VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #13

[Perplexed 123]

can we give the judging a rest and focus on finding HG?

 

[ninij9]

I don't like these hearsay comments. Sorry if I offend, but there is nothing to support this kind of comment. Fud he go on the record saying that?

 

[Phoebeb]

Beautiful post. I think how I would feel if that were my kid on those videos, wandering around, alone, with no one to help. Just creepers waiting to exploit her. It's very sad that she was so alone and so vulnerable and no one stopped to ask of she was okay. Just a lost kid, really.

She was in second year at UVA though. I believe she was lost or turned around earlier that night, but once on the mall, I just don't think she was lost. On her twitter page, Aug 20, she says: "got an alone drunk girl to a bus tonight #hoosgotyourback"
("hoos'' is nickname for UVA students- Wahoos, hoos)

It's perplexing trying to figure where she was heading at the time she's seen on the video from the mall- maybe a bus stop to get her back to where she lived at Grand Marc??

 

[Xara]

He is all over my local news, and I am in Mass.

 

[DavidC]

Awesome post. The police knowing Jesse is not responsible would explain the lack of urgency and warning about Jesse in the pressed yesterday. Could Chief Longo be so deflated because he knows the investigation is back to square one?

It happens all the time . My ex's family would actually call when they thought a warrant might be issued for for them ,to see it their was one and would decided if they would turn themselves in or not. Sometimes they would even tell the magistrate judge what day they would be there to turn themselves in.

IMO the only way they would really not know where he is would be if they know he is not the person who made Hannah disappear and their resources are really on other sources .

All the mistakes LE are making in the media seem to imply text book profile prep behavior ..

Watch the presser and then read how the FBI profile styles. A person lying is a person lying and even if the motives are different the signs are still the same ,KWIM?

 

[eddy]

Hi all, my first post but have been following the case here since the beginning. I'm not sure if anyone else has already mentioned this but here is what I think.

I think LE does not have any DNA or otherwise solid evidence that Hannah was in the car or the apartment.

Now I thought the new charge of abduction with intent to defile is interesting for two reasons. First off, it's a felony which means if he has fled the state then when he is caught, he can be sent back to Virginia to deal with the Charlottesville police regarding Hannah (whereas the reckless driving charges were misdemeanors and not a cause for extradition). Second of all, I think that because he was seen walking with Hannah with his arm around her when she was apparently very intoxicated, that LE believes he was basically walking her where he wants to go and because she was intoxicated, that she was not able to willingly consent and thus LE considers this to be abduction. As for "intent to defile", that can mean a lot of different things. I am guessing that LE has interviewed witnesses who claim to see/hear JM trying to get Hannah to come home with him or perhaps they removed unused condoms from his car or apartment and because that's the case, it means that JM would have likely had sex with her if Hannah did end up going home with him. There's no telling what evidence LE has to warrant the "intent to defile" charge so of course it's all speculation for now.

So I believe they went to Tempo and that's where their interaction ended after Hannah rejected the idea of going home with him. So JM eventually left in his car alone... but I have no ideas as to where Hannah could have gone once he left without her. I know early on there were eyewitnesses claiming to see her get into his car but I don't know how many witnesses there are or how detailed or how credible they are.

Have there been any witnesses from Tempo that have spoken out to the press about what they saw? And what exactly happened within Tempo? How long were they there? Did it look like Hannah was too drunk to be coherent? Did it look like Hannah and JM were being friendly with each other or was JM making her stay with him against her will?

Obviously this is all just my opinion and I'm sure LE is withholding a ton of information/possible evidence to make their case, but as of right now, I don't feel like we are all that much closer to figuring out exactly what happened and most importantly, finding Hannah.

Planting the seed of reasonable doubt huh? Nice job

 

[snarkymalarkey]

This is ridiculous, and sad that you think this is an appropriate place to rage against HG's friends, who have also been victimized by this. The ONLY person to blame here is whoever is responsible for HG's disappearance and suspected harm.

Additionally, you have no idea how much she drank at the party, who supplied it to her, how many people may have offered to take her home, whether she was "extremely intoxicated" when she left, whether drugs were involved, etc. I don't know when "your day" was, but I was in college more than twenty years ago and this could have just as easily happened then.

That aside, this is not the place for finger pointing at her friends and loved ones.

This just happened at a different university: http://www.newsweek.com/fraternity-suspended-alleged-date-rape-plot-272072

So while, she may have been somewhere with friends, other people may not have had the best intentions. There seems to be a 45-50 minute gap before she shows up on security cameras, and nobody knows where she was or what happened. What if her unit was in the same building, 2 doors down, or one floor away, or right next door. What if prior to this day, she had demonstrated the ability to independently leave and arrive at destinations in a timely manner, such as getting to a class, or going to the grocery store? The police stated she was vulnerable due to alcohol consumption, I can only imagine that her friends also had clouded judgment when they didn't dissuade her from not accepting an offered buddy to walk with.

 

[kathryann]

I just read the arrest reports that say TRESPASS AFTER FORBIDDEN - this is probably a dumb question but what was he trespassing on or in?

 

[daily]

Does anyone know, after he is arrested, how long before probable cause hearing? I think thats when the police have to state their evidence.

 

[Tracey4AU]

Awesome post. The police knowing Jesse is not responsible would explain the lack of urgency and warning about Jesse in the pressed yesterday. Could Chief Longo be so deflated because he knows the investigation is back to square one?

Huh??? Why is the investigation back to square one?

 

[Bravo]

IMO Longo was feeling sadness. Based on some prelim forensics he knows this will end badly for Hannah.

 

[Elley Mae]

I just read the arrest reports that say TRESPASS AFTER FORBIDDEN - this is probably a dumb question but what was he trespassing on or in?

Sounds like he was on the wrong side of the sign.

 

[Lovepink]

Does anyone know, after he is arrested, how long before probable cause hearing? I think thats when the police have to state their evidence.

There's already been a probable cause hearing. That's how they got the warrants from the magistrate.

 

[atthelake]

long time lurker- first time poster!

so sorry if this has already been discussed- i read somewhere that JM had been convicted of trespassing in 2010, has anyone been able to find out any details about that trespassing charge? like, if he had been lurking around someones rural property?

:wagon: laurherm! :seeya:

 

[Elainetk]

They would have to arrest half the school. There are so many students over 21 who can obtain alcohol. If she refused to be walked home it is not something someone (who is probably enebriated also) can force on someone who doesn't want to be accompanied. My daughters friends have done that. Not only that, at this age they do not realize what could happen.

 

[Bravo]

They would not have upped the charges yesterday if they did not have something concrete IMO. FBI is involved. I highly doubt all LE Agencies are in cahoots to nail Jesse just because they want to.

 

[bakerlady]

BBM

Then what evidence did they use to charge him? I can't see them establishing PC based on the fact they left Tempo together...

There could have been texts or photos on his phone. Or as I said earlier he could have purchased condoms and perhaps the receipt was in the car or the clerk that sold them to him reported it to police.

If he went out and purchased condoms at 1:45 that would be very telling.

 

[jamicat]

Well, the people who bought the alcohol/threw the party can be charged with providing alcohol to a minor, maybe they already have. It's just a ticket and a fine. I'm thinking they probably haven't charged them with anything because LE doesn't want to set the precedent that you'll get in trouble if you fess up and provide LE with info.[/QUO

No, I don't expect LE to go after those students with charges. First of all, at this time it's more important that the info was given, which it was. LE knew definitively that Hannah was "extremely intoxicated' when she left that dinner/party. Got it from those there. They knew she had drunk too much, and some even offered to escort her home and she declined. And I agree full that it's a delicate balance when info is needed and those having it have something to hide which impedes the investigation. I have no problem with LE giving these students a pass on this even officially to get the info. The same with Tempo where Hannah might well have been served a drink though already confused, underage, and with some idea that JM was going to try to pick her up. There are times, when there are bigger fish to catch, and so you let the small things go.

But give it all a free pass and say they also are the victims? Nope. It should be clear that they contributed to what happened, because they did. It's not a decent thing to do to let someone you know is drunk or in bad shape to go out on his/her own. Plain out bad. I wouldn't do it and hope my friends and family would not either. And this was an underage (for alcohol), female at night, off campus. They should be ashamed of themselves, and they should be doing some atonement on their own and spreading the word that you don't let disoriented friends, leave a place alone. Help them out, accompany or call campus security. For all I know, UVA has been having some words with them about this.

As for Tempo, as it's a business establishment, ummm. Tough one there. Hopefully all who were there that night are full cooperating, and again if LE is giving them a bit of a pass for that, I'm not complaining.

But that private dinner/party, those were Hannah's friends! I just shake my head at that one. No, it would not have happened, never happened in my circle of classmates. Anyone out of it, some quietly kept an eye out for him/her. And most of us lived off campus too in an area not considered as safe as Charlotteville.

 

[skibaboo]

Joe St. George ‏@JoeStGeorge 2m
Just finished speaking with #JesseMatthew attorney. He told me "something will be said at some point" #HannahGraham

https://twitter.com/JoeStGeorge

Take your time, there's no hurry...... :gaah:

Also

Joe St. George @JoeStGeorge · 38m
Just interviewed a player on the Covenant School football team. He knows Jesse. I'll have his emotional interview at 5 #BringHannahHome

 

[ClueingForLooks]

Where did you read that? Interesting... She was a second year student, I do not believe she was lost once she was at the mall. Maybe earlier near Wertland, but not once on the mall that she was surely familiar with.

I didn't say anything about her being lost... Did you respond to me by accident? I'm confused.