VA VA - David Metzler, 19, & Heidi Childs, 18, fatally shot, Montgomery Co, 26 Aug 2009

[TedMac]

I have to come back to this case every now and then. I have friend I grew up with who lives out that way and one of his step children attended VT. I've been out to visit many times and I've attended other events out that way that are near the scene. I believe this is going to be a case where the killer is arrested for something else and they run his DNA. After the first year, I don't believe LE had any POI.

My son was beginning his freshman year at Radford when this occurred and we were in the process of moving him into his dormitory room. So, I have followed this case as closely as possible. I agree that LE has no POI or motive for the killings. It seems to be a random murder which are the most difficult to solve. Plus, with Heidi being the daughter of a Va State Trooper, you know that LE used every resourcece available.

Motiveless killings are the most difficult to solve

 

[geojeffrey]

Agreed about the random nature of the crime. Glad there is DNA...there are also clues in the selection of this remote location. The perp has some sort of ties to the area IMHO...


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[JnRyan]

Agreed about the random nature of the crime. Glad there is DNA...there are also clues in the selection of this remote location. The perp has some sort of ties to the area IMHO...


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I agree. I can't see this as David and Heidi being specifically targeted. I don't believe either one knew their killer. The choice of weapon is strange. A 30-30 rifle. A fairly common deer hunting rifle, but a uncommon choice for someone planning a murder. With VA Tech nearby there are probably a lot of former students - and their friends - that are aware of that area.

The only way for this to be solved is for the killer to be arrested for another felony and have their DNA match.

 

[Pettibon Junction]

The choice of weapon is strange. A 30-30 rifle. A fairly common deer hunting rifle, but a uncommon choice for someone planning a murder.

Dollars to donuts, the killer IS a deer hunter.

Wonder if police have coordinated with fish & game to determine how many locals were issued permits that year and cross-reference the names against known offenders. I wouldn't be surprised if this guy had a record for poaching.

 

[Just Some Guy]

Dollars to donuts, the killer IS a deer hunter.

Wonder if police have coordinated with fish & game to determine how many locals were issued permits that year and cross-reference the names against known offenders. I wouldn't be surprised if this guy had a record for poaching.

August 26 is too early for centerfire rifle season there. I'm fairly certain it's too early for any deer hunting at all.

The possibility exists that it was a road-rage incident, and the suspect(s) just happened to have the weapon in the vehicle. The vast majority of weapons chambered for the.30-30 cartridge are lever action rifles, which are an exceedingly bad choice to carry out a planned robbery/murder/other violent crime.

 

[Pettibon Junction]

August 26 is too early for centerfire rifle season there. I'm fairly certain it's too early for any deer hunting at all.

The possibility exists that it was a road-rage incident, and the suspect(s) just happened to have the weapon in the vehicle. The vast majority of weapons chambered for the.30-30 cartridge are lever action rifles, which are an exceedingly bad choice to carry out a planned robbery/murder/other violent crime.

Is the 30-30 also popular as a trap/skeet shooting rifle?

 

[Just Some Guy]

Is the 30-30 also popular as a trap/skeet shooting rifle?

Not sure if serious? Skeet requires a shotgun.

 

[Pettibon Junction]

Serious. Not well-acquainted with guns. It's been brought up before but there is a gun range near the crime scene. I've long thought that the killer might have come from there the night of the murder and taken advantage of the situation.

 

[Just Some Guy]

Understood. That's entirely possible.

The .30-30 fires a single projectile, which would make it nearly impossible for most shooters to use it for skeet. A shotgun, when used for skeet, fires many smaller projectiles in a pattern, which makes it the gun of choice for such activities.

 

[billthom56]

There has been an arrest in the August 2004 unsolved double homicide of Lindsay Cutshall and Jason Allen in Sonoma County, California. The couple, counselors at a Christian youth camp, were found shot to death by rifle fire in their sleeping bags at a campsite on a beautiful isolated beach along the Pacific Ocean. They were engaged to be married a few weeks later. Sonoma County Sherriffs believe it was a random act, and so far have no link between the victims and their alleged killer.

I see some similarities in the two cases between that of Cutshall/Allen and Childs/Metzler. Certainly it bears checking out if the suspect in the Sonoma case ever traveled to Virginia. The San Francisco Gate story lays out the suspect's extensive arrest record and survivalist background. He was arrested for the murder of his brother in March 2017.

http://www.sfgate.com/crime/article/Officials-to-announce-significant-11123968.php


Bill Thomas
Brother of Cathleen Thomas
Colonial Parkway Murders.

 

[Just Some Guy]

A lever action rifle was used in the CA case, too. Interesting.

 

[JnRyan]

30-30 was the caliber and while the lever action was, by far, the most common action the cartridge was also used in pump action and bolt action rifles. (Admittedly, those were not very common and bullet forensics might be very unique in those instances.)

Growing up hunting in the south it wasn't uncommon to see a lever action rifle in a gun rack in a pick-up. I haven't seen that in Virginia, but I don't spend much time in rural areas and even less in the western part of the state where rifles can be used for deer hunting.

I have difficult time trying to see a motive for shooting these two unarmed college students. A thrill kill by some unbalanced person? Two persons in the wrong place at the wrong time - i.e., mistaken identity?

I keep coming back here, checking Reddit, Blink and general internet searches. In the last year there has been almost nothing on the internet. I'm hoping something breaks on this in the near future. There needs to be justice here for Heidi and David.

 

[TedMac]

30-30 was the caliber and while the lever action was, by far, the most common action the cartridge was also used in pump action and bolt action rifles. (Admittedly, those were not very common and bullet forensics might be very unique in those instances.)

Growing up hunting in the south it wasn't uncommon to see a lever action rifle in a gun rack in a pick-up. I haven't seen that in Virginia, but I don't spend much time in rural areas and even less in the western part of the state where rifles can be used for deer hunting.

I have difficult time trying to see a motive for shooting these two unarmed college students. A thrill kill by some unbalanced person? Two persons in the wrong place at the wrong time - i.e., mistaken identity?

I keep coming back here, checking Reddit, Blink and general internet searches. In the last year there has been almost nothing on the internet. I'm hoping something breaks on this in the near future. There needs to be justice here for Heidi and David.

BBM I agree with everything you wrote and coming from a criminal justice background, I can attest that motiveless killings are the most difficult to solve. Some have speculated that Heidi may have been killed as revenge for something her father may have done. He was a VA State Trooper. But, this probably isnt the motive as he served as a helicopter pilot and thus would have had very little contact with the general public. Also, if my memory is correct, Heidi and David's trip that evening was put together at the last minute and very few people knew they were actually going. So, even if someone had a grudge against one of them, they probably would not have known they were going there that evening. They began dating when they were in their teens and had been a couple for over three years, so it is doubtful they had any ex-boyfriend/girlfriends lurking around. I don't believe that LE has ever stated if there was a sexual assault or not in this case. Unless it was someone stalking the area (which has been described by some as a lover's lane) waiting for a chance to rape & kill, this almost has to be a thrill kill. M.O.O.

 

[Tulessa]

Is the 30-30 also popular as a trap/skeet shooting rifle?

No, hubby & I both Skeet shoot. We use shotguns.

 

[JnRyan]

BBM I agree with everything you wrote and coming from a criminal justice background, I can attest that motiveless killings are the most difficult to solve. Some have speculated that Heidi may have been killed as revenge for something her father may have done. He was a VA State Trooper. But, this probably isnt the motive as he served as a helicopter pilot and thus would have had very little contact with the general public. Also, if my memory is correct, Heidi and David's trip that evening was put together at the last minute and very few people knew they were actually going. So, even if someone had a grudge against one of them, they probably would not have known they were going there that evening. They began dating when they were in their teens and had been a couple for over three years, so it is doubtful they had any ex-boyfriend/girlfriends lurking around. I don't believe that LE has ever stated if there was a sexual assault or not in this case. Unless it was someone stalking the area (which has been described by some as a lover's lane) waiting for a chance to rape & kill, this almost has to be a thrill kill. M.O.O.

You're possible theory of someone stalking the area makes this almost sound like how the Zodiac killer was with at least one of his killings. But we haven't seen or heard of crimes with similar patterns or MO. Not a serial killer? The fact that it was put together by Heidi and David would seem to indicate they were not specifically targeted. That is, they were in the wrong place at the wrong time. Yes, a thrill kill sounds more likely.

This rifle is going to be extremely difficult if not impossible to track as the primary info that breaks the case. Such a rifle might have been inherited or given as gift decades ago.

I'm wondering if LE knows the caliber from the shell casings at the scene or a recovered bullet. (Although, in that part of the country a spent shell casing or casings doesn't necessarily mean it is associated with the crime. Someone could have fired a 30-30 there a couple of days before the murder if it were just shell casings.) If they recovered a bullet then they might have ballistics and even been able to narrow it down to a Winchester, Marlin or Savage or other manufacturer.

Now that LE has announced the caliber, there is a possibility the killer no longer has the gun. Given to a relative? Sold? Or thrown into water or buried?

 

[JnRyan]

The most recent update I can find. Apparently, there is a task force headed by the sheriff's department that is still tracking this case. Not just one or two investigators.

https://radfordnewsjournal.com/top-...-virginia-tech-students-caldwell-fields-2009/

I hear about the 30-30 and the DNA now. But I don't hear about the different cars LE was originally looking for that were in that general area that night. I wonder if they tracked them down? Ruled out? Didn't hear or see anything?

 

[TedMac]

The most recent update I can find. Apparently, there is a task force headed by the sheriff's department that is still tracking this case. Not just one or two investigators.

https://radfordnewsjournal.com/top-...-virginia-tech-students-caldwell-fields-2009/

I hear about the 30-30 and the DNA now. But I don't hear about the different cars LE was originally looking for that were in that general area that night. I wonder if they tracked them down? Ruled out? Didn't hear or see anything?

It is my understanding that they (LE) checked and double-checked every lead and tip they had and nothing panned out.

 

[JnRyan]

LE is obviously going to have it tough. David and Heidi probably only told a few close friends what they were going to do so they weren't likely targeted specifically. Build a fire in a fire pit, play the guitar and sing. But it appears they were in the car - David was shot while in the car and Heidi outside. (She jumped out and ran when he was shot?) Hard to tell if they were done and preparing to leave or they got suspicious and jumped in the car. Since they weren't found till the next morning, the fire could have burned out without anyone putting it out. This killer was bold. Even though the road was lightly traveled he did it there within sight of the road. But he was sloppy. He took her purse and that is possibly when he left DNA. And he left his shell casings and that tells LE right there what the caliber of the gun was. The firing pin mark on the case or cases can be traced back to the gun even if they can't get a bullet that isn't too badly deformed to test. I wonder if LE got usable tire tracks or shoe impressions. I certainly hope so.

 

[TedMac]

LE is obviously going to have it tough. David and Heidi probably only told a few close friends what they were going to do so they weren't likely targeted specifically. Build a fire in a fire pit, play the guitar and sing. But it appears they were in the car - David was shot while in the car and Heidi outside. (She jumped out and ran when he was shot?) Hard to tell if they were done and preparing to leave or they got suspicious and jumped in the car. Since they weren't found till the next morning, the fire could have burned out without anyone putting it out. This killer was bold. Even though the road was lightly traveled he did it there within sight of the road. But he was sloppy. He took her purse and that is possibly when he left DNA. And he left his shell casings and that tells LE right there what the caliber of the gun was. The firing pin mark on the case or cases can be traced back to the gun even if they can't get a bullet that isn't too badly deformed to test. I wonder if LE got usable tire tracks or shoe impressions. I certainly hope so.

BBM The quotes from LE leads us to believe that David was hit with the first shot and Heidi tried to make a deperate run for it. But nobody except the killer knows for sure.

I don't think LE has any tire tracks. They made a list of several vehicles that were seen in the area based on information provided by local residents. That leads me to think they have no idea what kind of a vehicle he may have used (or even if he used a vehicle).

I've never herd any mention of show prints, but that could be information LE is not releasing to the pubic.

 

[JnRyan]

[/B]
BBM The quotes from LE leads us to believe that David was hit with the first shot and Heidi tried to make a deperate run for it. But nobody except the killer knows for sure.

I don't think LE has any tire tracks. They made a list of several vehicles that were seen in the area based on information provided by local residents. That leads me to think they have no idea what kind of a vehicle he may have used (or even if he used a vehicle).

I've never herd any mention of show prints, but that could be information LE is not releasing to the pubic.

This is one I wish someone would make a podcast to cover it. It wouldn't likely solve it but the publicity might help.

I've looked through several articles and all state David was found in the car. They also state Heidi was found outside the car "some distance away" or "a short distance away". I did find a couple of articles stating she was in front of the car. If that's true I wonder if the killer pulled his vehicle up behind theirs, shot David from the back and when Heidi ran her position in front might indicate she ran in the opposite direction the shooter was in relation to David's car. Or he walked up behind their vehicle. I've also read that it was believed that they were killed between 8:25 and 10:00 PM. It was a Wednesday night and I believe Heidi had to get back to study, so maybe that is the reason for that time frame - 8:25 (killed on arrival) or 10:00 (killed just before leaving). That time frame was also in the Virginia Sheriff's Assoc. FB page on 30 March 2012 in a post from Sheriff Tommy Whitt.

Also interesting in that same statement by the sheriff, he states there were still vehicles they were trying to locate as of 30 March 2012:

1. Green Sedan (Possibly a Taurus or Intrepid) stopping in front of residences on Craig Creek Road around 6:00PM.
2. A dark Blue Dodge Caravan seen parked at the Montgomery County/Craig County line near a logging site around 8:30PM.
3. A dark colored, older model van or min‐van parked at Caldwell Fields after dark.
4. A dark colored Ford Crown Victoria or Chevrolet Caprice seen driving Craig Creek Road around 10:00PM.
5. A red or red/white Dodge pick‐up with dual exhaust and oversized tires, tinted windows, extended cab, driving up Lee Road approximately 11:00PM that night. Lee Road is directly across the street from Caldwell Fields.
6. A gray or cream colored Pontiac Bonneville early 2000 model, parked near Caldwell Field around midnight.

#3 was parked there "after dark". Sunset on 26 August was at 8:03 so that one is interesting. #6 parked "near" (not in the lot?) is also interesting. If they drove into the lot they would have seen David's car.

That is the most recent I've seen regarding the vehicles.