VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #13

[jjw]

Expanding on this thought. Mine is a very unpopular opinion for sure. This latest charge doesn't come as a surprise at all, does it? Just about everyone here assumed Hannah got in his car. Most assumed they would find something in the car/apartment to show Hannah was with JM after they left the bar. What LE cannot know, imo, is whether she went willingly or participated in any sex willingly. The 'abduction with intent to defile' charge in Virginia is interesting to me. When I was young and going to clubs, just about every guy that took a girl home would have been guilty of this. Telling a girl he'd take her home, then putting the moves on her.

Ok, sure...things look really bad for JM, but I'm not as willing as all you guys to pin every murder in Virginia on him. And really, while we are almost certain she is dead, until they find her body it's not fair to assume JM killed her.

BBM

I think you're confused about the meaning of abduction with intent to defile. It's not just picking up women in bars and taking them home to have sex with.


In Virginia, an abduction with intent to defile charge is a criminal Class 2 felony offense punishable under Va. Code Ann. § 18.2-48.

Under Va. Code Ann. § 18.2-48 “Abduction (i) of any person with the intent to extort money or pecuniary benefit, (ii) of any person with intent to defile such person, (iii) of any child under sixteen years of age for the purpose of concubinage or prostitution, (iv) of any person for the purpose of prostitution, or (v) of any minor for the purpose of manufacturing child *advertiser censored* shall be punishable as a Class 2 felony. If the sentence imposed for a violation of (ii), (iii), (iv), or (v) includes a term of confinement less than life imprisonment, the judge shall impose, in addition to any active sentence, a suspended sentence of no less than 40 years. This suspended sentence shall be suspended for the remainder of the defendant’s life subject to revocation by the court.”

jmo

 

[Eileen730]

Maybe he was drunk and so wasn't thinking clearly.

He zeroed right in on her.
JMO
she was the one that intoxicated I believe and he took advantage of that. JMO

I cant give him the benefit of doubt till he opens his pie hole (LOL) and says something.
He has waited to long and time is run out!

 

[sophiebelle]

Bless his heart - trying desperately to find Hannah and getting so much grief due to his tone of voice, his gesturing, etc. Do your thing Chief and find Hannah!!

I hope those who have negative things to say about his tactics and emotions, are never in the position of this family. My guess is, they would change their tunes. I think he's seen and read the criticisms of him. He's working so hard, and has to look the Graham's in the face.

 

[Clover1099]

That's what I was thinking. The party after she had dinner.

It is possible to get disoriented, anxious and lost. It shouldn't be so quickly ruled out.

 

[Elley Mae]

SBM

depends what she was drinking. If it was just beer, probably not so intoxicated. If she downed a couple shots of everclear she could have been really drunk. In my college days, all kinds of alcohol would show up at parties. Could be she drank a variety of things that made her sick, hence the stumbling, then threw up and was better after.

everclear is not legal in VA and just banned in MD just an fyi

 

[Suthrnqt]

Please bear with me as I not sufficiently caffeinated~~
Did something happen overnight that now allows us to discuss other cases that may or may not be connected to Hannah's disappearance?

 

[waltzingmatilda]

I don't think we can post links to blogs, but I am hopeful that sharing this sort of info is okay...if not, sorry mods for extra work and snip away, if need be.

I came across a blog that I can best identify as The CTH and with a title of serial abductor? as the headline when doing a Google search a short while ago.

Most of the info there is not unlike comments and thoughts here...except for this.

A man on the blog said that he is very sure that he saw JM yesterday in Wilmington, NC (he mentioned, too, that it is a college town), that he was extremely polite and even held the door open for him. He said that he never forgets a face and it was (in his opinion) the same guy -- and that he was wearing khaki shorts.

His comments about the demeanor made me think of the landlady's comment about how he had been "extra nice" lately.

The man said that he called the tip line and that his wife was giving him heck for getting involved.

And, therein, lies the problem...in my opinion. Nobody wants to get involved, or those who do want to get involved are discouraged by family and friends.

Just think if all those people seen on the video where JM and WG first appeared got involved. Maybe the outcome would have been different.

Something else that is haunting me is a post that HG made on her twitter account on 8/29 -- "Got an alone drunk girl to a bus tonight #hoosgotyourback"

Sadly, nobody had Hannah's back that night. No wing woman. No involved person to help her to the bus. So very, very sad.

Praying for Hannah and her family.

Well that's creepy since ILM is my stomping grounds. The poster also said in a later post that the guy had an almost northern accent, no southern drawl, and that his khakis didn't sag and that being nice is unheard of in this town. IMO, if my picture was plastered on a wanted poster everywhere with known connections to areas north of me, I'd head to points south. I wish the poster had told the location that he saw this man and if the man had dreds. Wonder if it was near UNCW? I'll BOLO. Thanks for sharing msteach!

 

[Eileen730]

I feel the intent to defile is an attempted rape!

 

[Clover1099]

BBM

I think you're confused about the meaning of abduction with intent to defile. It's not just picking up women in bars and taking them home to have sex with.

I think she is also confused about the meaning of "abduction"

 

[Elley Mae]

MOD NOTE:

Use the threads below for comparison of elements in Hannah's disappearance to facts in other cases. This thread is to be used only to discuss Hannah's disappearance. Your cooperation will be greatly appreciated. The discussion is moving very rapidly, and facts will be easily confused if not kept separate.

Thanks again.

Morgan Harrington
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=107653

Alexis Murphy/ Randy Taylor
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=242645

Rt 29 Stalker
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=219239

Colonial Parkway Murders
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=85425

This is the last post from Bessie on the matter.

 

[cady]

INTENT=INTEND?
Because you can=That you will?

That word bothers me. Intent to defile, like saying because he wants to be with her he will. idk Not saying he is or isn't guilty I just don't like it when the police can make up stuff to get or hold you. jmo idk

They must believe that they have evidence of INTENT. In a trial, specific intent must be proven.....JMO

 

[Eileen730]

INTENT=INTEND?
Because you can=That you will?

That word bothers me. Intent to defile, like saying because he wants to be with her he will. idk Not saying he is or isn't guilty I just don't like it when the police can make up stuff to get or hold you. jmo idk

I think they used Intent till they can prove he did!
They have to find her

 

[Elley Mae]

They must believe that they have evidence of INTENT. In a trial, specific intent must be proven.....JMO

Just a little scary to me, like saying that we know what you are thinking.

 

[ninij9]

This aspect is bothering me so much. I went to my 18 year old sophomore straight A college student daughter. This is what she thought: Hannah looks go composed to be so drunk that she made all those mistakes. But a drug like Molly and energy drink based mixed drinks would give her euphoria and major mental impairment while retaining her motor skills. I put out that perhaps she was dosed possibly without her knowledge at a party? Also my daughter thinks was a crime of opportunity by JM.

 

[Bearmama]

I'm a newbie, so thanks in advance for your patience with me. IMO, with all the walking/running HG did, I think that probably helped to sober her up. I would think if I were as inebriated as is speculated she was, I'd have just sat down on the curb and given up on finding out where I was. My thoughts are by the time she reached the mall, she was coherent enough to be aware of her surroundings. I also think that HG, being intelligent and kind, was probably polite to whomever approached her. She may not have wanted to be outwardly rude or off-putting if she didn't initially feel threatened. Perhaps it was suggested she go into Tempo to have a drink (maybe even water), and after talking w JW, was comfortable enough to leave with him. She was tired after coming down from an evening of drinking then walking all over town. If he offered a ride home, she may have accepted. Maybe it's wishful thinking, but also in my scenario I think she got into his car, fell asleep/passed out, he may have decided to take photographs, then when they arrived near her apartment, she was still in a deep sleep and he didn't know what to do with her. Hopefully he dropped her somewhere, thought I guess by know she would have shown up. Having graduated from UVa and having a daughter who almost enrolled there as a first year this fall, this situation has made me a more nervous mother than I already was. I'm trying not to think about the worst case scenario.

 

[Perplexed 123]

Just a little scary to me, like saying that we know what you are thinking.

maybe LE have pictures/text messages which in someway establish his intent?
it is the only thing that I can think of, atm :thinking:

 

[Eileen730]

INTENT=INTEND?
Because you can=That you will?

That word bothers me. Intent to defile, like saying because he wants to be with her he will. idk Not saying he is or isn't guilty I just don't like it when the police can make up stuff to get or hold you. jmo idk

I think they used Intent till they can prove he did!
They have to find her

 

[MuddyTires]

INTENT=INTEND?
Because you can=That you will?

That word bothers me. Intent to defile, like saying because he wants to be with her he will. idk Not saying he is or isn't guilty I just don't like it when the police can make up stuff to get or hold you. jmo idk

They could arrest him for abduction. The difference between abduction and abduction with intent to defile is the former is a Class 5 felony and the latter is a Class 2 felony.

 

[Eileen730]

maybe LE have pictures/text messages which in someway establish his intent?
it is the only thing that I can think of, atm :thinking:

Im thinking something in his car.

 

[cady]

I feel the intent to defile is an attempted rape!

Read post #281 JMO