VA - Couple & two teens found murdered, Farmville, 15 Sept 2009 #7

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Heroine said:
I think arguing religion is like beating a dead horse. Everyone will think what they always have and everyone thinks they are right. So it's pretty pointless. I'm a Christian and we believe in God, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost. They are not all the same person in my religion, but in some christian religions they are. So you see even in the same religious category they don't all believe the same. It's pretty debatable.
Either way, to debate religion just causes problems so I try to steer clear of it.
I don't care what anyone else believes. No offense guys.
Sorry if this comes off wrong to anyone. I mean no offense to any of you or your religions.
Edited to say that I don't mean I don't care what you believe in general. I do care about your opinions. Yeah maybe all that came out wrong.
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My interest in religions starts with the idea that no human religion has it quite right, but that none of them have it entirely wrong either. I include Buddhism in this although I find that they have more right than most other religions and they also teach practical methods of living which some others do not. IMO. YMMV.

The Truth pervades even the most perverse beliefs and philosophies.

Mathematics is magic that works.

The universe is waking up.

Love is the answer.
 
My cat has this to say about your sugar glider....

funny-pictures-cat-eats-a-bird.jpg
 
ziggy said:
Not me. I kind of long for angry God: I know some people I'd like the wrath to rain down on!!!! I often cry out loud, "Vengeful God of the Old Testament Where Art Thou???" It's usually when followed by a comment about not caring if so and so got hit by a bus...I'm just kidding.

No seriously though angry Jesus was cool...because he experienced all of our emotions he just handled them with the ultimate mastery.

I don't think Jesus would be against the death penalty. He would definitely want the accused to repent and be forgiven, but death - no biggie.

I also find it amusing that when good points are brought up using multiple scriptures, some refute it because it is apparently not a complete work (which I tend to agree with). However, it doesn't work for me to negate what IS in the Bible by using what isn't. Also, CONCEPTS in the Bible are pretty clear even if exact translation is not to perfection. It's like when I meditate and I get WHOLE thoughts that appear without separate words. I think the Bible has that devine ability to not be lost in translation. I'm not a Christian but I do like my Christians and my Buddists and so on. I find there is more of a common golden thread of wisdom in all religions, but it gets lost in the arguments and the focus on the differences.

Andres is right, no one is going to have a "come to Jesus moment" (that's the best witty thing I can come up with right now) and change their mind on the DP, SO, we should have some actual trial stuff to talk about in a few days and until then please remember:

Emma
Debra
Mark
Mel


Taken brutally and tragically. Their killer surely must pay some sort of debt for this.
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Angry Jesus is Satanism's head of marketing.
 
dangrsmind said:
This used to be true. But IMO gun ownership in America today has little or no impact on the possibility of tyranny here.

Owning a musket used to put an individual on par with a trained soldier. And remember back in the day everyone knew how to use their weapons because they had to. Today the government is armed with with acoustic pain cannons, electronic warfare systems, space based satellite spy systems, remotely piloted drones, tanks, and much more. A rifle will be of little use against these systems.

And most of the armed populace has no idea how to use their weapons in combat. They don't understand basic principles of concentrating fire and using cover and they have no experience or training in the use of their weapons in combat. If it ever came to a real shooting war it wouldn't be pretty.
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There is no argument from me on this as it is all true but I still like to think that an armed populace stands for something. Yes I am delusional I know.
 
Pax, as a Buddhist, you must stand against delusions and superstitions of this sort.

The underlying theme here is that weapons make you safer. This is a very ancient human belief, but it is wrong. Think about where this idea leads in the age of nuclear, chemical, and biological weapons.

These fears and superstitions are hidden deep deep deep inside of our psyches and they date back to the days when men lived in caves and in fear of animals and nature itself. And our fears (and hopes) have been used against us by both gods and devils, and of course by those that purport to represent them on Earth.
 
dangrsmind said:
Pax, as a Buddhist, you must stand against delusions and superstitions of this sort.

The underlying theme here is that weapons make you safer. This is a very ancient human belief, but it is wrong. Think about where this idea leads in the age of nuclear, chemical, and biological weapons.

These fears and superstitions are hidden deep deep deep inside of our psyches and they date back to the days when men lived in caves and in fear of animals and nature itself. And our fears (and hopes) have been used against us by both gods and devils, and of course by those that purport to represent them on Earth.
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Ok, ok I am clearly losing the argument and you are right but how about this......ummm I just like them for target shooting...:crazy:
 
ziggy said:
Yes indeed, if there is a trial I am sure we will hear all about the forensic evidence; and sad to say it will probably be a popular trial because of the gruesome nature of the killings etc. Regardless of how disrespectful that may seem to the victims, I do want justice for Emma, Mel, Debra and Mark...FOUR lives violently taken; stolen from them and from their families.

It's interesting that Pax and Andres feel that society is in decay because people would like criminals to be punished and I feel society starts to degrade when we think everything bad is a "disease" that can be cured and fail to recognize that some people are the equivalent of cancer cells in our communities.

Seriously, of all the diseases there are, how many has medicine actually cured? Likewise with the rehabilitation. Now, as JUVENILLES, I think we totally drop the ball when treating them like adult criminals...that is when the intervention could actually make a huge difference and I would support more money for an overhaul of the juvenile justice system.
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Ziggy, you nailed it babe....IMHO this country has raised a generation of humans,,who think they are all that,,,kids raised in the last 2 decades have always been told,,,you are the princess and prince,,and their parents have given to them to a point,,they care for noone but themselves...Kids today have no manners,,,WHATSOEVER,,,,,they are such spoiled creatures,,,I cannot stand to be around many of them.....Everything is about them,,self-centered is a word that comes to my mind......,never mind they may have a loving Aunt or Uncle who could use their help,,,raking leaves,,etc..But only if they get paid will they help....Everything is about,,what is in it for me.........When the govt stepped in and told parents how NOT to be parents ie:spanking,,,,,parents all over this country have been held hostage by their own kids.....Don't tell me different,,I have seen time and time and time again,,,where the parent have said if I try to discipline my child "I will go to jail",,,and the kids use this against them..........People,,there is a big,,big,,big difference in spanking a child for bad actions and child abuse.....Instead of parenting, they give their child "meds" to calm them down or make them passive....What do they think will happen when that child goes off the meds.......When something bad happens and anyone,,young or old,,is the guilty party,,most people nowadays wants to blame everyone and everything as a reason it happened.......The biggest cause ,I've heard people want to use is the bi-polar excuse,,,,,WHAT?????? Children need to learn,,if they do bad things,,,there WILL be consequences....Setting in a corner for a "time out" or taking their fav video game is NOT constructive parenting in my book,,,and the last 20 years since this started,,look around,,,just look around at the attitudes and behaviours of the kids .....The future of this country...pitiful....IMO
 
southernvagirl said:
Ziggy, you nailed it babe....IMHO this country has raised a generation of humans,,who think they are all that,,,kids raised in the last 2 decades have always been told,,,you are the princess and prince,,and their parents have given to them to a point,,they care for noone but themselves...Kids today have no manners,,,WHATSOEVER,,,,,they are such spoiled creatures,,,I cannot stand to be around many of them.....Everything is about them,,self-centered is a word that comes to my mind......,never mind they may have a loving Aunt or Uncle who could use their help,,,raking leaves,,etc..But only if they get paid will they help....Everything is about,,what is in it for me.........When the govt stepped in and told parents how NOT to be parents ie:spanking,,,,,parents all over this country have been held hostage by their own kids.....Don't tell me different,,I have seen time and time and time again,,,where the parent have said if I try to discipline my child "I will go to jail",,,and the kids use this against them..........People,,there is a big,,big,,big difference in spanking a child for bad actions and child abuse.....Instead of parenting, they give their child "meds" to calm them down or make them passive....What do they think will happen when that child goes off the meds.......When something bad happens and anyone,,young or old,,is the guilty party,,most people nowadays wants to blame everyone and everything as a reason it happened.......The biggest cause ,I've heard people want to use is the bi-polar excuse,,,,,WHAT?????? Children need to learn,,if they do bad things,,,there WILL be consequences....Setting in a corner for a "time out" or taking their fav video game is NOT constructive parenting in my book,,,and the last 20 years since this started,,look around,,,just look around at the attitudes and behaviours of the kids .....The future of this country...pitiful....IMO
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One place to start "looking around" is at the declining rate of violent crime in the United States during this exact same period of time which you are talking about. If permissive parenting is to blame, then it is to blame for one of the largest decreases in violent behavior ever recorded.
 
dangrsmind said:
One place to start "looking around" is at the declining rate of violent crime in the United States during this exact same period of time which you are talking about. If permissive parenting is to blame, then it is to blame for one of the largest decreases in violent behavior ever recorded.
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This is just another great example of people looking for easy answers to complex questions. Everyone complains about single parent families etc yet there is less voilent crime than ever before.
 
PAXIMUS said:
Ok, ok I am clearly losing the argument and you are right but how about this......ummm I just like them for target shooting...:crazy:
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Oh well, now we are talking. But also, shooting is just plain fun.

Especially automatic weapons. I got to fire a variety of weapons during a visit to Fort Benning back in the 90s.

Also, there used to be this place outside of Vegas where you could shoot machine guns while being served martinis by girls in bikinis. This was probably a bad idea.
 
dangrsmind said:
Oh well, now we are talking. But also, shooting is just plain fun.

Especially automatic weapons. I got to fire a variety of weapons during a visit to Fort Benning back in the 90s.

Also, there used to be this place outside of Vegas where you could shoot machine guns while being served martinis by girls in bikinis. This was probably a bad idea.
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LOL only in Vegas.
 
PAXIMUS said:
LOL only in Vegas.
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If you are in Vegas, look for the fliers advertising this. You won't find it in the telephone book or on the web. Those are different places and they are without the martinis...

Of course the police may have shut this down by now too. That would be smart. ;)

cats_bat_county.jpg
 
dangrsmind said:
One place to start "looking around" is at the declining rate of violent crime in the United States during this exact same period of time which you are talking about. If permissive parenting is to blame, then it is to blame for one of the largest decreases in violent behavior ever recorded.
Click to expand...

Hmm maybe you are just now getting old enough not to relate to the younger crowd now? Yes they are spoiled, but no more than we were. You are just seeing it now. In my experience spanking my kids does little to prevent them from being bad again. Actually taking away TV and especially putting them in timeout is much more effective. But this is just my first hand experience. Those teenage years are just brutal all the emotion running wild. Anyways don't take this wrong just what I think.
 
I too see a complete change in "kids these days". There seem to be extremes; throw away kids of crack heads (generally) and the entitlement kis being raised to become perfect narcissists (and I usually spell that wrong just in case). Here's an interesting link:
http://www.narcissismepidemic.com/

And, BTW, there are plenty of ex and currently military that could help out the civilians if we needed them to..I'm down for some shooting. I miss my Baretta and mini 14. I have a Lady Smith & Wesson .38; it's too light actually and only good for up close personal management; sucks at the range. Looking into another handgun - any suggestions?

Sam will most likely get the continuation granted, shucks, his attorney has had NO TIME apparently to think about a psych eval until just now. Duh. The atty probably waited on purpose because HE needs more time to dust off his tap dancin' shoes. :)
 
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