VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #8

DNA Solves
DNA Solves
DNA Solves
Status
Not open for further replies.
Imo,if she was intoxicated and if she did have more alcohol with JM...then she easily could have continued on a journey into the maze of streets, lost, disoriented, etc
He may have offered a ride and she refused, feeling "revived" after the break at Tempo.
I am just guessing as I do not think we will ever really know, unfortunately. This may be a case put together with circumstantial evidence and police theories.
 
LE still should not be using him wanting to not speak without a lawyer against him. If they have evidence, use it. But don't use someone's right to protect themselves as evidence.

Just jumping off your post... Not directed at you...

but when does the letter of the law trump a moral compass?

Just because something is "legal" doesn't mean it is just, fair, and right...

JMO...
 
What? How is that possible? I'm being serious, not snarky. I really want to know how that is possible. LE was able to spot Hannah across the mall, walking very fast ... I had to squint with my eyes on the screen to see that it was her. But the POI was right there in our faces. He was clear.

She's been here over a year on WS and had been on the thread posting very early on. And in much of the early stuff, the person now apparently ending up to be JM wasn't even really being discussed - it was WG and the person he described, etc.

And almost until the search warrants being executed were made public in the morning, the discussion here at least, was primarily on the possibility of the guy who lived very nearby (and looks pretty similar to the MH sketch). It was mostly seeming like a lot of trying to see if he could be made to fit with what then we had heard was the description that contradicted the other individual's name from around the corner who was being discussed (even though the weight, etc. varied)

So I'm not surprised someone could know him, have seen the video several times, and then been looking at pretty poor quality video and not really piece it together as a possibility - particularly when there was a lot of focus here (at least) on another individual and it's easy to 'see' what others do.

But mostly, I read her (multiple) posts regarding it all as that it was probably largely influenced by the fact that while it looked like him (once the discussion was really even mentioning seeing the person that now has apparently ended up being JM) that her knowledge/interactions with/etc. JM are so opposite of what one would think possible to then end up mentioned as a POI in the case of a missing person.

We have a regular poster on another thread (Jennifer R in NY - now in cases) who was here and had been very, very, very close (and longtime) friends with the man who killed her - which was her husband. His posts - including his recent ones since testifying in the murder trial) have definitely showed the mindset and struggle it is when you hear someone you know - well or not (but obviously even moreso if it's someone you know well) is named as a POI in a case, especially if it seems like there is no way it's possible because of the relationship you had with them, etc.

Anyway, his posts are an interesting read in terms of the process he went through, at least, when he found out someone he knew went missing, then found out that his very long-term closest friend became the POI.
 
Many links stating the real situation have been posted, so I don't know why hypothetical scenarios regarding JM being burst in upon in surprise by cops wielding a search warrant keep being repeated.

LE obtained a search warrant for JM's car but at that time did not have evidence to detain him. Processing the car yielded evidence for probable cause for a search warrant for the apartment that was granted.

When LE went back to execute that SW, JM had fled.

I'd provide a link but I already have already, numerous times.
 
Oh, I thought he stated they weren't sure where it was parked at.. but perhaps suggested some places it could have been parked where someone may have seen it? Can someone weigh in to confirm or deny?

Correct, Dixie. :)
 
Yes, obviously, he *could* have. He also *could* use his right to remain silent. There are consequences for both choices. That doesn't make him guilty though.

But why would you want to look guilty, if you are not? Makes no sense.
 
So am I right to speculate that LE most likely have footage of that car leaving or driving by after they are seen together, but not from the exact location it was parked? Maybe footage from a bank or something, sometime between 1:20 and 1:40am?
 
Anyone who has knowledge:

I'm pretty sure LE only speculates that he was parked somewhere on 4th? Although, now I've read that they do indeed have footage of that car leaving? So that confuses me.

My main question though, is anyone familiar with the area enough to know how parking is down there? Was he most likely in a garage, on street parking, in a lot? Also it's hard to tell on maps exactly where these areas would be, so if anyone could shed some light I'd appreciate it.

There is quite a bit of parking in the downtown area. There are some pay lots (btw 2nd St SE and 2nd St Sw, I think) and a garage on the other side of Water St. from 3rd st and the Urban Outfitters located on the mall and visible on google maps - a very quick walk from the bar. There is another garage directly adjacent to the police station. Many people find a spot along one of the streets in the vicinity. Many local stores validate parking for the garages.
 
Today, Longo made it pretty clear that he thinks JM murdered Hannah and said he hopes to get forensic back against him. After that, I would run as fast and far from LE as possible. Guilty or not. Jmo
 
Just jumping off your post... Not directed at you...

but when does the letter of the law trump a moral compass?

Just because something is "legal" doesn't mean it is just, fair, and right...

JMO...

When does the letter of the law trump a moral compass? In a criminal investigation? Always. If you break the law in a criminal investigation, you risk losing your suspect altogether. And then that suspect is free to harm other people.
 
Also judging by the garage times and the fact that the lot is credit card only, I'd assume he had to have been using on street parking.
 
So that leaves the question... Is 4th street pretty vacant at that time of night?
 
Amen to that...even if it is thru a lawyer and he is innocent then why not speak up ASAP to help Hannah or help find Hannah??! What do you have to lose if you are truly innocent and just tell what you know? If you do and police don't think it's good enough that's a different story but that is not the case according to what we have been told..if he has told LE what he knows then they would not sound so desperate to talk to him again..they have made it clear he has not told them what transpired that night..

We have had plenty of defense attorney come forward to,speak on client's behalf before and mostly, we think they spew BS (thinking about Drew Peterson, for one) so if JM's lawyer came out and said his client bought the young lady a drink, walked her out and they parted soon after, why would anyone buy that? They wouldn't. It would be wasted airtime, Imo.
 
Today, Longo made it pretty clear that he thinks JM murdered Hannah and said he hopes to get forensic back against him. After that, I would run as fast and far from LE as possible. Guilty or not. Jmo

I think this is why in a lot of cases we see LE coming out being very generous to a POI or suspect, because they don't want to spook them. They will downplay it in pressers, etc. All the while doing things behind the scenes. Clearly, not so in this case lol.
 
Many links stating the real situation have been posted, so I don't know why hypothetical scenarios regarding JM being burst in upon in surprise by cops wielding a search warrant keep being repeated.

LE obtained a search warrant for JM's car but at that time did not have evidence to detain him. Processing the car yielded evidence for probable cause for a search warrant for the apartment that was granted.

When LE went back to execute that SW, JM had fled.

I'd provide a link but I already have already, numerous times.

They still don't have enough to detain him on Hannah's disappearance if I have understood everything correctly. What I questioned earlier was why they didn't just take him in for questioning when they got the search warrant for his car. They said they spoke with JM at that time. Questioning at police headquarters might have resulted in a lot more information. (It might not have, either.) I just have wondered why they didn't try.
 
This story is so odd to me.

I do not understand how she get so lost. She had a cell phone and probably a smart phone so you know she had google maps app on it. Kids today know phones way better than me and I am sure if I know how to use that tool she did too.

She seems pretty intoxicated but she can type clearly to her friends then I am sure she could have typed in an address.

What kind of town is it that a young women enters a shopping restaurant and within minutes there are like a bunch of guys following her. Pretty freaky.

JLM I do not know what to think. If he had a girlfriend who lives with him like his Grandma says then I am sure he probably was trying to avoid coverage on him. I mean I can see that. He would have a lot of explaining to do and if nothing is certain on what happened to Hannah maybe he thought the girl was some where or whatever. Or of course he could have something to do with her disappearance.
 
It is interesting how different perspectives can be. My sons would not be speaking to police in this situation.

I believe the poster was asking about the situation if your daughter/son were missing...

How would you feel the person that was last to see her/him should behave?

JMO...
 
I read that LE spoke to him already when they searched his home and he told them he did buy her a drink but did not leave with her.

Its pretty clear that he spoke to police before today. It has never been said he did not contact them first , he might even have called the tip line , who knows the police are keeping their intelligence really close to them.

the police might say they never spoke to them , but he might have spoke to an FBI agent or state police or sheriff. You never know what they mean he did not speak to us. That does not mean he did not speak to any law enforcement.

The search warrants for probable cause seems suspicious to me. What would be the probable cause ? He was seen with her last ? That does not seem enough for them to issue a warrant. Was he on parole or probation ? If so then there would be enough for them to get a warrant because when you are on parole or probation , they do not need much to get a warrant on you.
 
So that leaves the question... Is 4th street pretty vacant at that time of night?

South of Water, yes, pretty quiet... Though, to be honest, I haven't been on the mall at that time of night for some time.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
163
Guests online
1,396
Total visitors
1,559

Forum statistics

Threads
602,136
Messages
18,135,515
Members
231,249
Latest member
webrowser
Back
Top