the rear of a property in Main Road, Biggin Hill. Forensic specialists and specialist police search officers attended the scene. The area was extensively searched. Human bones were recovered from the undergrowth. A post mortem was held on 16th March and DNA testing is to take place. Early indications are that the bones may have been present in the wooded area for a number of years. It is believed that the bones belong to a male who was middle aged or older. It is possible that the male had health &/or mobility issues. Ethnicity cannot be determined at this stage. There are no indications of trauma. The investigation is being led by South Area BCU. The crime scene is now closed. This incident is not linked to the kidnap and murder of Sarah Everard.''