US - Shots fired at Donald Trump rally in Pennsylvania as former president is seen with blood across his face, 13 July 2024

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MassGuy said:
Watching CNN international right now, and this was mentioned. They said he’s a registered Republican who had also made a small donation to Biden, according to public records.

I looked up the latter earlier and it was something like 15 bucks.
Click to expand...
I saw that too — taking that kind of stuff with a grain of salt for now, because I’ve seen the screenshot floating around but can’t find a web page it could have come from.

I think stuff is flying around so fast right now, not sure how thoroughly it can all be verified.

Regardless, it wouldn’t surprise me if he were confused/conflicted politically, full of all kinds of contradictions and baffling ideologies.
 
StarryStarryNight said:
Could you post a link for MSM that Crooks is a registered republican?
I have seen a couple of social media comments from individuals but can’t find anything being reported on a news site.
Click to expand...

“Pennsylvania voter records listed a Thomas Matthew Crooks with the same address and birth date as a registered Republican, though it was not clear from the records when that was put in place.”

www.nbcnews.com

Trump rally shooter identified as 20-year-old Pennsylvania man

The FBI identified the shooter, who is dead, as Thomas Matthew Crooks of Bethel Park, Pennsylvania. A motive wasn't clear.
www.nbcnews.com www.nbcnews.com
 
clorenc said:
I saw that too — taking that kind of stuff with a grain of salt for now, because I’ve seen the screenshot floating around but can’t find a web page it could have come from.

I think stuff is flying around so fast right now, not sure how thoroughly it can all be verified.

Regardless, it wouldn’t surprise me if he were confused/conflicted politically, full of all kinds of contradictions and baffling ideologies.
Click to expand...
This is stuff you can look up, and not something that they'd throw on a teleprompter because of something someone posted. They would have verified it themselves.

As for the stuff flying around, it's nuts. One particular guy thought it would be fun to make light of it, and pretended he was Thomas Crooks (his photo is everywhere and its not even the shooter).

Totally agree with the confused/conflicted politically thing. We see that with a lot of mass shooters.
 
MassGuy said:
So one of three things could be going on.

1. He didn't want trump to win his primary (an intermediate election where a candidate is chosen from one particular party). To vote in that in Pennsylvania, he'd have to register as a Republican. So in that case it would be a strategic move, and not reflective of his political leanings.

2. He changed his views.

3. He really isn't political at all, and is all over the place.

I think this guy just wanted to be famous, but it's really early at this point to know what exactly his deal is. I think we'll learn that he had no friends, was a bit of an oddball (maybe some mental problems), and saw this as his chance to finally be somebody. Even in death.
Click to expand...
I’ll never understand your last paragraph. We see this so frequently, different faces, but the same similarities. Too tired to name them all.
 
We have been watching & reading news & discussing this ever since it happened. MOO follows...

1. The Secret Service should have made an appearance at the presser tonight. Instead the FBI & Pennsylvania LE were the ones there addressing the events & attempting to answer what questions they could. SS messed up big time but it feels like they really, really needed to be at that presser or hold a separate one tonight. Instead, it has been crickets from them.

2. This feels like a massive security failure. Not a small hole where someone found the only vulnerability that existed. It seems like the SS planned poorly, didn't respond to a possible threat (random people trying to point out that there was a guy on the roof with a gun), responded slowly to take the shooter out (he managed to shoot 4 people -- Trump, the man who died, & two others who are in critical condition), & also had serious gaps when trying to "cover" Trump as they made their way from the podium to the vehicle. He was exposed numerous times, there is recording/transcript of them talking when huddled down with him & it seemed like they didn't easily coordinate for a "1, 2, 3, move" type of count.

3. Considering their one job, really, is to protect the person they are in charge of, based on all the things from my previous point, this feels like a massive failure across the board. Imo. Utterly unprofessional, unprepared, and underwhelming to put it mildly.

4. Imo, of all groups, the Secret Service is an elite team. The best. Very, very few make the cut to protect a former President. There is almost an American mythos around this elite team. (Just look at movies & tv too, further burnishing the image of cool professionalism & action.) And today, they have completely blown that mythos away & replaced it with an amateur, unprofessional image that resulted in one person dead, two critically wounded, & a public leader almost assassinated.

I'm sure they also lead security when leaders of other countries come to the US for official visits with the President; if I were a leader from another country, I'd be cancelling any future official trips to the US. I would have zero confidence in the security apparatus surrounding the office of the President & former Presidents.

It just feels like such a massive failure on the part of the Secret Service, from planning, through execution, through evacuation that I don't know how they as an organization will recover. It truly boggles my mind.

MOO.
 
vls12345 said:
We have been watching & reading news & discussing this ever since it happened. MOO follows...

1. The Secret Service should have made an appearance at the presser tonight. Instead the FBI & Pennsylvania LE were the ones there addressing the events & attempting to answer what questions they could. SS messed up big time but it feels like they really, really needed to be at that presser or hold a separate one tonight. Instead, it has been crickets from them.

2. This feels like a massive security failure. Not a small hole where someone found the only vulnerability that existed. It seems like the SS planned poorly, didn't respond to a possible threat (random people trying to point out that there was a guy on the roof with a gun), responded slowly to take the shooter out (he managed to shoot 4 people -- Trump, the man who died, & two others who are in critical condition), & also had serious gaps when trying to "cover" Trump as they made their way from the podium to the vehicle. He was exposed numerous times, there is recording/transcript of them talking when huddled down with him & it seemed like they didn't easily coordinate for a "1, 2, 3, move" type of count.

3. Considering their one job, really, is to protect the person they are in charge of, based on all the things from my previous point, this feels like a massive failure across the board. Imo. Utterly unprofessional, unprepared, and underwhelming to put it mildly.

4. Imo, of all groups, the Secret Service is an elite team. The best. Very, very few make the cut to protect a former President. There is almost an American mythos around this elite team. (Just look at movies & tv too, further burnishing the image of cool professionalism & action.) And today, they have completely blown that mythos away & replaced it with an amateur, unprofessional image that resulted in one person dead, two critically wounded, & a public leader almost assassinated.

I'm sure they also lead security when leaders of other countries come to the US for official visits with the President; if I were a leader from another country, I'd be cancelling any future official trips to the US. I would have zero confidence in the security apparatus surrounding the office of the President & former Presidents.

It just feels like such a massive failure on the part of the Secret Service, from planning, through execution, through evacuation that I don't know how they as an organization will recover. It truly boggles my mind.

MOO.
Click to expand...
Former FBI Special agent on CNN right now saying the same thing. They send in an advance team that scouts out the location and identifies potential threat areas. That building was a huge threat, as it was the closest building that provided a direct line of sight to the stage. He was surprised there wasn't someone actually on that building.

He does praise the agents surrounding Trump though, who covered him and got him to safety.

After we get information about the gunman, that failure will be the next big storyline.
 
slowpoke said:
“Pennsylvania voter records listed a Thomas Matthew Crooks with the same address and birth date as a registered Republican, though it was not clear from the records when that was put in place.”
Click to expand...
I stand corrected! Things are flying around too fast for me to keep up with, apparently.

It’s interesting that we’re not finding much of a social media presence for a 20-year-old, but undoubtedly things will surface.
 
Is it dereliction of duty or DARVO? Both? Was Crooks a martyr, or a pawn?

This isn't making sense.

AN AMERICAN PRESIDENT WAS SHOT TODAY IN BROAD DAYLIGHT. And innocent bystanders were hurt and killed!

This is never ok. With the amount of surveillance we are all under with cell phones and cameras everywhere, this is a never event. It simply shouldn't have happened.

SS should have been on any nearby rooftop - especially those within distance to shoot a president! Every dereliction of duty in not protecting President Trump and the people at the event needs to be examined. Phone calls, texts, etc.

Everyone has an opinion. But those are legit facts.

Presidents receive lifetime security from Secret Service. And this is a special case, where a previous president is running. This should provide for double security as a candidate and what he receives in protection for his lifetime.

We must denounce all violence in the name of democracy. We, The People, deserve a thorough investigation and complete transparency, without rhetoric or bias.

Lets pray for this country. Lets pray for our children who saw the news. Lets pray for President Trump and the families of everyone who was afflicted.

And let us get to the bottom of this. Party lines aside. We need the truth here.
 
vls12345 said:
We have been watching & reading news & discussing this ever since it happened. MOO follows...

1. The Secret Service should have made an appearance at the presser tonight. Instead the FBI & Pennsylvania LE were the ones there addressing the events & attempting to answer what questions they could. SS messed up big time but it feels like they really, really needed to be at that presser or hold a separate one tonight. Instead, it has been crickets from them.

2. This feels like a massive security failure. Not a small hole where someone found the only vulnerability that existed. It seems like the SS planned poorly, didn't respond to a possible threat (random people trying to point out that there was a guy on the roof with a gun), responded slowly to take the shooter out (he managed to shoot 4 people -- Trump, the man who died, & two others who are in critical condition), & also had serious gaps when trying to "cover" Trump as they made their way from the podium to the vehicle. He was exposed numerous times, there is recording/transcript of them talking when huddled down with him & it seemed like they didn't easily coordinate for a "1, 2, 3, move" type of count.

3. Considering their one job, really, is to protect the person they are in charge of, based on all the things from my previous point, this feels like a massive failure across the board. Imo. Utterly unprofessional, unprepared, and underwhelming to put it mildly.

4. Imo, of all groups, the Secret Service is an elite team. The best. Very, very few make the cut to protect a former President. There is almost an American mythos around this elite team. (Just look at movies & tv too, further burnishing the image of cool professionalism & action.) And today, they have completely blown that mythos away & replaced it with an amateur, unprofessional image that resulted in one person dead, two critically wounded, & a public leader almost assassinated.

I'm sure they also lead security when leaders of other countries come to the US for official visits with the President; if I were a leader from another country, I'd be cancelling any future official trips to the US. I would have zero confidence in the security apparatus surrounding the office of the President & former Presidents.

It just feels like such a massive failure on the part of the Secret Service, from planning, through execution, through evacuation that I don't know how they as an organization will recover. It truly boggles my mind.

MOO.
Click to expand...
I’ve seen comments from some saying the level of security at this function wasn’t as high as it would be if he were a POTUS. But Trump is a paat President.

I’d like to see some commentary on formal policies. So because he isn’t A seated President, the radious of security around the event is smaller? I’m really trying to understand the standards of protection.
 
“When reached by CNN late Saturday night, Thomas Matthew Crooks’ father said he was trying to figure out ‘what the hell is going on’ but would ‘wait until I talk to law enforcement’ before speaking about his son.”

I cannot begin to fathom how this will forever impact his family.

How can his father even be talking to the media at all right now? I’d be crawling into a cave and never coming out. I wouldn’t be able to process or cope.

 
Last edited:
StarryStarryNight said:
Could you post a link for MSM that Crooks is a registered republican?
I have seen a couple of social media comments from individuals but can’t find anything being reported on a news site.
Click to expand...

From the same MSM live link below, news reporter stated the shooter's voter registration was Republican but that he financially supported Dem candidates via DNC or ActBlue.

www.nbcnews.com

Trump rally shooter identified as 20-year-old Pennsylvania man

The FBI identified the shooter, who is dead, as Thomas Matthew Crooks of Bethel Park, Pennsylvania. A motive wasn't clear.
www.nbcnews.com www.nbcnews.com

Pennsylvania voter records listed a Thomas Matthew Crooks with the same address and birth date as a registered Republican, though it was not clear from the records when that was put in place.
 
Dotta said:
Besides,
There were masses of people there.
Innocent people.
American voters.
Why to organise massive rallies if people are not safe there?
Who in their right mind will attend if they could be killed?
Click to expand...
You can be killed anywhere, really.

There is an inherent tension between liberty and security and American history especially is rife with struggle to balance the two.
 
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