VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #8

[sherbetjello]

Random question: Do we have any verified posters for this case?

 

[ValleyGirl21]

This has been my main theory since JM became the POI

I think maybe he told Hannah that he would take her to another party. Hannah's phone was dying and on something like 2%.
She wanted to get in communication with her friends ASAP. So she told her friends where she would be ahead of time, so they could meet her there. Well sometime before they make it to the party Hannah's phone dies, and JM becomes aware of this. Hannah probably doesn't have her friends' numbers memorized so she cannot call them from JM's phone. Hannah does not have a phone to call for help, so she is very vulnerable. JM is a little under the influence, and decides to take a chance and drives her somewhere else. Maybe JM wants to try for sex and feels he will get lucky since Hannah is intoxicated. JM makes an advance but Hannah refuses. He may continue trying to coerce her but ends up crossing a big line. Then after that it gets muddy. JM can't exactly release a woman that he pretty much abducted and may have attempted to sexually assault without some type of apprehension. What's worse is that she is underage and he bought alcohol for her. So he assumes that he will surely be in some trouble. So he chooses to get rid of her one way or another and pretend the event never happened :thinking:

For those who think JM is guilty, what do you think transpired after Hannah got in the car (assuming she did)? Did she go willingly? Did she think he was driving her home? Did they both plan to go to his apartment first? What do you think happened there? What is your theory?

 

[birdbox]

. We have absolutely no idea what LE knows regarding his whereabouts after that time.

My point is if this guy did in fact part ways with her....did he not go anywhere else....why doesn't he come forward and say, "Hey, go check the video at the quick trip, I was there alone." Why doesn't he try to round up an alibi...like, "hey ask my neighbors, maybe one of them saw me walk in alone at 1:30?" I would be out there beating down the bushes myself trying to find any video or person who may have seen me alone in order to clear MYSELF!! But that is just me!!!

 

[TravelingBug]

One reason I don't think JM knew HG before this is because I would assume JM has a cell phone and if HG was meeting up with him then she would call him and he would pick her up and plus didn't police say she texted her friends multiple times while she was lost.

I'm not leaning any particular way on if she may or may not have known him prior and so if there was any possibility she was meeting him, especially since I've not seen anything (even rumors on SM) with any friends indicating they knew him and she possibly had also, but...

I'd say it depends on if she were in the habit of giving her number to new person straight away.

If she'd met him briefly once, or briefly here or there, or seen him around, or whatever, she might not necessarily have given him her phone number, yet could have felt like she 'knew' him, especially if alone, slightly vulnerable, slightly under the influence, in the early hours of the morning.

Or could have met somewhere and had one of those brief "Oh we should meet up for drinks" sometime type of conversation and not exchanged info/set anything up because it was more like a social nicety almost, or a non-committal type thing.

Obviously we don't have video of everything or Hannah's every move or interaction, but it'd seem like it could be possible she could have seen him pass by (whether she had any familiarity with him - or heck, if perhaps he even looked like someone else she knew) while she was walking at some point and maybe could have waved.

And perhaps then he could have decided to park and try to catch up and meet her (which could explain overtaking WG in the video where we see that) and thus the interaction prior to Tempo's. Or he could have seen her and just decided to make contact - whether they had or may have met prior. And I suppose that's equally possible if one or the other had seen the other and he was on foot and not in the car.

I guess just thinking there are ways they could have met prior and yet never exchanged numbers (and frankly I wouldn't early on if I were in her shoes - though I'm sure many college age girls around her age would not think twice about it)

 

[carbuff]

... sure, and just like all the other video surveillance footage, four or five blocks later she would appear in front of a gas station, a bank, or some other place of business that had cameras. She was still more than a mile from home when she was last seen.

If she continued east toward the river, she would enter an area that looks like an industrial park, with warehouses and such. The surveillance cameras there probably don't have enough range to show somebody walking by on the street.

 

[Evie Ivy Over]

Yes, I agree. I stated it earlier in another post and people acted like I was crazy. My thought was that police described him with a shaved head to deter him from shaving his head because they knew they had to find a guy with dreads.

But there are other options for haircuts rather than shaving. I don't get that LE tactic...at all. How many people may actually have seen something between HG and a guy with dreds that discounted what they saw because of the shaved head description??

 

[Concerned Mama]

*Nothing to do with the POI*

Has it been asked and answered if the housing/frats/surrounding areas in Hannah's *general* housing area have cameras?I know we don't have her specific address, but we have an idea. I'm *assuming* based on my own experience that there are cameras on University property (and again, I'm *assuming* frat houses are university property?) so LE would have access and know Hannah did or did not return?

Trying to go back to the beginning and the party/lost text here. Can we definitively say she never made it back to her *home* area?

The fraternities and sororities are located on and around Rugby Road, for the most part. Hannah's comings and goings that night are not in that section, but near Preston Ave. and the downtown area, which would be northeast and east of Rugby Road. Her apartment and the party she attended are on the borderline of where university students living off campus ends and the hospital and downtown area begins. In the '90s, it wasn't considered a "safe" area to be in, once you'd left the businesses on The Corner.

 

[Lava]

My point is if this guy did in fact part ways with her....did he not go anywhere else....why doesn't he come forward and say, "Hey, go check the video at the quick trip, I was there alone." Why doesn't he try to round up an alibi...like, "hey ask my neighbors, maybe one of them saw me walk in alone at 1:30?" I would be out there beating down the bushes myself trying to find any video or person who may have seen me alone in order to clear MYSELF!! But that is just me!!!

He may have said something like that. A detective is quoted as saying they talked to him at the apartment but wanted to talk to him again. We have absolutely no way of knowing what he said.

 

[loveisthemovement]

Just when I thought I could finally go to bed.... Breaking news!!!

 

[sonicfanaticsmommy]

Everyone says he knew she was missing, but we do not know that for a fact, do we? What if he did not know? What if he does not watch TV. Or if he had heard about some college girl missing, her never heard a name or saw a photo? Maybe Hannah never said she was a UVA student. What if the first he knew about it was the cops on his porch? I would freak out and probably get a lawyer. And then with the (Imo ridiculous) tone of the PC, would not dare talk to LE even if I knew they would find nothing in my car or home.

Probably he knew...but probably is not proof he knew, Imo.

I had two friends today who had no idea Hannah is missing until I told them. Granted we are 2.5 hours from Charlottesville, but Hannah is from here and it's been all over the news. One friend just isn't someone who keeps up with the news on a regular basis. POI could be one of those people, too.

 

[bakerlady]

But it was stated that he works in the OR, helping to move patients. With the exception of emergency procedures, most surgeries are scheduled early morning and early afternoon.

I know someone who has the same job. Here they call it 'OR Tech' but it is the same thing. He works 3-4 12 hour shifts per week and they vary and he often works overnight.

There must always be someone there regardless of the scheduled surgeries and I imagine there is some down time on quiet nights but I would also not underestimate the amount of emergency surgeries.

So it's possible and likely that JLM was home 4 days out of the week which made it appear he had no job.

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

... sure, and just like all the other video surveillance footage, four or five blocks later she would appear in front of a gas station, a bank, or some other place of business that had cameras. She was still more than a mile from home when she was last seen.

True, unless in the meantime she was picked up by a different perp, or passed out under a bush in someone's backyard. (Yes, there were searches and there would have been an odor, but I am reminded of Leanne Bearden)

Sent from my KFOT using Tapatalk

 

[Mrs. Gladden]

They can, but you are not required to talk.

So, that logically leads to this question. Why didn't they take him in for questioning whenever they came to his door with a search warrant for his vehicle? I don't understand their game-play. Why paint this picture for the public that the POI refuses to talk to them? Heck, they didn't ask. If they had, he might have said a lot in the beginning. He may have also asked for a lawyer and not said a word. However, I find fault there for not even trying. After following another high profile case and seeing how the police operated, I find this one on the opposite end of that stick.

 

[Skigirl]

Random question: Do we have any verified posters for this case?

We have a lot who I truly believe are local. I don't think many have gone through the formal verification process. It would be nice if that could be done in a speedy fashion, because the locals have been really, really interesting and important here.

 

[sarx]

Has anyone seen any information as to what JM liked to do in his free time? Has he lived there his whole life? What are his hobbies?

 

[otto]

I believe you can get my point if you looked at the post I quoted. The other person insinuated JM must have known about the case beforehand because someone would have recognized him and told him. We have a poster here who knew him and did not recognize him. My point being, that it isn't a fact that someone MUST have recognized him and told him about being in the video.

I have read an awful lot of excuses for why this 32 year old man is doing everything he can to avoid providing information about his interactions with a young girl that went missing on the night he befriended her. Now, he doesn't read the newspapers, doesn't see newspapers, doesn't turn on the radio, doesn't turn on the TV and is simply able to completely avoid all news in this technology crazy world where news comes through loud and clear through nearly every electronic device we own.

 

[SweetT]

I think they want witnesses that saw the car that night so they can determine a direction it went after jm left the bar like out of town or a deserted road etc. Not just to see if hannah was in the car.

 

[Carieldf]

What is considered enough evidence for probable cause? What would be the minimum about LMs car they'd need to find in order for warrants?

 

[Ragamuffin]

I don't know about cameras, but are frats and sororities usually on university property? At my school (a midwestern big ten) they were most definitely not.

Skigirl, just want to thank you for answering both my questions so quickly and succinctly. I appreciate it.

 

[Lava]

So, that logically leads to this question. Why didn't they take him in for questioning whenever they came to his door with a search warrant for his vehicle? I don't understand their game-play. Why paint this picture for the public that the POI refuses to talk to them? Heck, they didn't ask. If they had, he might have said a lot in the beginning. He may have also asked for a lawyer and not said a word. However, I find fault there for not even trying. After following another high profile case and seeing how the police operated, I find this one on the opposite end of that stick.

It is very confusing. Honestly, LE's statements and actions are my biggest frustration here. There is one article however that quotes that they talked to him at the apartment, but wanted to talk to him again. Dunno more than that.