Found Deceased VA - Morgan Dana Harrington, 20, Charlottesville, 17 Oct 2009 - #8

[tamfish]

Well said! Provided we know for sure that she approached "a complete stranger," this may be exactly what happened -- regardless of how she got there. Hasn't LE said continually that they're more interested in what happened outside the arena rather than what happened inside?

But... do we know for sure the woman who approached that "complete stranger" was indeed MH? As far as I know (and IMO) we only have the account of the man, and he could be wrong. Eye witness accounts are not always reliable.....

I'm just sayin'.

eta: i quoted the wrong post, not sure how to fix that right now

 

[Waddles]

No, we don't know for sure that guy is truthful, and if he is being truthful we also don't know for sure if it was really MH at all.

Just like we don't know much of anything at all for sure in this strange case

 

[sarah7855]

No, we don't know for sure that guy is truthful, and if he is being truthful we also don't know for sure if it was really MH at all.

That's a whole lot of "if's:, just like the rest of this case

 

[Le Singe]

No, the athletes of the major sports like basketball and football are not students. They are entertainers who perform for the university in exchange for a degree. While the school makes loads of money, the integrity of all other students' degrees is tainted. This is why the athletes do as they please, and why the university allows it. It's all about money. Same as the no re-entry policy at JPJ arena.
(Quote - couldn't figure out how to move it as a quote from the locked thread.)

This is of course your opinion which I do not agree with......the idea that the quality of student athletes academic experience somehow effects the value of most students degrees is absurd if for no other reason than that the number of students that play major sports at any certain university is so small compared to the total number of students that their presence has no effect on the value of a degree from a particular university what so ever. Many college athletes in major sports go on to have successful careers in the fields they study. I have personally known a number of people who where university professors all of which have at one time or another had athletes in their classes (they are also all honorable people) they have never done anything specially for these athletes except for letting them take test at special times b/c the time the test is scheduled would be when the athlete is out of town for an away game. Furthermore I've never heard of them even being approached or ask to treat an athlete specially in any way. I’m sure plenty of shanagins go on but it is far from the level where you could say that athletes are not students…..

A more direct answer to the original question is: The NCAA has academic regulations so student athletes do have grade requirements at all universities and athletes can miss years or part of years of playing because they are ruled “academically ineligible”. Some, but not many (at least not many major D1 schools) put additional requirements on their athletes above and beyond the NCAA requirement. I believe athletes also have class attendance requirements per the NCAA. I also think the NCAA has rules that say the athletes have to be progressing towards some type of degree and not just taking random classes. It is true that at many universities the entrance requirements are lessened for athletes than they are for regular students but this is far from “you just show up at practice and the games and at the end of your four years they give you a degree”.

 

[MeoW333]

This is what I'm wondering. Since she went up to a complete stranger and basically expected him to escort her wherever it was that she was going, since he did not comply, maybe she found someone else who was willing to escort her, which I'm sure wouldn't be hard for a young girl that looked and dressed like her. Maybe that person(s) decided this was a good opportunity to take advantage of a girl who was all alone with nowhere to go.

Did LE say that was Morgan for sure? Unless they have her on video doing this, i'm skeptical as many blonde girls can fit her description.
It may have been another look alike that was a drunk one.

Why would Morgan go up to some older man she didn't know and have out her arm like to escort?
I don't think it was her, however i do think it was a random drunk woman. That type of behavior is not sane.

It's probably best to just focus on the confirmed sightings and confirmed evidence. So many people claim to have seen Morgan, and i'm sure most of them have good intentions, however why not come forward the day the press conference announced she was missing? Also many of them may have mistaken her for someone else. I have a couple friends who look like Morgan when they where younger (one still resembles her).

 

[MeoW333]

I don't want to be rude here, but "give me a break".....this was a rock concert and this is the "way it is". I've been to many over the years and Metallica's show in Charlotte was far tamer than many I've seen. I don't think it's fair to criticize Metallica's show....if you find it offensive, just don't go.

As I posted before, we had people all around us lighting cigs and all security did was immediately come and demand they be put out. We only smelled pot once or twice and only for a minute or so. The Time Warner arena in Charlotte was "crawling" with security, many of them Charlotte LE. They were heavy at the entrances, both inside and out, at every section entrance there were at least 5 or 6, and they were even stationed outside of restrooms. We saw no problems and considering the size of the arena as well as size of the crowd, I look at this as security doing a darn good job.

To get kicked out would take a lot and it would have to be something major. I know...been there done that many, many times and I've only seen a few evictions over the years for serious fighting, weapons, open and continued use of drugs. Even at outdoor arenas, people sit on the hill and smoke pot all night long and consume alcohol until they can barely stand and they never get ejected. For this reason, I have never thought Morgan was evicted from the arena. She left on her own. She didn't just wander outside. She didn't go out to smoke...there was a balcony for smokers. Also, Morgan was a somewhat "seasoned" concert goer....she knew the arenas as well as the policies. While exiting, she would have seen many, many signs, and she would have been warned by security. She went outside for a reason.....and for me, this is the biggest question of all. What was her motivation for going outside?

I agree with you, Metallica is tame that a lot.
Also at such a huge concert, they aren't going to bother kicking out every person who lights up a cigarette, they'd probably get a riot started if they were to do that.

To kick someone out, i'd think they'd have to be extremely disorderly and either starting physical fights or drunk to the point where they are about to. Or for those who try and rush on to the stage or engage in dangerous behavior.
I'm not sure if this show had a mosh pit, however the security doesn't like when people will climb onstage, it's a risk to the bands.
They wouldn't bother to kick out people under the influence unless they were being a danger or direct threat to others.

LE said that Morgan wasn't kicked out.

Maybe on her trip to the bathroom or to have a smoke if she preferred to go to the smoking area, someone stopped her and said something to her that scared her or was blatantly hitting on her. They could have been following her or did something that freaked her out (i'd think she'd go to security instead of going outside though).

The other thing i can think of is if she was very mad, would she go outside in a fit of anger not thinking clearly? Say, if she had got in a fight with her friends?

If she wasn't thinking clearly and was trying to use her cell phone and couldn't hear possibly she stepped outside somewhere thinking she could get right back in (especially if security wasn't nearby) and maybe she tried to get back in and they caught her and were like no you can't get back in. That would piss me off, especially if i only stepped out to hear on the phone.

 

[MeoW333]

This is of course your opinion which I do not agree with......the idea that the quality of student athletes academic experience somehow effects the value of most students degrees is absurd if for no other reason than that the number of students that play major sports at any certain university is so small compared to the total number of students that their presence has no effect on the value of a degree from a particular university what so ever. Many college athletes in major sports go on to have successful careers in the fields they study. I have personally known a number of people who where university professors all of which have at one time or another had athletes in their classes (they are also all honorable people) they have never done anything specially for these athletes except for letting them take test at special times b/c the time the test is scheduled would be when the athlete is out of town for an away game. Furthermore I've never heard of them even being approached or ask to treat an athlete specially in any way. I’m sure plenty of shanagins go on but it is far from the level where you could say that athletes are not students…..

A more direct answer to the original question is: The NCAA has academic regulations so student athletes do have grade requirements at all universities and athletes can miss years or part of years of playing because they are ruled “academically ineligible”. Some, but not many (at least not many major D1 schools) put additional requirements on their athletes above and beyond the NCAA requirement. I believe athletes also have class attendance requirements per the NCAA. I also think the NCAA has rules that say the athletes have to be progressing towards some type of degree and not just taking random classes. It is true that at many universities the entrance requirements are lessened for athletes than they are for regular students but this is far from “you just show up at practice and the games and at the end of your four years they give you a degree”.

Le Singe, thank you for the more openminded more fitting answer to my original question.
I would think the colleges would want the athletes to at least keep a certain GPA. If they don't make it pro, which most of them don't they need to have their education to fall back on.

 

[tamfish]

I agree with you, Metallica is tame that a lot.
Also at such a huge concert, they aren't going to bother kicking out every person who lights up a cigarette, they'd probably get a riot started if they were to do that.

To kick someone out, i'd think they'd have to be extremely disorderly and either starting physical fights or drunk to the point where they are about to. Or for those who try and rush on to the stage or engage in dangerous behavior.
I'm not sure if this show had a mosh pit, however the security doesn't like when people will climb onstage, it's a risk to the bands.
They wouldn't bother to kick out people under the influence unless they were being a danger or direct threat to others.

LE said that Morgan wasn't kicked out.

Maybe on her trip to the bathroom or to have a smoke if she preferred to go to the smoking area, someone stopped her and said something to her that scared her or was blatantly hitting on her. They could have been following her or did something that freaked her out (i'd think she'd go to security instead of going outside though).

The other thing i can think of is if she was very mad, would she go outside in a fit of anger not thinking clearly? Say, if she had got in a fight with her friends?

If she wasn't thinking clearly and was trying to use her cell phone and couldn't hear possibly she stepped outside somewhere thinking she could get right back in (especially if security wasn't nearby) and maybe she tried to get back in and they caught her and were like no you can't get back in. That would piss me off, especially if i only stepped out to hear on the phone.

Or maybe she went outside for fresh air because she was not feeling well. I have been in situations years ago -- alcohol involved, I'll admit -- where I felt so sick, the noise of the crowd and/or the music pounding..... I just HAD TO GET OUT. Being barred from re-entry would not have mattered to me. My need to breathe cold, fresh air would win, for sure.

But.... again.... we don't know for certain if MH was intoxicated, or otherwise feeling ill..... so we are back to square one!

 

[Waddles]

Did LE say that was Morgan for sure? Unless they have her on video doing this, i'm skeptical as many blonde girls can fit her description.
It may have been another look alike that was a drunk one.

Why would Morgan go up to some older man she didn't know and have out her arm like to escort?
I don't think it was her, however i do think it was a random drunk woman. That type of behavior is not sane.

It's probably best to just focus on the confirmed sightings and confirmed evidence. So many people claim to have seen Morgan, and i'm sure most of them have good intentions, however why not come forward the day the press conference announced she was missing? Also many of them may have mistaken her for someone else. I have a couple friends who look like Morgan when they where younger (one still resembles her).

Hmmm..what if that "random drunk woman" had gone missing? we'd all be on here looking for her and think it was another "random woman" that must have kicked the guy!

sorry, couldn't resist

:blowkiss:

And ditto the rest of that post!

 

[MBLover]

In regard to Morgan being asked to leave the arena, here is a link to an article dated Nov. 4th, 2009 that appeared in various newspapers. The VSP spokesperson, Corrinnie Geller made the following comment;

At Wednesday’s press conference, Geller shot down the rumor that Morgan might have been ejected from the Arena. “We have no information to believe,” says Geller, “that she was forced to leave or asked to leave, or anything of that nature.”

Here is the link;

http://www.readthehook.com/blog/ind...-joins-harrington-parents-new-details-emerge/

Thanks for that Ghost!

But...

What I do read from that though is that there is no confirmation - Geller said the word "believe" - rather than "we know"... To me that is not shooting down a rumor as the reporter put it.

 

[Waddles]

http://www.wset.com/news/stories/1109/679558.html?ref=rs&cmpid=rss_news_679558

 

[CindyS]

http://www.wset.com/news/stories/1109/679558.html?ref=rs&cmpid=rss_news_679558

Thanks Waddles for the link. In the article is the following statement:

"Dan and Gil Harrington returned to Charlottesville Wednesday to drop off their daughter’s dental records to State Police." Are those records normally requested before a body has been found?

 

[Waddles]

Thanks Waddles for the link. In the article is the following statement:

"Dan and Gil Harrington returned to Charlottesville Wednesday to drop off their daughter’s dental records to State Police." Are those records normally requested before a body has been found?

Good question, I don't know sorry-does anyone? Maybe they're just braced for the worst with no more information than we have and want to be as helpful as they can just in case

 

[Waddles]

Gil Harrington says she's staying optimistic about finding her daughter, but it's getting harder. “Until this point I have been saying that we're getting ragged. But I would say as of last night, we're kind of unraveling a bit because it has been a month and that's a big block of time. And you know a holiday for families is right around the corner and our family is fractured. It's difficult.”
Dan Harrington said, “After someone has done something like this, it would be very usual for them to have some strange behaviors or some odd behaviors and if someone can think back to that period of time and think of someone that maybe was acting strangely to also notify the police.”

http://www.nbc29.com/Global/story.asp?S=11531870

 

[MBLover]

I'd have to guess that they want these dental records on hand for just in case - they would have them ready to make a quicker identification...or to be able to fax somewhere in case MH wasn't found in the area.

 

[Hoosll]

JPJ schedule: Jimmy Buffett was there last night and Daughtry is due on Friday.

I wonder if LE has considered using a decoy female police officer to wander the parking lot to see if it draws anyone out ....

 

[angelmom]

Thanks Waddles for the link. In the article is the following statement:

"Dan and Gil Harrington returned to Charlottesville Wednesday to drop off their daughter’s dental records to State Police." Are those records normally requested before a body has been found?

Hoping it is just a precaution. That way, if a body is found, they have a chance of an ID before the parents even know. It would help a little with the roller coaster of emotions with the waiting and wondering (what if the records were out of state or it was a weekend - it might take a little bit of doing).

Can you imagine finding a body and having to call the parents and ask for them? After this long, dental records could be critical.

 

[tdaj]

Le Singe, thank you for the more openminded more fitting answer to my original question.
I would think the colleges would want the athletes to at least keep a certain GPA. If they don't make it pro, which most of them don't they need to have their education to fall back on.

I am not sure anyone has stated this yet, sorry if it is a repetitive answer. The lowish graduation rates for Division 1 b-ball players is due to the athletes leaving school early and going pro.

And yes universities do have grade requirements ect for athletes. I was an athlete at a Division 1 school and had grade requirements. The NCAA requires it. I was also a professor at a large Division 1 university and had many athletes in my courses. They were not given any extras or special privileges. Yes they do miss class more than your "average" student but they are all university approved and are required to make arrangements with their professors to make up any missed work/exams/ect.

That being said, of course not everyone follows the rules but there are rules and regulations that tend to be strictly enforced by the NCAA.

 

[tdaj]

This is of course your opinion which I do not agree with......the idea that the quality of student athletes academic experience somehow effects the value of most students degrees is absurd if for no other reason than that the number of students that play major sports at any certain university is so small compared to the total number of students that their presence has no effect on the value of a degree from a particular university what so ever. Many college athletes in major sports go on to have successful careers in the fields they study. I have personally known a number of people who where university professors all of which have at one time or another had athletes in their classes (they are also all honorable people) they have never done anything specially for these athletes except for letting them take test at special times b/c the time the test is scheduled would be when the athlete is out of town for an away game. Furthermore I've never heard of them even being approached or ask to treat an athlete specially in any way. I’m sure plenty of shanagins go on but it is far from the level where you could say that athletes are not students…..

A more direct answer to the original question is: The NCAA has academic regulations so student athletes do have grade requirements at all universities and athletes can miss years or part of years of playing because they are ruled “academically ineligible”. Some, but not many (at least not many major D1 schools) put additional requirements on their athletes above and beyond the NCAA requirement. I believe athletes also have class attendance requirements per the NCAA. I also think the NCAA has rules that say the athletes have to be progressing towards some type of degree and not just taking random classes. It is true that at many universities the entrance requirements are lessened for athletes than they are for regular students but this is far from “you just show up at practice and the games and at the end of your four years they give you a degree”.

I just wanted to give you a special thanks for the post. Very well said.

All the talk about the b-ball players and student athletes has really been getting on my nerves. (for lack of better terms)

Peace!

 

[Track292008]

JPJ schedule: Jimmy Buffett was there last night and Daughtry is due on Friday.

I wonder if LE has considered using a decoy female police officer to wander the parking lot to see if it draws anyone out ....

Very good idea!