VA - 6-YEAR-OLD in custody after shooting teacher, Newport News, Jan 2023 *mom charged* #2

[amaraya]

I'll just preface by saying that I'm a survivor of childhood sexual abuse. I may have more knowledge of some stuff than average BUT otoh I might also be more reactive, shall we say.

On the choice you're giving, I'd definitely say (1). You try and help the child. Labelling him or her as evil or bad or sick or whatever is not going to help anybody.

I learnt boys have different things from girls by observation at bathtime etc but not by touch. Respectfully, I don't agree that it's alright to learn what is OK or not by touching other people, no matter how young you are. Two children of a very similar age 'playing doctors' is one thing.
But let's just say some 6yo touches the sexual parts of a 2yo (or even 3-4-5 yo) who's not into participating in this 'game' of doctors and just freezes and gets emotionally damaged by it? What then? If the child freezes, the emotional damage can lead to traumatisation (MOO, IANA doctor or therapist, but unfortunately I have learnt a lot about trauma during my own recovery). The abuse has been passed on, even though the 6yo probably didn't know that what he was doing was wrong* and certainly would have no idea of the long-term consequences for the other child. In my unfortunate experience, extremely young children can be sexually aroused and this arousal is damaging. I have also read in some scientific paper that both components of that sentence are in fact true, but I don't intend to retraumatise myself by searching around for where I read that a number of years ago, so I'll just say MOO IMO.



*With a certain type of upbringing, I think the 6yo would have automatically known that you don't pull up a little girl's dress in the playground. MOO
Kudos to the teacher who reprimanded the boy and rescued the girl.

Very useful info and brave of you to open up with your experience, it is pertinent and thought provoking.

Thank you and take care of yourself, in helping others to understand, you are right to protect your own self. It is both anger inducing and heartbreaking what damage adults can do (whether from their own twisted education/experience or from negligence or ignorance).

 

[PrairieWind]

That attorney better choose his words very wisely.
These two do not go together…
- trigger lock
- loaded gun
Read the paperwork with trigger locks, you don’t put one on a loaded gun.

Safe Gun Storage
To actually store a gun safely ALL four of these must be met. Safely defined as can’t be found and used by a child…
- unloaded
- trigger lock
- ammo separated from gun
- key or combination to trigger lock separated from gun

The proof is in the result…a six year old got this gun with ammo and took it to school. It could NOT have been stored safely.

FYI

I don't see why a trigger lock can't be placed on a loaded firearm. It isn't smart, but it is possible.

 

[x_files]

Stored Gun or Used Gun?
When was the last time she had seen the gun? A gun isn’t something most women use weekly.
Why did she have the gun? Protection? A gun with a trigger lock on a top shelf unloaded in a closet is not available for protection.

Guns for Protection…
A gun for protection must be loaded, and within quick reach- such as in a safe with fingerprint lock under the edge of the bed. Problem is, those safes cost $100 or more.

Six Year Olds are Capable
It could be that the boy found the gun. If the key to the trigger lock is nearby, he could have taken it off. If the bullets are nearby and it is a revolver- he could have figured out how to load it.

Curious or Angry?
The thinking involved in planning to get the gun and take it to school, then carrying out that plan is possible for a six year old, but the intent to cause deadly harm is not.
I’m not sure a six year old understands death as permanent. Was he curious, or angry, was his intent to hurt or to see what would happen?

Well, the 6-year-old either found an unlocked, loaded gun and brought it to school, or he is clever enough to climb on a chair to the closet (not impossible), and knew where she hid the key and bullets.
My guess is it might have been on a higher shelf but it was all stored together or easy to find location.
Or someone gave him a loaded gun and put it into his backpack. That's the craziest possibility.
The mother was depressed I wonder when she bought the gun. BEFORE the miscarriages or during?
I'm sure we'll never know but would be curious if she was suicidal.

 

[jennytrevor]

I don't see why a trigger lock can't be placed on a loaded firearm. It isn't smart, but it is possible.

A trigger lock can be ineffective on a loaded gun and therefore is not an adequate security measure.

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[PrairieWind]

A trigger lock can be ineffective on a loaded gun and therefore is not an adequate security measure.

Best Gun Trigger Locks | SafeWise

Trigger locks are an important, affordable part of home gun safety. We researched the best gun trigger locks and barrel locks for you.

www.safewise.com

5 Best Gun Trigger Locks: Pistols & Rifles

Want to add some additional safety to your firearm? We'll go over the pros, cons, and best models of gun trigger locks. Plus video of our Editor's Pick.

www.pewpewtactical.com

Oh I agree totally. But the question was whether a trigger lock COULD be on a loaded gun. Yes it can. But it is not a good idea and can give a false sense of security.

 

[mickey2942]

The crux of the problem, if you have a gun for security, having it unloaded, in a gun safe, isn't much protection. Having a loaded gun, next to your bed, isn't really safe and secured for children.

 

[Cool Cats]

The crux of the problem, if you have a gun for security, having it unloaded, in a gun safe, isn't much protection. Having a loaded gun, next to your bed, isn't really safe and secured for children.

I always thought that too.

 

[ChatteringBirds]

Problem is, those safes cost $100 or more.

Safe gun ownership isn't cheap but if you have a child in the home, it is your responsibility. It is her responsibility to live with the consequences of her child accessing her gun. She could have chosen to have a weapon-free household, like many people do.

If she had it for protection because she lived in an unsafe area- then to me this is an accident.

She still has to be held legally and morally responsible. Her child could have literally killed other children.

It's not necessary to own a gun, and if you do choose to own one, and an innocent person is injured or killed, you don't get to walk free and call it an accident.

She should have either not had a gun or kept it locked in a safe that her child couldn't access. She didn't. She's responsible for what he did.
JMO.

 

[mpnola]

Especially a known dangerous child..... no excuses. I would not own a gun with a child who is in 1st grade and only allowed a half day with a parent sitting there. That is very high up on the risk scale.

When there was word that he had a gun,if they didn't want to frisk him, why didn't they immediately call the mom to find out if a. There was a gun in the home and b. If it was missing. That's the very least you can do.

 

[amaraya]

Uf. I am so happy to have moved to a country where gun ownership is very limited and gun violence is nearly inexistant to avoid the questions of gun safety and use. There is no answer to how to safely have a gun, imho, around kids, especially those who have issues with violence and impulsivity and as violent situations involving guns seem to multiply daily, i fear that events like this are just going to increase.

All mho

 

[AngTxGal]

I'll just preface by saying that I'm a survivor of childhood sexual abuse. I may have more knowledge of some stuff than average BUT otoh I might also be more reactive, shall we say.

On the choice you're giving, I'd definitely say (1). You try and help the child. Labelling him or her as evil or bad or sick or whatever is not going to help anybody.

I learnt boys have different things from girls by observation at bathtime etc but not by touch. Respectfully, I don't agree that it's alright to learn what is OK or not by touching other people, no matter how young you are. Two children of a very similar age 'playing doctors' is one thing.
But let's just say some 6yo touches the sexual parts of a 2yo (or even 3-4-5 yo) who's not into participating in this 'game' of doctors and just freezes and gets emotionally damaged by it? What then? If the child freezes, the emotional damage can lead to traumatisation (MOO, IANA doctor or therapist, but unfortunately I have learnt a lot about trauma during my own recovery). The abuse has been passed on, even though the 6yo probably didn't know that what he was doing was wrong* and certainly would have no idea of the long-term consequences for the other child. In my unfortunate experience, extremely young children can be sexually aroused and this arousal is damaging. I have also read in some scientific paper that both components of that sentence are in fact true, but I don't intend to retraumatise myself by searching around for where I read that a number of years ago, so I'll just say MOO IMO.



*With a certain type of upbringing, I think the 6yo would have automatically known that you don't pull up a little girl's dress in the playground. MOO
Kudos to the teacher who reprimanded the boy and rescued the girl.

My issue was with the language describing the incident as molestation.
To me that implies an attempt to gain sexual pleasure from touching without consent.
I can see a 6 yr old boy pulling up a girls dress with all kinds of things in mind- and none of them include sexual pleasure.
Of course it isn’t OK, but it may not have been molestation.

Stories I’ve heard where kids are learning about body parts involve cousins or friends, not at school and not kids who are not friends. An only child may not have the same socialization as one with siblings and cousins in their life?

I too am a survivor of SA, a step grandfather, and a middle school friends older brother. It changes you, forever.

JMO

 

[MyBelle]

My issue was with the language describing the incident as molestation.
To me that implies an attempt to gain sexual pleasure from touching without consent.
I can see a 6 yr old boy pulling up a girls dress with all kinds of things in mind- and none of them include sexual pleasure.
Of course it isn’t OK, but it may not have been molestation.

Stories I’ve heard where kids are learning about body parts involve cousins or friends, not at school and not kids who are not friends. An only child may not have the same socialization as one with siblings and cousins in their life?

I too am a survivor of SA, a step grandfather, and a middle school friends older brother. It changes you, forever.

JMO

I do not believe there is any evidence whatsoever that establishes this case involves molestation. The child has violent tendencies and needs to be evaluated by professionals. The teacher did nothing wrong. End of story.

 

[AngTxGal]

I don't see why a trigger lock can't be placed on a loaded firearm. It isn't smart, but it is possible.

I was just having this discussion, I think it depends on the trigger lock.
Some I have are cables that pass through the mechanism so it would be impossible to fire. A bullet cannot be chambered, a magazine can’t be clipped in place. But these aren’t called trigger locks- they are cable locks.
Trigger locks fit into the oval space keeping the trigger engaged. If gun was loaded and a bullet was chambered, adding the lock would fire the gun.
If magazine was in place, I think (not sure) on all semi auto you could chamber a bullet but the trigger lock would prevent firing.
A person who knows their gun would know.
To remove a trigger lock you must have a key, know the code and how to enter it, or have the fingerprints for the biometrix.
JMO

 

[AngTxGal]

I do not believe there is any evidence whatsoever that establishes this case involves molestation. The child has violent tendencies and needs to be evaluated by professionals. The teacher did nothing wrong. End of story.

Actually there was an incident on the playground where the boy pulled up the dress of a little girl and touched her.
Some in the press and here were calling that molestation.
That is what I questioned- the word choice implies intention.
I certainly did not mean to imply anything about the teacher making any error.
JMO

 

[Ontario Mom]

Actually there was an incident on the playground where the boy pulled up the dress of a little girl and touched her.
Some in the press and here were calling that molestation.
That is what I questioned- the word choice implies intention.
I certainly did not mean to imply anything about the teacher making any error.
JMO

The MSM articles I read on this stated the boy was touching the little girl inappropriately until stopped by a teacher.

They didn't elaborate on what "inappropriately" means but they don't have to. It means what it means. Without further comment from those who actually witnessed the event, it still means the boy was acting out some sort of inappropriate desire to do what he did.

 

[PrairieWind]

I was just having this discussion, I think it depends on the trigger lock.
Some I have are cables that pass through the mechanism so it would be impossible to fire. A bullet cannot be chambered, a magazine can’t be clipped in place. But these aren’t called trigger locks- they are cable locks.
Trigger locks fit into the oval space keeping the trigger engaged. If gun was loaded and a bullet was chambered, adding the lock would fire the gun.
If magazine was in place, I think (not sure) on all semi auto you could chamber a bullet but the trigger lock would prevent firing.
A person who knows their gun would know.
To remove a trigger lock you must have a key, know the code and how to enter it, or have the fingerprints for the biometrix.
JMO

Pretty much agree with you on this. A true trigger lock just fits over the trigger assembly. I think I see what you are saying about putting a trigger lock on a loaded gun may fire the gun. It would depend on the firearm really. I don't have any trigger locks right now but have been thinking about how they would work with my handguns. My handguns would accept a trigger guard lock with it loaded and not fire. But putting a trigger lock on a gun with a round actually chambered is an extremely bad idea. I can't even imagine doing that. And there really is no reason to do it.

 

[AngTxGal]

Pretty much agree with you on this. A true trigger lock just fits over the trigger assembly. I think I see what you are saying about putting a trigger lock on a loaded gun may fire the gun. It would depend on the firearm really. I don't have any trigger locks right now but have been thinking about how they would work with my handguns. My handguns would accept a trigger guard lock with it loaded and not fire. But putting a trigger lock on a gun with a round actually chambered is an extremely bad idea. I can't even imagine doing that. And there really is no reason to do it.

What it does highlight is the need for education- trigger locks are a cheap solution to help make guns safe.
Trigger locks where the key and ammo are stored nearby are no deterrent. A person still must have common sense.

JMO

 

[MyBelle]

The MSM articles I read on this stated the boy was touching the little girl inappropriately until stopped by a teacher.

They didn't elaborate on what "inappropriately" means but they don't have to. It means what it means. Without further comment from those who actually witnessed the event, it still means the boy was acting out some sort of inappropriate desire to do what he did.

ITA. It is impossible to infer it involved molestation. The boy may have yanked her arm forcefully or pushed her down. The bottom line is that his violent tendencies should have prevented him from being around other children.

JMO

 

[dalsglen]

The crux of the problem, if you have a gun for security, having it unloaded, in a gun safe, isn't much protection. Having a loaded gun, next to your bed, isn't really safe and secured for children.

The crux of the problem is having a gun, full stop. Farmers have guns for very good reasons, mum and dad living in that 2 up 2 down in the middle of town, no need for a gun whatsoever.

Edit: sorry guy's. As a brit, the gun shizzle drives me nuts.

 

[Laughing]

ITA. It is impossible to infer it involved molestation. The boy may have yanked her arm forcefully or pushed her down. The bottom line is that his violent tendencies should have prevented him from being around other children.

JMO

Agree that his violence, verbal & physical, is well documented.

In a school setting, the term "inappropriate" used here indicates touching more private body parts, touching that may be normal between consenting adults privately but inappropriate otherwise. Yanking her arm would be described as "Grabbed her arm" or "pulled her arm" in any school setting I've known as an adult. Pushed her down would be just that.

Inappropriate? Touching her thigh, panties, chest; pointing at her body/underwear & inviting others to look; etc would be considered inappropriate.

(Down a rabbit hole, um, yeah the child likely has observed this sort of behavior in mature video games and possibly IRL. Never was a fan of GTA btw.)

jmprofessional experience, ymmv, lrr