VA - Couple & two teens found murdered, Farmville, 15 Sept 2009 #3

[dangrsmind]

wow,heroine,that info just floors me.....so if there were indeed 4 people that knew sam was going to kill, i would imagine she was one of them....i don't think sicktanik or sinister did though?

The number four again. Four murders, four people knew about it.

 

[blouAngel]

BlouAngel, could you please give me a link? I went to Google and looked up the address from a news article (505 1st Ave, Farmville VA) and it wasn't the right place.

Your descriptions fit well ... I agree the door to the 'breeze-way' is used by family, not the front door.

Thanks much!

Google maps take you to almost the right place. The house is on the block with the large playing field. It is the one at the lower right edge of the field. So, look just to the lower left of where Google takes you when you type that address in.

 

[dangrsmind]

A small thought to this comment ... when I was a kid in the Dark Ages (well, OK the Renaissance!), I lived in a medium-sized college town that was plop down in the middle of a rural area (bigger town that Farmville, but still small). There were only so many roads that one could take so far and then have to turn back. There were various places that were outside enough from town for party-spots, walks in moon-lit fields, etc. Next, remember that (as far as we can tell) Sam was there a week before they went to Michigan for the concert. So, my guess is that the 2 girls and Sam went out a lot to get away from Mama, day and/or night. Again, there are only so many places to go, especially that are not main roads (too much traffic) or dirt/gravel roads (where one can get off the road too easily).

I also went to visit a friend in WVa after high school, again a medium college town, and found the exact same thing. All the kids went to particular places, not on interstates, not on highways, not on dirt/gravel roads.

So, my point is, I'd guess Sam had been to Poorhouse Road more than once, was fairly familiar with it, and knew the route to get there ... but he just couldn't turn around well! LOL!

FWIW

Interesting point. I used to live on a rural road much like Poorhouse Road except in California. People you used to drive up there all the time and party, as well as to dump garbage, old cars, and once a dead body.

 

[blouAngel]

I always believed the "simple version" ,"the jilted lover" version until I read the "why them?" comment by that kinky suicide girl...that blew my mind....you had the chance ,you had the opportunity,why them?.....

If you read that in its original context, she also says something like you could have killed me. I think that's her real question, "why not me?" or something similar like "did you think about killing me too?" I'd certainly wonder that if I had been in a similar relationship with someone who killed someone else not unlike me.

It is possible that she meant they had discussed his plans to kill someone, and that she had hoped they would be total strangers, but I can't imagine here coming out and saying that in a public forum if it were premeditated and she were a co-conspirator and it doesn't really read that way.

I think simple explanations for most of what happened are the most likely to be on target. I wouldn't rule out earlier more widespread knowledge after the fact, or even a few manipulators/co-conspirators before the fact. I don't see her saying she's one of them though. I think she's saying she's shocked and confused, which is very understandable.

 

[dangrsmind]

Happy Halloween everyone...

I thought today was appropriate for airing a tiny bit of my meanderings into the occult aspects of this story. So if you hate my posts on this angle, you're guaranteed to hate this one too. Just think of it as a ghost story, it couldn't really be true anyway, but it makes for a good read on Halloween.

One thing that had been bothering me for a while is the name "Lil Demon Dog" which Sam McCroskey used in addition to the Syko Sam name. It has been theorized that both names refer to the Son of Sam who was not named Sam, but who claimed to be directed by an ancient demon who was resident in his neighbor Sam Carr's dog.

One gentlemen named Paul Calcagno is the origin of this story I believe, and his theories have been posted on a blog here: http://sammccrosky.blogspot.com/2009/09/sam-mccrosky-aka-syko-sam-aka-lil-demon.html

McCroskey's sister denies that her brother was obsessed with the Son of Sam.

Here's the thing though. If Sam McCroskey was "Lil Demon Dog" I have to wonder who is "Big Demon Dog"?

Calcagno claim's that the making of this video (which features four ritual murders) was a Satanic ritual aimed at invoking a 3000 year old demon dog which I previously surmised was the infamous Pazuzu who is also featured in the movie The Exorcist.

You might also recall that in the O.T.O. interview with SickTanick which I previously posted here he details the story of his recording Doctrines of the Damned which he says is in part autobiographical. In particular there is the story of the main character who conducts a ritual and then contacts a demon who shows the character his soul in its left hand.

Consider now the cover of SickTanick's record:

The nice fellow in the center surrounded by the mysterious symbols is none other than Pazuzu. In other words, Doctrines of the Damned is SickTanick's story of evoking Pazuzu. For those interested in the symbols, the symbol on the right is known as the unicursal hexagram and represents the union of man and god. It is used in Thelemic rituals. The symbol on the left is an alchemical symbol meaning sulfer or brimstone (black sulfer). The symbol at the top is more mysterious, and it took a while to construct a thery of it's meaning. Exercise left to the reader, but I'll give you one clue: the Hebrew letters spell the word for "wire" in Hebrew.

If you follow the story of this recording as well as other clues left by SickTanick in the lyrics, you can conclude that this recording is intended to summon or teach someone to summon Pazuzu. Some may recall that Pazuzu is a wind demon representing the southwest winds. SKR hails from the southwestern United States.

What I didn't know until recently was that Pazuzu also has a little brother or son (depending on the story) named Humbaba. I claim "lil demon dog" is a coded reference (consciously or unconsciously selected) to Humbaba the guardian of the Cedar Forest. Humbaba has two well known characteristics: his face is made of entrails and he smells like death and decay. He was decapitated by Gilgamesh according to legend.

Sam McCroskey in his Syko Sam guise typically covers his face with a bandanna. Perhaps so we can't see his face of entrails? And he walked around smelling like death.

According to a book about mythology and astronomy, Hamlet's Mill, Humbaba is associated with the planet Mercury and the star Procyon. Those interested in astrology and astronomy will note that Mercury was retrograde during the time of the murders and will recall that Procyon is in the constellation Canis Minor and is known as "The Little Dog Star". Procyon is Greek for "before the dog" apparently because it would rise before the star Sirius ("The Dog Star") giving early warning of the annual Nile floods.

 

[tapu]

opcorn:

 

[deita]

Google maps take you to almost the right place. The house is on the block with the large playing field. It is the one at the lower right edge of the field. So, look just to the lower left of where Google takes you when you type that address in.

37°17'45.75"N
78°24'5.00"W

 

[dangrsmind]

37°17'45.75"N
78°24'5.00"W

The house is set back a fair bit from the road. Imagine how strong the odor must have been to be smelled by someone walking by the house on the sidewalk.

See http://maps.google.com/maps?q=37°17...=SijScvKq8SCPZ8p6pQzpKQ&cbp=12,266.2,,0,12.12

 

[deita]

okcupid.com/profile/LiLdEmOnDoG

I am Energetic, Intelligent, EpicWin, and a Gentlemen.

My Self-Summary

I'm 20 years of age and will be turning 21 this December and I cant wait! :]
I usually can be pretty random/weird at most times but in a good way. I been told I'm a great, funny, nice guy and that I'm very mature for my age. I love to laugh and have fun, but who doesn't right? I'm always down to meet new people. I'm pretty creative, I like to design Graphics and Websites. I love having a idea in my head and being able to make it come to life, its a true art form. I also love photography but that's a given to my graphic work. This may come off me being very cocky but that's not my intentions. I'm a very creative person overall, Music is also a big part of my life. Most of my friends are very talented musicians so it kinda rubs off on me to make music of my own time to time. I believe I'm pretty talented, I'm a fast learner. I self taught myself in everything I'm skilled at. I think I'm a very unique individual and that's the best part of me. I been told I'm not like most guys and I agree with that.. but to sum it up, I'm a guy on a endless journey looking for that missing part of me, my other half <3

I&#8217;m really good at

Making people laugh and making them feel better when there down, I been told I'm a very caring person and a great listener.. I'm always playing Dr. Phil.

I'm also good at..

- Photography
- Web /Graphic Design
- Making Music
- Tripping over things when I'm drunk (I don't drink that often tho ;x)

Heres video proof of my drunken-ness, Its kinda embarrassing but its too funny not to post! Don't laugh at me, laugh with me k?

YouTube - When Sam gets Drunk

The first things people usually notice about me

I think my eyes are pretty amazing. I have baby blue eyes but they tend to changes colors depending on my mood, they go from dark blue to baby blue, green and sometimes a gray. I was told there just like a mood ring. They also have a gold circle around the pupils.. I love love love my eyes, there simply amazing.

My favorite books, movies, music, and food

Books: I'm not much of a reader but I absolutely LOVE the novels of the Dexter series by Jeff Lindsay which are..

Darkly Dreaming Dexter
Dearly Devoted Dexter
Dexter in the Dark

Movies: My favorite movie is Fight Club, I seen it like 928133741 times and still enjoy it each time I watch it. I mostly like Horror, War, Comedy and Action movies but I'll watch anything as long as it peeks some kinda interest. Some of my favorite movies are..

28 Days Later, 28 Weeks Later, American History X, American Psycho, Die Hard (All), Donnie Darko, Fight Club, Friday the 13th (All), Funny Games, Grandmas Boy, Halloween (All), Harold & Kumar (All), House of 1000 Corpses, IT, My Bloody Valentine, Nightmare on Elm Street (All), Numb, Panic Room, Pearl Harbor, Pineapple Express, Silent Hill, The Butterfly Effect, The Dark Knight, The Day After Tomorrow, The Devils Rejects, The Hitcher, V for Vendetta, War of the Worlds

TV: I don't watch much tv but when I do, I watch..

Aqua Teen Hunger Force, Attack of the Show, CSI, Comedy Central Stand Up, Crank Yankers, Dexter (My favorite show of all time <3), Heroes, Lost, Reno 911, Robot Chicken, South Park, Survivorman, The Simpsons, The Whitest Kids U'Know, Trigger Happy TV, Weeds, X-Play

and pretty much anything else on Adult Swim.

Music: I listen to all kinds of music but mainly listen to underground rap/horrorcore. I would list some of the artists I listen to but there mostly underground and I doubt anyone would know who they are, but some of the bigger names are..

Insane Clown Posse, Twiztid, Tech N9ne, Kottonmouth Kings

I also like (some of)..

Korn, Linkin Park

Food: I don't really have a favorite food.. top ramen is pretty good ;p

I spend a lot of time thinking about

World Domination ;x

The most private thing I&#8217;m willing to admit here

I'm the Easter bunny but shh! that's a secret.

You should message me if

If you want to, don't be shy ;]

Note: I don't get on here as often as I used to so best bet to get a hold of me is through myspace which could be found below

myspace.com/samakalemon

 

[deita]

Happy Halloween everyone...

One thing that had been bothering me for a while is the name "Lil Demon Dog" which Sam McCroskey used in addition to the Syko Sam name. It has been theorized that both names refer to the Son of Sam who was not named Sam, but who claimed to be directed by an ancient demon who was resident in his neighbor Sam Carr's dog.

gamertagpics.com/xbox-live-profile/LiLdEmOnD0G

How did you come up with your Gamertag (LiLdEmOnD0G)?

I came up with it when I was like 12 years old, It was my aol screen name that I used and still continue to use for many years.

 

[dangrsmind]

okcupid.com/profile/LiLdEmOnDoG

<snipped>

Notable: Not one, but two mentions of Dexter on this page.

 

[dangrsmind]

gamertagpics.com/xbox-live-profile/LiLdEmOnD0G

Interesting.

I'd like to know more about why he chose this name. I note no mention of SKR or WIR on that page as well. So this is before he got into that stuff apparently although there are some juggalo artists listed of course.

Now I am wondering how he met the SKR and WIR guys originally.

 

[deita]

Notable: Not one, but two mentions of Dexter on this page.

it also is kind of interesting: Religion - Other

 

[peace_gurl]

The house is set back a fair bit from the road. Imagine how strong the odor must have been to be smelled by someone walking by the house on the sidewalk.

See http://maps.google.com/maps?q=37°17...=SijScvKq8SCPZ8p6pQzpKQ&cbp=12,266.2,,0,12.12

It looks back far......but it is not. and the 3 bodies were found in the room closest to the sidewalk. The window is still open a bit , tape is still across the doors with no trespassing signs in the front yard and evidence flags still in the yard.

 

[deita]

Now I am wondering how he met the SKR and WIR guys originally.

i guess he offered his web design services to them, sam was trying to build his own web design business.

p.s. interesting demo, not too bad for a beginner, made by sam on 2004 - web.archive.org/web/20040908175541/www.hatchetdesigns.com/intro.html

 

[peace_gurl]

Peace gurl may be able to add more, but from the images I've seen it appears that the "garage" portion of the house isn't in fact a garage. It may have been originally, but it looks more like a "mother in law" apartment or one added for a student occupant. Small college towns often have apartments added on to houses near the schools.

The Google aerial view doesn't show a driveway leading to the back side, there is obviously no garage door on the front, and there are bushes and a smaller door on the side away from the main house and towards the drive way. There is a relatively narrow section of the house that connects the main house and the smaller house. The door on the driveway side of the little house is on axis with the connecting section. My guess is that for the occupants, that is the main entry.

There is another door on the front and quite possibly the back of the connector. There seems to be a patio in the back area defined by those three section of house. The front door on the connector is probably mostly unused. The back door if there is one may be the occupant's main entrance, but I would guess not. I would say the most likely is the end door, followed in likelihood by a door on the back left (viewed from the front) corner of the main house. My guess is that is where the kitchen would be and that's a common place for people to enter their own homes. It's also a nearly straight shot from the drive way and there looks to be a walkway that would allow that.

The front door is a formality. Strangers knock and/or enter at the front. Family has its entry, and friends may either enter there accompanied, or may use another door if they come unannounced or if the family entry is into a semi-private zone like a kitchen. Depends on the family, how many doors there are etc.

If the bodies were found upstair in the smaller portion of the house, then there must be an upstairs. It has to be small though. Very small. The roof ridge on it is considerably lower than on the main house. At most about 1/3 of the floor space would be tall enough to stand up in. If you look at the front view of the house, it's pretty easy to see why. If the interior height of the top of the front window were 7 feet, that would leave about 5 feet of width for a 6' tall person to stand in. The slope is about 45 degrees, so a shorter person would only gain in width twice the difference between his height and 6' before hitting his head. There are no dormers. It's pretty tiny up there, and it has to have some sort of access, stairs? spiral staircase maybe, but expensive and a code problem. I cant figure out where they would be considering the roof structure and the chimney, but right to the left after entering the end door makes the most sense. That allows for an entry/mud room before the passage into the main house with enough space for a roughly 15' x 15' room to the back side.

I had considered the possibility that Emma may have claimed the little house as her own. I looked for pictures that might be of her at home with windows or ceiling behind her, but couldn't find any clues there. If she had the upstairs room, which size seems to me to make unlikely anyway, that background would be easy to spot. Downstairs could be hers except for one thing. The main house has a basement. The rest probably doesn't. Connecting the rest to a likely forced air heating/cooling system would be a hassle. It could go through the attic spaces, but that would still be pain with long duct lengths and a hugely increased furnace size. Where does all of that rambling lead? To a conclusion that the smaller section of the house is heated by wood and it has either a 1.3 story guest room, or a guest loft. Emma and Mel may have stayed there if they were alone, but they had Sam, who had to stay somewhere. There's no way he would get her room with or without her, especially if things weren't going well. Maybe all three would have hung out together there though and possibly even all slept there although I doubt it.

I had considered that the girls slept in the loft, Sam got angry, killed them with the maul that would have been nearby, killed the mother with the same implement, and then dragged her there. I think that was his place though and he dragged them all there for some reason, possibly to hide them, possibly to do something else with them. He may have expected to load them in the van and dump them but not found the keys.

I suspect Mr. Niederbrock(seen that spelled both ei and ie) arrived unexpectedly and either came in on his own (how estranged the parents were we don't really know) or knocked at the end door by the driveway. There's a chimney that indicates a fireplace very close to that door. Sam either saw him coming and ambushed him or let him in and caught him off guard. He was probably too heavy for Sam to carry upstairs, which would explain why he was in a different location. The problem I've created though is why the women's bodies were found first. My guess is that the smell from them was much more powerful and that's what police investigating that found. Could have been a trail of blood in at least part of the house.

The relationship between police and people in their own homes is a formal relationship, not a friendly relationship. That demands a knock at the front door, not a side door in most circumstances. I think that's what kept them from seeing or smelling the bodies. Someone asked earlier about the police asking for ID or recognizing someone as not being right there. Police are almost certainly local. College professors and students are almost certainly not. That can be like oil and water even in a very small town. It does affect how people interact.

To add to the list of what Sam knows, if Mels mom called at 3:30 a.m. and he said they were broken down (reported by peace gurl, but both news to me, source?) then he knows he has some explaining to do about why their car is still in the driveway. Same for the pastor's car. He really screwed things up by showing up when he did. i don't think Sam was waiting for him to add to his kill list. I think he had to do it or he would have certainly been caught very soon.

I keep wondering why that house didn't burn down. If I were sitting there trying to come up with a plan, it would have happened sometime Thursday night.

Many of the local papers are not on line in this community. A lot of my information is from local sources. The wood pile that I have seen can be seen from the street. It is at the top of the driveway. Now that the dumpster has been taken away it is very visible when you drive or walk by. The little house has never been an apartment or mother-in-law apartment to my knowledge. I have known every family that lived there before the Kellys. Not sure what part of the house was built first. I have no idea what rooms the Kellys used for what. I know the people who lived there before lived mostly in the small part of the house. It is much cheaper to heat and cool.

 

[peace_gurl]

Mel's father sit in the street for about 7 hours and knocked on the door several times....He did not smell anything unusual.....or he would have reported it right?

 

[dangrsmind]

i guess he offered his web design services to them, sam was trying to build his own web design business.

p.s. interesting demo, not too bad for a beginner, made by sam on 2004 - web.archive.org/web/20040908175541/www.hatchetdesigns.com/intro.html

Right, but when did this connection occur? I know (for example) that Sam did a lot of the graphics for KillMusick.com. I'm wondering if he approached SKR or they approached him.

 

[dangrsmind]

Sam is a Capricorn.

From the very first listing on Google for "capricorn september 2009":

An enthusiastic attitude, on your part, will dominate this month. You will get involved in short distance travels, which will be comfortable as well as rewarding. Family happiness is indicated and your brothers or sisters will be quite comfortable. You might take impulsive decisions, but they will turn out to be in your favor. You are likely to acquire a vehicle in this period. Your contacts with people will increase. Service conditions will also improve. By the grace of God, things will start coming your way.

 

[dangrsmind]

Mel's father sit in the street for about 7 hours and knocked on the door several times....He did not smell anything unusual.....or he would have reported it right?

One would assume so, but IMO in relation to this case assuming things seems to always be a mistake.