VA - Couple & two teens found murdered, Farmville, 15 Sept 2009 #3

[gxm]

you say there were reports of feces spread on the walls... do you know of the source of this information, i.e. news reports? that could very well explain a part of the really foul odor Sam emitted in the company of 3 different individuals.

Here is where I have yet another problem with LE's initial handling of this case. If it is true, that the basement was covered in feces and the animals were being kept in unclean conditions, then why didn't they call animal control? Sorry, but IMO LE should have been all over this from the start, instead they seem to have taken a rather lackadaisical approach in the beginning.

 

[PAXIMUS]

Pax: Do you think he's like those American Idol people who can't sing and think they can? I mean instead of knowing he's full of 2h!t and selling his stuff anyway, he actually believes he is imparting dark knowledge through his music? I think he's dead serious about the occult whether he's got just enough knowledge to be dangerous or is otherwise challenged and I've enjoyed dangrsmind's collection here of Shrim's works and interviews.

I want to know about raz. Her real name? She found out first right? Who called her and told her about the girls being dead and when?

Didn't anyone in this community worry about the underage kids? Yeah, silly me.

Big Rela: I'm glad you're here with insight and at least you aren't a poseur so I'll give you that. Do you think the police don't care that there may be a connection because they've got Sam and four dead people and they are leaving it at that, or are the just ignorant?

Did this tragedy cause anyone to leave the community? I know pixie said she couldn't listen to the songs anymore because they made her think of what happened and then she had a custody problem and we haven't heard how she's been. Shrim has that strong a hold on people that they are sticking together and blacklisting those who won't?

He's not that big music-wise but he seems to exert power over the small crowd that he has. Tell me how he does that!

I think he does indeed believe he is the **** but that is precisely why he surrounds himself with young misunderstood emotional basketcase teenagers because they dont have the ability to discern bull**** from the real deal when its right in front of them. He is not taken seriously by anyone of note in the music industry whether it be the mainstream or underground scenes, he basically has a small myspace internet record label that moves a few thousand CDs a year, he probably makes a decent living but that isnt because he has talent it is because those who listen to his music have no ability to discern what real talent is.

He is able to assert power over these people because they are largely lost confused and drugged up teenagers going through a very difficult period of life (not to spea ill of the dead but watch some of the videos with Emma in them, she is completely stoned out of her mind most of the time it appears) and he speaks to them in a way that gets their attention, you dont have to be a genius to know how to manipulate people in fact any dumbass can do that, only special people can touch others in meaningful, lasting and valuable ways.

As for your other question I have spoken to no less than ten people who contacted me to tell me their stories, who have left the scene and are very disgusted with the way Shrim has handled it all, also it appears Syniister, owner and founder of Wicket Intent Records, Sams best friend and the person Sam first contacted after the murders, has closed his record company down and claims he will no longer be making or producing this music because be feels partly responsible for what happened. Whether he is just scared ****less because of possible accusations of involvement or sincere in what he has done, your guess is as good as mine.

Last but not least I am currently doing everything humanly and legally possible to find out Razakel's real name, she has so far refused to release that information but I am guessing that any property they own or the business of SKR itself is in her name or at least in both of their names so I am doing some public property listing searches, which is all legal and a matter of public records, to see what I can come up with. Will keep you posted on that and please do the same if you find anything of note also.

 

[gxm]

Is there any evidence saying he wasn't? They found Sam Saturday. The girls were murdered on what Wednesday or Thursday. He could have left Sam to clean up and went home. Its not an accusation its a personal belief. There were even reports of feces spread on the walls. And from what i have read its apart of a killing ritual of the occult. Sam just doesn't come off as the type of person that could orchestrate this whole mess by himself.

As best we can tell, the women were killed either late Monday/early Tuesday morning or late Tuesday/early Wednesday morning. (I'm guessing early Tuesday morning.) From what we know their bodies were too decomposed to have been killed on Thursday. Besides, Mel's dad was there for several hours on Wednesday. There was no reason for his daughter to avoid him other than the fact that she had been killed before he arrived.

About the only other involvement that remotely makes sense to me is Raz perhaps egging Sam on via internet. I seriously doubt anyone else was there with Sam. LE has, hopefully, checked everyone's alibi. But considering their initial Keystone Cops routine, who knows.

 

[gxm]

Welcome all new members! It's great to have you here. Thanks for joining the conversation.

 

[dangrsmind]

Absolutely candles are a big part of any sort of ritualistic activity whether it be left or right hand path practice, but again I think I can state with some sort of certainty that Shrim and his minions/cohorts do not have the knowledge and know-how to perform any type of authentic ritual that would produce results. You have to understand, in spite of the many claims of people throughout history, very few people if any have really had any success with Magick and/or occult practice. Those who do or may have are people you have never heard of or never will and they are likely living in bunkers somehwere in the dark underground of Tibet. This type of thing just takes an incredible amount of focus, energy, discipline and knowledge and without dedicating your entire life and every waking moment and thought to it, you will likely never even scratch the surface and those who have will never speak about it or write books telling their secrets as it is a very closely guarded type of information that is purposely kept within a very small community of adepts who I believe are likely connected to the Tibetian Buddhist/Tantric community.

It is my opinion that Shrim is a charlatan and he is not the first or last to be such. But that doesnt mean, as Dangersmind has pointed out, that his music couldnt contain some sort of hidden psuedo-occult like messages that perhaps Sam and others may be privy to.

Yes, exactly. I'm no occult expert but I know enough to know that anyone that says they are is probably lying. The whole subject could consume multiple lifetimes of research, and few have the time or inclination to delve deeply.

On the other hand, sometimes weird **** just manifests. I can't explain it but I have observed it.

 

[dangrsmind]

I think he does indeed believe he is the **** but that is precisely why he surrounds himself with young misunderstood emotional basketcase teenagers because they dont have the ability to discern bull**** from the real deal when its right in front of them. He is not taken seriously by anyone of note in the music industry whether it be the mainstream or underground scenes, he basically has a small myspace internet record label that moves a few thousand CDs a year, he probably makes a decent living but that isnt because he has talent it is because those who listen to his music have no ability to discern what real talent is.

He is able to assert power over these people because they are largely lost confused and drugged up teenagers going through a very difficult period of life (not to spea ill of the dead but watch some of the videos with Emma in them, she is completely stoned out of her mind most of the time it appears) and he speaks to them in a way that gets their attention, you dont have to be a genius to know how to manipulate people in fact any dumbass can do that, only special people can touch others in meaningful, lasting and valuable ways.

As for your other question I have spoken to no less than ten people who contacted me to tell me their stories, who have left the scene and are very disgusted with the way Shrim has handled it all, also it appears Syniister, owner and founder of Wicket Intent Records, Sams best friend and the person Sam first contacted after the murders, has closed his record company down and claims he will no longer be making or producing this music because be feels partly responsible for what happened. Whether he is just scared ****less because of possible accusations of involvement or sincere in what he has done, your guess is as good as mine.

Last but not least I am currently doing everything humanly and legally possible to find out Razakel's real name, she has so far refused to release that information but I am guessing that any property they own or the business of SKR itself is in her name or at least in both of their names so I am doing some public property listing searches, which is all legal and a matter of public records, to see what I can come up with. Will keep you posted on that and please do the same if you find anything of note also.

My understanding was that someone else was taking over the label.

 

[dangrsmind]

Pax: Do you think he's like those American Idol people who can't sing and think they can? I mean instead of knowing he's full of 2h!t and selling his stuff anyway, he actually believes he is imparting dark knowledge through his music? I think he's dead serious about the occult whether he's got just enough knowledge to be dangerous or is otherwise challenged and I've enjoyed dangrsmind's collection here of Shrim's works and interviews.

I want to know about raz. Her real name? She found out first right? Who called her and told her about the girls being dead and when?

Didn't anyone in this community worry about the underage kids? Yeah, silly me.

Big Rela: I'm glad you're here with insight and at least you aren't a poseur so I'll give you that. Do you think the police don't care that there may be a connection because they've got Sam and four dead people and they are leaving it at that, or are the just ignorant?

Did this tragedy cause anyone to leave the community? I know pixie said she couldn't listen to the songs anymore because they made her think of what happened and then she had a custody problem and we haven't heard how she's been. Shrim has that strong a hold on people that they are sticking together and blacklisting those who won't?

He's not that big music-wise but he seems to exert power over the small crowd that he has. Tell me how he does that!

LOL at the idea of an SKR American Idol try out. Too bad they got rid of Paula, because I think she could have been a True Deciple.

 

[dangrsmind]

RELA for the sake of discussion would you care to elaborate on any possible motives for Shrim being involved in these crimes. Obviously opportunity wouldnt be difficult to suggest since he was traveling around during that time and likely had plenty of unaccounted for periods but what motive would you suggest that may bolster your theory?

In the modern era it is hard to travel undetected. Assuming you drive, images of your car and possibly your license plate are captured by cameras. If you use credit or debit cards all transactions are recorded. Of course if you use an ATM or enter a bank, your image is recorded. Cell phone calls produce records, and a person's location at various times can be determined by accessing cell records. Forensic examination of a computer can reveal a lot about their social contacts and searches as well. Etc.

If there is deeper involvement from other people in this case it seems unlikely that it will remain secret.

 

[PAXIMUS]

Yes, exactly. I'm no occult expert but I know enough to know that anyone that says they are is probably lying. The whole subject could consume multiple lifetimes of research, and few have the time or inclination to delve deeply.

On the other hand, sometimes weird **** just manifests. I can't explain it but I have observed it.

Precisely, most of them read a few websites and suddenly think they are occult experts. I have been studying this stuff literally since I was 5 years old since my parents were very much in to counter culture alternative lifestyles in the 60s and I was basically raised in a Steiner occult commune (these are good occultists not the evil dark path types) and I havent even scratched the surface yet man. I can tell you one thing, just trying to read and understand, REALLY understand Blavastsky's Isis Unveiled can take NO LESS than 30 years and sometimes even a lifetime and that is just one book, and important book with a lot of very important occult information but one book nonetheless, and anyone who tells you they read it and were able to really grasp and understand it, in a single sitting, is lying.

Indeed strange things do happen, I am a skeptic like you by nature but not so much that I dont understand that things are rarely what they seem to be.

 

[PAXIMUS]

In the modern era it is hard to travel undetected. Assuming you drive, images of your car and possibly your license plate are captured by cameras. If you use credit or debit cards all transactions are recorded. Of course if you use an ATM or enter a bank, your image is recorded. Cell phone calls produce records, and a person's location at various times can be determined by accessing cell records. Forensic examination of a computer can reveal a lot about their social contacts and searches as well. Etc.

If there is deeper involvement from other people in this case it seems unlikely that it will remain secret.

Thats true, I have been working on a book for several years now on how to sabotage the big brother technological police state, I wont give away much but I would like it to cover legitimate ways to avoid all detection whether it be video cameras, retina scans, stun guns, directed energy weapons etc, I could probably use someone like you to collaborate with me on this project, sort of a new Anarchist's Cookbook for the new technological surveillance age.

Sadly I dont think tin foil hats will work much longer and we need to tack a new course.:crazy:

 

[PAXIMUS]

As best we can tell, the women were killed either late Monday/early Tuesday morning or late Tuesday/early Wednesday morning. (I'm guessing early Tuesday morning.) From what we know their bodies were too decomposed to have been killed on Thursday. Besides, Mel's dad was there for several hours on Wednesday. There was no reason for his daughter to avoid him other than the fact that she had been killed before he arrived.

About the only other involvement that remotely makes sense to me is Raz perhaps egging Sam on via internet. I seriously doubt anyone else was there with Sam. LE has, hopefully, checked everyone's alibi. But considering their initial Keystone Cops routine, who knows.

I think if we are going to continue this line of discussion we need to at least speculate on possible motives Shrim and Raz may have had for wanting the girls murdered.

Any ideas?

 

[NativeGirl]

I think if we are going to continue this line of discussion we need to at least speculate on possible motives Shrim and Raz may have had for wanting the girls murdered.

Any ideas?

Fame it seems to me..

 

[PAXIMUS]

Fame it seems to me..

Money, fame, greed, the usual suspects eh? You may be right.

 

[NativeGirl]

Money, fame, greed, the usual suspects eh? You may be right.

yup I bet they get off on us talking so much about them and and giving them the attention they wanted..

 

[dangrsmind]

Precisely, most of them read a few websites and suddenly think they are occult experts. I have been studying this stuff literally since I was 5 years old since my parents were very much in to counter culture alternative lifestyles in the 60s and I was basically raised in a Steiner occult commune (these are good occultists not the evil dark path types) and I havent even scratched the surface yet man. I can tell you one thing, just trying to read and understand, REALLY understand Blavastsky's Isis Unveiled can take NO LESS than 30 years and sometimes even a lifetime and that is just one book, and important book with a lot of very important occult information but one book nonetheless, and anyone who tells you they read it and were able to really grasp and understand it, in a single sitting, is lying.

Indeed strange things do happen, I am a skeptic like you by nature but not so much that I dont understand that things are rarely what they seem to be.

Never even heard of Steiner before tonight.

I find it best to remain an extreme agnostic so I appreciate your insight here. You say that you believe Shrim is a charlatan, but then how do you explain the Humbaba connection? Pazuzu is on the cover oh his CD so Shrim is either teaching people to invoke this entity or he's using the disc as an evocation itself right? That's his intention at least. And here the kid that appears to have committed the crimes calls himself the Lil Demon Dog which is a reference to Procyon and Humbaba the Guardian of the Cedar Forest, walks around smelling like death, and drives off into the country possibly towards an area with many cedar trees.

This sort of stuff is why I find it best to just not believe anything.

 

[dangrsmind]

Fame it seems to me..

Seems like a pretty risky way to gain fame doesn't it?

 

[Big Rela]

Hahahaha. I came back on to alot of questions wow. Ok...

Paximus:
As far as a motive like it was mentioned earlier there is a theory that Shrim had sexual relations with one of the victims (which was underage and a staggering 8 yrs younger). If the word on the street about Razakel finding out were true then she may have had Shrim (who would pass this order on to his "unholy apostle" Sam) murder Emma over the situation. With a house full people i doubt he would have kept anyone alive. The only reason i would think he was out there is to make sure this order was carried out. As for your comment on a picture of his car Shrim does not drive and relies on fans and his artist to get around. Another one is all the media attention he received. He begged for interviews at first. Made sure the labeled him owner of Serial Killin Records and all. Then all of a sudden he stopped and said **** reporters? Why stop if you already started? Because his name was on CNN and Yahoo and any other major news that picked up the story.

Ziggy:
I think the police are acquiring as much information as they possibly can to properly implicate others in the crime. I mean you just cant start involving people without the proper evidence because it gives them time to prepare. Alot of people mourned for a couple weeks. I cant say too many really stopped their support of the music. All of the artist i know have continued. Some artist are dumb enough to make tribute tracks and get this throw together a horrorcore concert in their memory (i laughed hard at that one). I doubt Shrim has the power to really blacklist anyone. This genre needs to work with each other to keep the money coming. Its difficult for them to reach other regions without knowing artist in that area since they dont have major label support or even investor with large sums of money. As far as control over his crowd the kids just seem to think what he is saying makes sense. They are sheep. Think Hitler and his stronghold on Germany and you got Shrim and his apostoles.

 

[PAXIMUS]

Never even heard of Steiner before tonight.

I find it best to remain an extreme agnostic so I appreciate your insight here. You say that you believe Shrim is a charlatan, but then how do you explain the Humbaba connection? Pazuzu is on the cover oh his CD so Shrim is either teaching people to invoke this entity or he's using the disc as an evocation itself right? That's his intention at least. And here the kid that appears to have committed the crimes calls himself the Lil Demon Dog which is a reference to Procyon and Humbaba the Guardian of the Cedar Forest, walks around smelling like death, and drives off into the country possibly towards an area with many cedar trees.

This sort of stuff is why I find it best to just not believe anything.

Rudolf Steiner is perhaps the greatest occult scientist in all of history in fact he was so successful in what he did that his works have largely been supressed and never translated from their original German. He was the founder of the Anthroposphy movement and he had his fingers in all sorts of things, the guy was decades ahead of his time, you should look in to him a little I know from what I have seen from you that you will take an immediate interest in Steiner. He is also the founder of Waldorf School System, they are all over the country and many parents send their children to them as opposed to public schools because they offer a really well rounded and solid education. I attended Waldorf schools all my life. Steiner is probably the most interesting person you will ever read about should you ever decide to delve in to his past, he even had and still has a very popular agrucultural movement that many farmers use to this day. He is much more well known in Europe than in America. Hitler shut him down in Germany and he was much an enemy of the Nazis but if there ever was an occult scientist with good honest and true intentions it was Steiner and because of that he is often overlooked in favor of the more dark artists such as Crowley and Blavatsky but anyone who knows their stuff will tell you that Steiner was eons ahead of them in all aspects of occult philosophy and science.

I think Shrim knows the basics but he doesnt know the real esoteric stuff that stuff just isnt something you find in books its mostly oral tradition handed down from teacher to student for thousands of years. I study Buddhism myself and spent time as a monks novice in Thailand for 3 years after college the best and most interesting experience of my life, and am agnostic also for the most part, I am not a practicing occultist and have no intention or time to be one, my interest is purely academic.

IMO Shrim will do or say whatever he has to do or say to make money, he has found his own little schtick subcuture within the horrorcore community, that being the satanic/occult thing, and thats what he does. He probably reads a lot but again I assure you real occult knowledge is not found in any books you have to find a teacher and pass the smell test before they will take you in and teach you the real meaning and purpose of the practice of learning about what we in occult sciences call "higher worlds."

Steiner wrote a good book "How to know higher worlds" its a good place to start for the beginner, he wrote like 400 books in his lifetime and only a handful of them have been translated from German.

 

[PAXIMUS]

Hahahaha. I came back on to alot of questions wow. Ok...

Paximus:
As far as a motive like it was mentioned earlier there is a theory that Shrim had sexual relations with one of the victims (which was underage and a staggering 8 yrs younger). If the word on the street about Razakel finding out were true then she may have had Shrim (who would pass this order on to his "unholy apostle" Sam) murder Emma over the situation. With a house full people i doubt he would have kept anyone alive. The only reason i would think he was out there is to make sure this order was carried out. As for your comment on a picture of his car Shrim does not drive and relies on fans and his artist to get around. Another one is all the media attention he received. He begged for interviews at first. Made sure the labeled him owner of Serial Killin Records and all. Then all of a sudden he stopped and said **** reporters? Why stop if you already started? Because his name was on CNN and Yahoo and any other major news that picked up the story.

Ziggy:
I think the police are acquiring as much information as they possibly can to properly implicate others in the crime. I mean you just cant start involving people without the proper evidence because it gives them time to prepare. Alot of people mourned for a couple weeks. I cant say too many really stopped their support of the music. All of the artist i know have continued. Some artist are dumb enough to make tribute tracks and get this throw together a horrorcore concert in their memory (i laughed hard at that one). I doubt Shrim has the power to really blacklist anyone. This genre needs to work with each other to keep the money coming. Its difficult for them to reach other regions without knowing artist in that area since they dont have major label support or even investor with large sums of money. As far as control over his crowd the kids just seem to think what he is saying makes sense. They are sheep. Think Hitler and his stronghold on Germany and you got Shrim and his apostoles.

I offered Shrim the chance to tell his story over lunch and would fly him in on my dime but I told him I would dictate what questions would be asked and nothing would be off limits. I dont play softball especially the beer league variety and thats what he wanted so it never materialized.

I am trying to pitch this as a feature story for Rolling Stone magazine but having some legal issues getting in the way as far as what I can and cannot speculate about, if I am only able to write about the facts and no speculation about other possible theories then it really isnt worth my time since we dont have many facts as it is. But I am working on something and we will see if anyone picks it up and runs with it. I am not looking for money on this case although this is how I feed myself, I just find it particularly interesting much like I did the Franklin Credit Union Scandal and Johnny Gosch, which I became quite a student of over the years.

As for your theory I have no problem believing there was jealousy and sexual relations/infidelity at the heart of the whole case and from the many, many people inside the community that have opened up to me, this seems to be what they think also. I have to be careful how I word things since I am always being watched and sued for libel/defamation and slander, but continue please, id like to hear more.

My next step is to actually start attending horrorcore shows, parties and events esp any SKR events so if you know of any please let me know, I plan to infiltrate a few of these shows parties and events to get an up close and personal experience of their lifestyle and culture. I have one planned out in Arizona next week and I am hoping its a nice turnout.

 

[NativeGirl]

Seems like a pretty risky way to gain fame doesn't it?

Nope because they didn't do the killings so no risk..