Upcoming Trial - 2012

[Allusonz]

Wondering if JY will be playing "rock paper scissors" to try and explain why he propped the door open?

Gracie Lee seems to have a limited vocabulary. She described JY as little taller than her. She described his hair as little. Confusion continues when the state doesn't clarify what she actually means and remind her of her exact words at the time that it mattered, a few days after the murder. It's up to them to bring out the testimony and then make sure it can be understood.

Wish the state would bring in an exact copy of the 11/2/06 USA Today and show the size of the sports scores print. Can those easily be read in the near dark?

I tavel frequently for my business and have found the hotels to be very well lit outside. Usually there are benches to sit upon etc. I am not quite understanding why it would be difficult to read a newspaper outside as I know i do it frequently even though I have a laptop at my disposal.

 

[gracielee]

I suppose you could contact the newspaper and let them know what you think about the information they included about the witness.

This forum is not a newspaper. When I joined this forum it was with the understanding that certain things would NOT be allowed. One of those things, IIRC, was the gratuitous smearing of witnesses. This witness is NOT on trial, nor is her previous life. She is simply a witness to a possible portion of a crime. ymmv I was put on a time-out last year for referring to scott peterson as snotty. And he's a convicted double murderer.

 

[Madeleine74]

I tavel frequently for my business and have found the hotels to be very well lit outside. Usually there are benches to sit upon etc. I am not quite understanding why it would be difficult to read a newspaper outside as I know i do it frequently even though I have a laptop at my disposal.

Do you stay at Hampton Inns? Do you go out the back or side door towards the parking lot? Do you use a day old newspaper to get your 'updated' sports scores or would you expect to either get them on ESPN or on the web?

Pictures have been posted of this particular Hampton Inn and the door that JY specifically used. There is no bench. There is nothing to sit on other than the ground. As for lighting, I have no idea what exists there. There were no video cameras covering that outside area.

JY didn't say he went and sat on a bench somewhere. He said he went outside to smoke a cigar and read sports scores. He went out a specific door in which he appears on videotape moving towards. He had a newspaper that did not have current scores. He had no cigar cutter and no lighter. He was a known anti-smoker who was vocal about not smoking (except on this night of course).

It was 32 degrees outside, 15mph winds. He said he used a 'twig' to prop open the heavy metal door at midnight. A rock was found propping the door open at 5:50am. That door led to the parking lot where he parked his SUV. It was on the side of the hotel, not near the front.

The dark sweater he was wearing, as seen in the video, was never found. The shoes he was wearing were never found. The leather gloves he was carrying were also never found. It was a November trip. His luggage was found with nothing but shorts and Tshirts. No underwear.

 

[otto]

This forum is not a newspaper. When I joined this forum it was with the understanding that certain things would NOT be allowed. One of those things, IIRC, was the gratuitous smearing of witnesses. This witness is NOT on trial, nor is her previous life. She is simply a witness to a possible portion of a crime. ymmv I was put on a time-out last year for referring to scott peterson as snotty. And he's a convicted double murderer.

It seems to me that when discussing the validity of a witness in a trial, it's important to recognize all factors that may compromise the integrity of the testimony. In the case of the gas attendant, there are relevant factors that were raised in court during trial. They are still relevant today.

 

[otto]

I tavel frequently for my business and have found the hotels to be very well lit outside. Usually there are benches to sit upon etc. I am not quite understanding why it would be difficult to read a newspaper outside as I know i do it frequently even though I have a laptop at my disposal.

The below photo, without the people and measurements, has been presented by Just the Facts as the actual photo of the exit that Jason used. There is a light above the door, out of the wind, and there must be adequate lighting in the parking area and outside the hotel for safety reasons. It is perfect for reading the paper.

 

[Allusonz]

Do you stay at Hampton Inns? Do you go out the back or side door towards the parking lot? Do you use a day old newspaper to get your 'updated' sports scores or would you expect to either get them on ESPN or on the web?

Pictures have been posted of this particular Hampton Inn and the door that JY specifically used. There is no bench. There is nothing to sit on other than the ground. As for lighting, I have no idea what exists there. There were no video cameras covering that outside area.

JY didn't say he went and sat on a bench somewhere. He said he went outside to smoke a cigar and read sports scores. He went out a specific door in which he appears on videotape moving towards. He had a newspaper that did not have current scores. He had no cigar cutter and no lighter. He was a known anti-smoker who was vocal about not smoking (except on this night of course).

It was 32 degrees outside, 15mph winds. He said he used a 'twig' to prop open the heavy metal door at midnight. A rock was found propping the door open at 5:50am. That door led to the parking lot where he parked his SUV. It was on the side of the hotel, not near the front.

The dark sweater he was wearing, as seen in the video, was never found. The shoes he was wearing were never found. The leather gloves he was carrying were also never found.

Actually I have stayed at them though they are not normally my first choice.

More often than not the papers are not up-to-date. It does give me a breather from my laptop as well as the local news etc.

I have seen the so called rocks which I will refer to as landscaping pebbles which would normally not even hold doors of that weight open as they must adhere to fire standards. I know I have tried.

It though becomes mute considering he was seen later closer to midnight at the front desk

 

[otto]

Do you stay at Hampton Inns? Do you go out the back or side door towards the parking lot? Do you use a day old newspaper to get your 'updated' sports scores or would you expect to either get them on ESPN or on the web?

Pictures have been posted of this particular Hampton Inn and the door that JY specifically used. There is no bench. There is nothing to sit on other than the ground. As for lighting, I have no idea what exists there. There were no video cameras covering that outside area.

JY didn't say he went and sat on a bench somewhere. He said he went outside to smoke a cigar and read sports scores. He went out a specific door in which he appears on videotape moving towards. He had a newspaper that did not have current scores. He had no cigar cutter and no lighter. He was a known anti-smoker who was vocal about not smoking (except on this night of course).

It was 32 degrees outside, 15mph winds. He said he used a 'twig' to prop open the heavy metal door at midnight. A rock was found propping the door open at 5:50am. That door led to the parking lot where he parked his SUV. It was on the side of the hotel, not near the front.

The dark sweater he was wearing, as seen in the video, was never found. The shoes he was wearing were never found. The leather gloves he was carrying were also never found. It was a November trip. His luggage was found with nothing but shorts and Tshirts. No underwear.

It's hard to say whether there is a bench near that exit or not.

I still find nothing unusual with someone checking the newspaper at midnight ... even if they own a computer, a radio and a television.

Was he vocal about not smoking or are you basing the belief that he was a "known anti-smoker" on the fact that he stipulated that he did not want the victim's sister smoking around his daughter?

I think the door was found propped open either between 3:30 and 4 or 4 and 5, depending on which part of the night clerk's testimony you go with. The rock was kicked away at a different time than when the camera was plugged in.

He may have changed clothes when he first arrived at his parent's home. When did police finally get a warrant to search for Jason's clothes at his parent's home?

 

[gracielee]

It seems to me that when discussing the validity of a witness in a trial, it's important to recognize all factors that may compromise the integrity of the testimony. In the case of the gas attendant, there are relevant factors that were raised in court during trial. They are still relevant today.

Like I said, check your TOS when it comes to witnesse in a trial. I don't recall any testimony as to this witnesses history.

 

[Allusonz]

The below photo, without the people and measurements, has been presented by Just the Facts as the actual photo of the exit that Jason used. There is a light above the door, out of the wind, and there must be adequate lighting in the parking area and outside the hotel for safety reasons. It is perfect for reading the paper.

Thanks Otto.

This appears to be a fairly accurate representation of the distance the door would swing open.

It would not require a contortionist and a stick/twig would be more apt to hold those heavy doors open than a random landscaping pebble.

 

[otto]

Like I said, check your TOS when it comes to witnesse in a trial. I don't recall any testimony as to this witnesses history.

Just the Facts discusses the aspects of this witness that you object to here:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-139667.html

 

[otto]

Thanks Otto.

This appears to be a fairly accurate representation of the distance the door would swing open.

It would not require a contortionist and a stick/twig would be more apt to hold those heavy doors open than a random landscaping pebble.

Absolutely ... it makes more sense to open the door, grab a stick, put it in the door, do whatever and then go back in. I also agree that a small, red, decorative, porous rock would not be my first choice.

 

[Madeleine74]

A landscaping 'pebble' as you call it, is exactly what was found propping the door open, so not only was and is it possible, that's what in fact was used to keep that particular door open.

Again, do you use a day old newspaper to look at updated sports scores? JY wasn't just "reading the newspaper," he specifically said he took it outside to "look at sports scores." It's in testimony!

That paper never made it back to his room...it was found in the back trunk of his SUV, intact, not wrinkled, no sections separated. The newest USA Today paper...the one distributed to hotel guests around 4am was not found in his vehicle. He kept the older newspaper, but not the newest edition. Strange, that.

 

[Madeleine74]

Thanks Otto.

This appears to be a fairly accurate representation of the distance the door would swing open.

It would not require a contortionist and a stick/twig would be more apt to hold those heavy doors open than a random landscaping pebble.

1. 3 ft is otto's guess at the width of that door.
2. The angle of the door opening is also otto's guess.
3. The measurement between the door opening and the nearest shrub is also a guess.

 

[tarheel8600]

Very eloquent, very succinct and very true, tarheel. I heartily and completely agree with all of it. Your posting is really about all that needs to be said. Thank you! ..

Thank you, Borndem. I appreciate that.

This case seems so staight forward to me. I cannot see JY as anything but guilty.

It is true that not all adulterers commit murder; however, most men who murder their wives have also committed adultery.

It has been said that the security camera didn't show JY unplugging it or shoving it up; however, the security camera didn't show anyone unplugging it or shoving it up. That leaves the question, who was staying in the HI on Nov. 2, 2006 who needed the security camera unplugged at 11:20 pm and shoved up towards the ceiling at 6:35am the next morning?

Why was JY's shirt that he was seen wearing on the security camera at the front desk at midnight not in his luggage or in his vehicle the next evening? Clothing does not just disappear without a reason, and I cannot think of a logical reason for the shirt to be missing other than he threw it away.

How did a pair of Hush Puppy shoes with a unique sole just happen to be found in blood at the crime scene? A pair of HP with a unique sole that JY just happened to have owned.

Why would a man staying at the HI on the 4th floor leave his valuables unsecured twice to go downstairs because he worried about disturbing his neighbors by shutting his room door?

Why would a man go downstairs twice and prop open an exit door because that was more convenient than carrying his keycard with him?

Why was there no forced entry into the home?

Why was a pregnant woman beaten 30 times to her and her unborn son's death, yet her 2 1/2 year old daughter was cleaned up, cared for, and left alive?

Why was Michelle's purse that was sitting out in the open not stolen, but a wallet with $500 in it that was hidden in JY's closet was stolen?

Why was JY's closet gone through, but Michelle's was left untouched?

Why was the house not ransacked?

Why didn't the dog that stayed in the house go after the "stranger" who murdered Michelle?

Why does the timeline of JY stopping at Four Brothers in King fit perfectly?

Why did no cameras record JY going towards the breakfast area on Friday morning?

Why was the last person JY talked to before the murder and the first person he talked to after the murder MM?

Why did JY print off the MapQuest directions and the Coach purse from Ebay at around the same time and remembered to get one but forgot the other?

Why was JY so persistent about getting MF over to his house to pick up the Coach purse printout? He called twice and left messages, and he had his mom call once and leave a message.

Why didn't JY answer his MIL's 4 phone calls within the space of an hour when cell phone records show that he retrieved the two messages she left him? Why didn't he return those calls?

When JY arrived at his mother's home and his stepfather gave him the news about Michelle's death, why did JY fall "plumb to his knees?" No surprise, no denial, no insisting that they must have gotten the news wrong. Just immediate acceptance.

Why didn't JY help LE at all even with his lawyer present?

Why didn't JY take a polygraph exam to clear himself with LE? MF did.

Why didn't JY show up for the WDS?

Why didn't JY keep custody of his daughter and allow MF and LF visitation?

Why didn't JY ever offer an award leading to the arrest of conviction of Michelle's killer(s)? Her place of employment did 9 months later; I guess they figured JY wasn't ever going to.

This is an open and shut case for me. JY has done everything in his power to make himself look guilty.

 

[otto]

I`m just listening to the gas attendant`s testimony again: http://www.wral.com/specialreports/michelleyoung/video/9714910/#/vid9714910

She said that the white vehicle was there at about 5 ... 5:30. It`s been mentioned a few times that it`s an hour drive from the gas station to the hotel. If the white vehicle was there at 5 AM, and the camera was tilted at 6:35, that no longer works with the timeline.

 

[otto]

1. 3 ft is otto's guess at the width of that door.
2. The angle of the door opening is also otto's guess.
3. The measurement between the door opening and the nearest shrub is also a guess.

3 feet is not a guess. That is the minimum standard width for a fire exit.

As I posted earlier, the swing of the door will be a minimum of 90 degrees, most likely wider for a commercial building fire exit ... but it depends on the local building code.

The width of the door can be used to determine the distance from the door to the the small bush.

 

[otto]

At about 12 minutes into the video, the gas attendant demonstrates that she was face to face, close enough to touch him, when she was talking to the customer that swore at her.

http://www.wral.com/specialreports/michelleyoung/video/9714910/#/vid9714910

She also states that there were video cameras at the gas station, but they weren`t hooked up. Jason couldn`t have known that.

 

[tarheel8600]

I`m just listening to the gas attendant`s testimony again: http://www.wral.com/specialreports/michelleyoung/video/9714910/#/vid9714910

She said that the white vehicle was there at about 5 ... 5:30. It`s been mentioned a few times that it`s an hour drive from the gas station to the hotel. If the white vehicle was there at 5 AM, and the camera was tilted at 6:35, that no longer works with the timeline.

It does if JY arrived back at the hotel and saw that the door wasn't propped open anymore. He could have just sat there in his vehicle and thought, "What the hell am I going to do now?"

Actually though, I think the receipt from the store shows Gracie ringing JY up around 5:27am.

 

[tarheel8600]

It's hard to say whether there is a bench near that exit or not.

I still find nothing unusual with someone checking the newspaper at midnight ... even if they own a computer, a radio and a television.

Was he vocal about not smoking or are you basing the belief that he was a "known anti-smoker" on the fact that he stipulated that he did not want the victim's sister smoking around his daughter?

I think the door was found propped open either between 3:30 and 4 or 4 and 5, depending on which part of the night clerk's testimony you go with. The rock was kicked away at a different time than when the camera was plugged in.

He may have changed clothes when he first arrived at his parent's home. When did police finally get a warrant to search for Jason's clothes at his parent's home?

BBM

When PY was interviewed by LE, she said that JY did not take anything out of his vehicle or change clothes there. Her husband backed her up on this.

 

[otto]

When police first spoke to the witness, she was not asked to describe who she saw, police only asked what happened. On May 30, 2007, she gave a brief description: she said that she saw a white male, mid-20s to early 30s, wearing a shirt, no coat, and unsure about blue jeans. On April 8, 2009 she again met with officers. That was when she was asked to describe the customer. At that time, she didn`t remember what he was wearing. In October 2009 she didn`t provide a description of the customer. On May 4, 2010, she met again with officers and again didn`t provide a description.

During the hearing, shortly before the trial, she was asked do describe the customer. What she recalled was that he had a little bit of hair (not bald and not a full head of hair), she couldn`t recall the hair color, height, weight and couldn`t remember anything except tha he was just a little bit taller than 5`3``.

I guess what that means is that the customer had a bit of hair and was short.

The gas attendant also confirms that she was not standing at a higher elevation than the customer ... the floor was at the same height throughout the store.