VA - Bethany Stephens, 21, mauled to death by her 2 dogs, Dec 2017

[Deleted member 158085]

..I've had dogs all my life...mostly German Shepherds..
my family got a Shep-Pit mix about a year ago and I will say she doesn't ''back down''--especially compared to other dogs I've had
when I ''stand my ground''/rebuke her/etc, she can be ornery.....barks back at me---but not my daughter or wife
she will be ''aggressive'' when she wants to play or a bone ---in that she nudges away our arms or books/laptops we are reading
she responds differently to my wife and daughter than to me
she's nipped me a couple of times when she wants to play outside, even after I severely scolded her
she's very aggressive when she wants to play
she does seem like a great companion, friend, etc especially to my wife and daughter
she definitely does not like it when I even talk to my wife, much less hug her

but I do not trust any animals--especially owners who say their dog won't bite

This situation concerns me as a rescuer. You really need to consult a behavioralist to work on your relationship with this dog. It sounds like a recipe for disaster, honestly. And I believe the dog is feeding off of your dislike and/or complete lack of trust with animals. He has trust issues with you. I've seen situations before where an owner's own anxieties cause anxiety in their dogs, yet the dogs are relaxed with others. This holds true when it comes to any emotion or attitude with animals.

Seriously, please find, not a standard trainer, but a dog behavioralist and commit to working some with this dog yourself.

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[DakotaMayi]

..I've had dogs all my life...mostly German Shepherds..
my family got a Shep-Pit mix about a year ago and I will say she doesn't ''back down''--especially compared to other dogs I've had
when I ''stand my ground''/rebuke her/etc, she can be ornery.....barks back at me---but not my daughter or wife
she will be ''aggressive'' when she wants to play or a bone ---in that she nudges away our arms or books/laptops we are reading
she responds differently to my wife and daughter than to me
she's nipped me a couple of times when she wants to play outside, even after I severely scolded her
she's very aggressive when she wants to play
she does seem like a great companion, friend, etc especially to my wife and daughter
she definitely does not like it when I even talk to my wife, much less hug her

but I do not trust any animals--especially owners who say their dog won't bite

Welcome... and be careful with that situation. Very careful.

I have had German Shepherds in our family, love them, even though they are needy. We still do have a Shep in our family (sister in law, not us directly) but I wouldn't expect her or any we have had to behave that way. They are a very particular breed. (I only speak of Sheps as I don't have any experience with pits).

We have a Spaniel now. Will always have dogs.

ETA: That whole thing was pretty concerning but that last sentence of the first paragraph shocked me. She doesn't like it when you speak to or hug your wife? She is your dog. You are not hers.

 

[Lilibet]

..I've had dogs all my life...mostly German Shepherds..
my family got a Shep-Pit mix about a year ago and I will say she doesn't ''back down''--especially compared to other dogs I've had
when I ''stand my ground''/rebuke her/etc, she can be ornery.....barks back at me---but not my daughter or wife
she will be ''aggressive'' when she wants to play or a bone ---in that she nudges away our arms or books/laptops we are reading
she responds differently to my wife and daughter than to me
she's nipped me a couple of times when she wants to play outside, even after I severely scolded her
she's very aggressive when she wants to play
she does seem like a great companion, friend, etc especially to my wife and daughter
she definitely does not like it when I even talk to my wife, much less hug her

but I do not trust any animals--especially owners who say their dog won't bite

Welcome to Websleuths, Bronk. :seeya: Please get rid of that dog. She thinks she in charge and she doesn’t like your competition.

 

[tlcya]

Sergeant Mike Blackwood said that multiple police departments contacted their office over the weekend to share information on similar attacks.

Blackwood added that Stephens' dogs were a “little bit neglected towards the end of this.” Stephens left the dogs with her father, and Blackwood said “he wasn’t taking care of them – it wasn’t his responsibility.”

The dogs had previously been indoor dogs and with her coming home maybe five times a week, they became more isolated. They were then kept outside “in the cold” in a kennel and only had contact with each other.

http://wgntv.com/2017/12/18/mauled-...leases-grisly-new-details-to-end-speculation/

 

[Deleted member 158085]

Sergeant Mike Blackwood said that multiple police departments contacted their office over the weekend to share information on similar attacks.

Blackwood added that Stephens' dogs were a “little bit neglected towards the end of this.” Stephens left the dogs with her father, and Blackwood said “he wasn’t taking care of them – it wasn’t his responsibility.”

The dogs had previously been indoor dogs and with her coming home maybe five times a week, they became more isolated. They were then kept outside “in the cold” in a kennel and only had contact with each other.

http://wgntv.com/2017/12/18/mauled-...leases-grisly-new-details-to-end-speculation/

In this article he says that they have ruled out an animal larger than a dog, and in the same breath says it wasn't a coyote. Does he realize, I wonder, that coyotes are smaller than many dogs? While often being tall and lanky, they top out at about 44 lbs (close to the average weight of an actual pit bull), and they routinely attack dogs (this last statement is based on the number of recent coyote attacks on pet dogs in the news here in Illinois, which has been proven by both videos and eye witness accounts).

https://www.wildlife.ca.gov/Conservation/Mammals/Gray-Wolf/Identification

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[Jealoushe]

It sounds like they were neglected at the end, probably becoming a bit feral and possibly hungry? The description they were chewing on her ribs was really too much to read.

 

[Elley Mae]

In this article he says that they have ruled out an animal larger than a dog, and in the same breath says it wasn't a coyote. Does he realize, I wonder, that coyotes are smaller than many dogs? While often being tall and lanky, they top out at about 44 lbs (close to the average weight of an actual pit bull), and they routinely attack dogs (this last statement is based on the number of recent coyote attacks on pet dogs in the news here in Illinois, which has been proven by both videos and eye witness accounts).

https://www.wildlife.ca.gov/Conservation/Mammals/Gray-Wolf/Identification

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I saw a yote run a brittany spaniel home. Kept biting him in the heels, had him yipping and running through a cow pasture. Run that dog home sorry he went in the woods.

 

[Trident]

This situation concerns me as a rescuer. You really need to consult a behavioralist to work on your relationship with this dog. It sounds like a recipe for disaster, honestly. And I believe the dog is feeding off of your dislike and/or complete lack of trust with animals. He has trust issues with you. I've seen situations before where an owner's own anxieties cause anxiety in their dogs, yet the dogs are relaxed with others. This holds true when it comes to any emotion or attitude with animals.

Seriously, please find, not a standard trainer, but a dog behavioralist and commit to working some with this dog yourself.

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If you're posting as an expert in this field, you need to be verified.
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...n-Process-for-Professional-or-Insider-Posters

 

[Trident]

Who produced this video? Is it MSM or actual experts? Is this link allowed according to TOS?

Seems this thread has a lot of links to highly reactive NON-MSM sites. The pit bull debate is a highly emotionally charged one, and for that reason we really need to stick to TOS. There is no reason for this thread to veer off into areas we can't touch on other cases just because the "POIs" happen to be dogs.

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Why not click on it and find out? It has loads of information from both sides of the debate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=iFa8HOdegZA

 

[MzOpinion8d]

That would be any dog.

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Really? Do chihuahuas kill people? Pomeranians? Pugs?

 

[neesaki]

In the FB video LE states the dogs had been somewhat “neglected” towards the end as they had been put in a kennel isolated from people, she only went over 5 times a week. They had previously been inside dogs. My guess, she put out extra food for the other two days, being dogs they ate it all in one day and went two days without food. In spite of my views on Pit Bulls in general it hurts to hear the dogs being treated like this. :sigh:

http://www.fox19.com/story/37093192/sheriff-dogs-ate-owner-after-mauling-her-to-death

 

[Deleted member 158085]

If you're posting as an expert in this field, you need to be verified.
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...n-Process-for-Professional-or-Insider-Posters

I'm not posting as an expert, which is why I suggest he consults a behavioralist - which I am not. I am an animal rescuer who has simply worked with trainers and behavioralists both with our rescue dogs and with dogs we are attempting to keep in their current homes. I don't think anything I have said could be construed as me thinking I am an expert on dog training, but only based on things I have clearly stated that I have seen in my personal experience.

I'm usually pretty good about being clear by saying things like "I have seen," or "in my experience" as I did here.

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[Trident]

Really? Do chihuahuas kill people? Pomeranians? Pugs?

I suppose they could if you swallowed one.

Sorry, couldn't help myself.:blushing:

Editing to add: Now I've seen a rare case where a pom did kill a small baby. I stand corrected.

 

[Deleted member 158085]

Why not click on it and find out? It has loads of information from both sides of the debate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=iFa8HOdegZA

Because I prefer not to click on things that are not adequately described or labeled as to source. I don't understand why anyone would have a problem with sourcing a link, which is advisable for many reasons.

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[Deleted member 158085]

Really? Do chihuahuas kill people? Pomeranians? Pugs?

He said simply "potential to kill", and I am responding with a simple fact, devoid of emotion, that yes, all dogs are capable of killing things whether it is a kitten or a person. Small dogs can kill children and seriously injured adults. I am speaking to the potential of violence for all dogs.

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[Hraefn]

Really? Do chihuahuas kill people? Pomeranians? Pugs?

Jack russel terrier average weight 12-17 lbs
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-old-boy-escaped-stair-gate-attack-child.html

Pomeranian average weight 4-7lbs
https://www.dogexpert.com/fatal-dog-attack-in-california-on-infant-by-pomeranian/

Lhasa Apso average weight 11-15 lbs
http://www.nytimes.com/learning/teachers/featured_articles/20010206tuesday.html (fatal attack referenced)

Boston terrier 10-25lbs
Dachshunds 16-20 lbs
Yorkshire terrier 12-15 lbs
Ratter terrier 20-30 lbs
etc.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_States

 

[Jennifer17]

Jack russel terrier average weight 12-17 lbs
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-old-boy-escaped-stair-gate-attack-child.html

Pomeranian average weight 4-7lbs
https://www.dogexpert.com/fatal-dog-attack-in-california-on-infant-by-pomeranian/

Lhasa Apso average weight 11-15 lbs
http://www.nytimes.com/learning/teachers/featured_articles/20010206tuesday.html (fatal attack referenced)

Boston terrier 10-25lbs
Dachshunds 16-20 lbs
Yorkshire terrier 12-15 lbs
Ratter terrier 20-30 lbs
etc.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_States

A cat can kill an infant.

 

[MaryG12]

Really? Do chihuahuas kill people? Pomeranians? Pugs?

AFAIK, no, they all come under the heading of

Little Yappie Dogs


But back to Bethany's 2 pit bulls - anyone know if these dogs came from a puppy mill?

I know it's a sensitive subject but worth asking.

 

[Lilibet]

Jack russel terrier average weight 12-17 lbs
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-old-boy-escaped-stair-gate-attack-child.html

Pomeranian average weight 4-7lbs
https://www.dogexpert.com/fatal-dog-attack-in-california-on-infant-by-pomeranian/

Lhasa Apso average weight 11-15 lbs
http://www.nytimes.com/learning/teachers/featured_articles/20010206tuesday.html (fatal attack referenced)

Boston terrier 10-25lbs
Dachshunds 16-20 lbs
Yorkshire terrier 12-15 lbs
Ratter terrier 20-30 lbs
etc.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_States

I ran across this blog list of risky dogs to bring home. These small dogs are mentioned, and I learned a lot. Training was mentioned over and over. Personally, I would not want to have to work that hard to keep everyone safe. JMO

http://www.dailyforest.com/entertainment/11-of-the-worlds-most-dangerous-dog-breeds

 

[Deleted member 158085]

I ran across this blog list of risky dogs to bring home. These small dogs are mentioned, and I learned a lot. Training was mentioned over and over. Personally, I would not want to have to work that hard to keep everyone safe. JMO

http://www.dailyforest.com/entertainment/11-of-the-worlds-most-dangerous-dog-breeds

I love this reference book I have. It lists whether, generally speaking, certain breeds are good with kids in the right hand column. Few small dogs are. These are snaps from the ASPCA Complete Guide to Dogs by Sheldon L. Gersstenfeld, V.M.D. and Jacque Lynn Schultz

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