VA - Nicole Lovell, 13, Blacksburg, 27 January 2016 #4 *Arrests*

[BUF]

To answer your question. Yes. Crossing state lines will host more charges.

Thanks, but my question wasn't about more changes, but federal court.

Question: Since they crossed state lines to dump her body, could this go to a federal court?

 

[Haayturtle]

Yes. I added the more charges part to imply that his punishment could be upgraded to where the DP would become a possibility.

 

[whiskers]

I keep going back to social media. I'm not exactly buying that he randomly researched or even found NL initially on social media. As someone stated several pages back, maybe he met her in the park while running. Maybe someone introduced them. Unless of course he is a pedophile and missed that aspect of his life once he went away to college. If that's the case then he would have looked for someone underage in the area. Hate even typing that.

Kik is definitely in the outer orbit of 'cool' social media as far as some users. Meaning it's sort of skeey to many. When you download an app, you basically agree to their long user agreement which most of us don't read. I'm surprised iTunes doesn't look into Kik closer. They need to. iTunes turns away thousands of apps a day. They have the power to yank it from iTunes and they need to take a very serious look at who is using it and why. With the social media influencers I work with, absolutely no one uses Kik. But I do think tweens and teens use it for a texting app.

 

[Bootsctr]

Exactly what are we comparing Leopold and Loeb to Keepers and Eisenhauer? Their ages? Their IQs? Their relationship? I'm not feeling a whole lot of differences between these 4 people. They murdered a young child because they could. They all thought they were smarter than the law, but they weren't. I admire Defense Attorney Clarence Darrow's 12-hour speech, but I don't get him blaming the University. I think that is what defense attorneys do, blame it on somebody else. They think their lives should be spared because they are so much more worthy to live rather than Nicole. Nah. I'm not buying it. They're cold! They're callous. They deserve the maximum sentence possible.

 

[Bootsctr]

Maybe naivete, trust, innocence?

Maybe they were jealous because Nicole could still have these feelings, and they were incapable of feeling these emotions? They were just the opposite.

 

[Cricket99]

Joining discussion.

 

[cluciano63]

I thought that a kidnapping, with a planned murder of a child would be death penalty, if ever a case is. This can't be anything less than first degree murder, and in my opinion, for both of them.

 

[Sanz]

I'm curious why many of you think DE might be a pedophile. Don't you think Nicole might have lied about her age?

Although it wasn't confirmed by law enforcement, media had reported that it was rumored that Nicole might have threatened DE to go public about their relationship. I think this might be likely true. In VT there have been instances when students have found themselves in trouble for unknowingly entering into relationships with underage girls.

One event I know was about a graduate student in 20s meeting and dating a girl who said she was 18. After a break up initiated by him, she tells him she is actually 15 and threatens to go the cops. She did go to the cops claiming rape, he was arrested and suspended. There were records of her stating to be 18, being in a consensual relationship and threatening him so the charges were dropped.

More well known example is Marcus Vick (brother of quarterback Michael Vick.) When Marcus was a student at VT and was 19 years old when he and friends have met three girls at a game. Those girls told them they were 18 and went to their house and drank alcohol, had consensual sex. It turned out the girls were 14,15 and 15. The girls have left a sleepover to go to VT and attend a game and met Vick and friends after the game. Marcus Vick was charged with having sexual relations with a 15 yr old and providing alcohol to minors. Sex charges was dismissed eventually (as the girl admitted she lied about her age and refused to testify pleading the 5th) but Marcus was found guilty of misdemeanor.

I imagine Marcus Vick example would be known to DE especially given he is also an athlete.

I do agree with your theory on DE and pedophilia at this stage of the case. It seems to be a trend for young teenage girls to want to attract the older teenager guys by lying about their age.
I found this profile of NL and seen the information she disclosed on the cover page. Age being 18.
It would be difficult at times to discern a persons age and true identity until you meet them in person. IMO.


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[cluciano63]

I do agree with your theory on DE and pedophilia at this stage of the case. It seems to be a trend for young teenage girls to want to attract the older teenagers guys by lying about their age.
I found this profile of NL and seen the information she disclosed on the cover page. Age being 18.
It would be difficult at times to discern a persons age and true identity until you meet them in person. IMO.


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So terrible to see that now. I don't think parents and schools can stress enough the dangers of the internet. I think today (or yesterday) was National Internet Safety Day, according to Google. It would be worthwhile to make this day be an entire day of internet safety sessions in all schools, complete with the scariest stories out there. I don't think anything should be withheld. Somehow, kids need to be convinced that they could actually end up dead, if they go the wrong route online.

 

[cujenn81]

HD63 great question about the shovel........yes IIRC they did go to 2 walmarts ......I wondered why they had not bought what they needed as to cleaning supplies in their plan...........wait til the middle of the night? and what kind of cleaning supplies..............bleach for DNA ???

I've been wondering about the supplies purchase, too. I googled "crime scene cleanup" (I hope my internet search results aren't being monitored... lol) and found a 'how stuff works' article that lists the supplies often used by professional cleanup companies, like:

Enzyme solvents, shovels, gloves, waste disposal bags, deodorizers, various stain/odor removers, sponges, brushes, buckets, plastic tarps, etc.

I wonder if they picked up similar supplies during the 2nd Walmart stop or if they just purchased like regular bleach and some trash bags.

It's tough to even think about, honestly.

 

[whiskers]

Wow, really sad to see this. I wonder if this is how DE met her. I know a lot of people here want to silence this sort of thinking, but I keep wondering what was going on that caused her to want to date and meet someone so far out of her age range. It's normal to want to be loved and wanted. I can see a 16 year old setting up an online dating profile and fudging the age, but 13 is young. Especially an adult dating site. Surely once DE met her, he would know she's not 18. After that, he should have cut all communication.

Agree with @cluciano63 social media needs to be a part of school. Maybe add it on to social studies. Anything. People need to understand the internet can be even more dangerous and scary than the offline world.

I do agree with your theory on DE and pedophilia at this stage of the case. It seems to be a trend for young teenage girls to want to attract the older teenager guys by lying about their age.
I found this profile of NL and seen the information she disclosed on the cover page. Age being 18.
It would be difficult at times to discern a persons age and true identity until you meet them in person. IMO.

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

 

[PrivateEye006]

It was a screenshot of a Kik conversation. I'm pretty sure ig was for Instagram. He was probably asking for her Instagram username.

Actually she wa responding to him there. And IG means "I guess".

 

[DatelineFan]

Actually she wa responding to him there. And IG means "I guess".

I think it might mean Instagram, but I guess it doesn't really matter.

Thanks, I didn't know she was responding.

 

[Night-owl]

I do agree with your theory on DE and pedophilia at this stage of the case. It seems to be a trend for young teenage girls to want to attract the older teenager guys by lying about their age.
I found this profile of NL and seen the information she disclosed on the cover page. Age being 18.
It would be difficult at times to discern a persons age and true identity until you meet them in person. IMO.


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It's the internet. Anyone college age should know not to take anything at face value on the internet.

I'm meeting someone who is 18, and they are sneaking out the window in the middle of the night, not driving over to a coffee shop to meet like any normal 18 year old would??? See ya.

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[DatelineFan]

It's the internet. Anyone college age should know not to take anything at face value on the internet.

I'm meeting someone who is 18, and they are sneaking out the window in the middle of the night, not driving over to a coffee shop to meet like any normal 18 year old would??? See ya.

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This. Also, I'm sure she didn't interact with him in messages with the maturity level of an 18 year old. There's just no way. 13 is so young.

 

[PrivateEye006]

No, not yet, although things could change. This will be going before a grand jury. Charges will come after that...whether they are the same or will increase/decrease.

Question: Since they crossed state lines to dump her body, could this go to a federal court?

Yes-- it will most likely go to Feds with federal charges. I think that is another reason why minimal info is being given...
Petite said at the first Presser minimal info to public should be expected.

How stupid are these kids? All these brains and no common sense. If they were going to cross state lines they may as well give deep i to NC. They literally jumped the state line and took it to a whole other level. Idiots.

 

[Rilian]

She absolutely looks like a child. No way in hell would anyone think that girl was anywhere near 18 years old. If DE is a pedophile, this might not be his first victim. My guess is...the prosecution is busy looking into his past.

 

[katydid23]

Yes-- it will most likely go to Feds with federal charges. I think that is another reason why minimal info is being given...
Petite said at the first Presser minimal info to public should be expected.

How stupid are these kids? All these brains and no common sense. If they were going to cross state lines they may as well give deep i to NC. They literally jumped the state line and took it to a whole other level. Idiots.

They were incredibly stupid for engineering students. He texted her right before picking her up and ADVERTISED that he was on the way to pick her up and kill her? And then goes to Walmart, the most heavily 'videoed'
store in the nation, to buy clean up supplies? :doh:

 

[PrivateEye006]

They were incredibly stupid for engineering students. He texted her right before picking her up and ADVERTISED that he was on the way to pick her up and kill her? And then goes to Walmart, the most heavily 'videoed'
store in the nation, to buy clean up supplies? :doh:

Right?! I mean I could not even hurt a fly. I do not have a malicious bone in my body. Nor am I sneaky or conniving. But for goodness sake... Even I know better than to do half the things we KNOW of them doing.... Keeping the blanket, Walmart- not once but twice, the social media trail, etc. all of this is one of the reasons I keep going back to there has to be a huge part we are missing.
In some way I do think NK may have done a lot of the banter with NL back and forth on social media. As far as kik I signed up and logged in to see what the platform was like. You have to know a screen name to even talk in there. It is a place you go to talk. Not meet. I still am stuck on them meeting her in the group for cutters or mingle.
But what would attract an over achiever ( for lack of a better word) arrogant, narcissist like DE to her?
My theory on people like him-- as I know one guy in particular that comes to mind when I think of DE-- they don't have a social group because people grow very tired of them quickly. They are hard to talk to or mingle with because they know everything... But clearly know very little really. They are difficult to like. They think they make a difference just by being in the room when in reality very few people even know they are there much less regard them.
They are almost sickening to be around.

Now NK I see different. I think the emptiness in her eyes is terrifying. But sadly it is only in the mug shot photos that I see that. Her Facebook pics and school photos I see someone very different.
I am convinced that all three of these people, Nicole included have experienced something that has brought a common ground in which they could relate and lure this child in.

I know nobody wants to speak on the past of this young girl. And I will keep the majority of my thoughts to myself. But as a 13 year old myself- I can remember reaching the point where we liked boys, started to notice them more, etc. but while she was extremely immature and naive-- she went above and beyond even that of her peers. And I'm in my thirties so it's not like its a totally different generation- while they may be a little more advanced-- and knowing a few teachers at that school I have a good idea as to what the norm is-- and from what I understand-- her activities were not the norm.

I am also surprised to hear that NKs family is separated. I don't know why-- but that struck me. Just thinking out loud.
As scary as it is-- I am very interested in the details once they come out. I would love to know what the motive for this senselessness was, the excuses and cop outs they come up with, and what the defense can possibly say to this. As I find this almost as paralyzingly as the beltway sniper when they had us all- a compete city on lock down- frozen in fear for what seemed like forever. For no particular reason at all.
Evil at its finest.

 

[2Hope4]

I was thinking of the Walmart trip, and if in hindsight the cashier is cringing that she/he rang them up. Then I thought about a recent trip to my farm store...ummm buckets, fertilizer, cleaning chemicals, odor eliminators *all because they were on the clearance rack, and well, eventually I'll use them all!* and tarps, several sizes, to cover traps for TNR feral cats, and to cover the truck that my husband recently flipped, it has no windshield, or windows, and it was going to snow, so I wanted to cover the cab in case it was something in there he needed, wanted.... But in hindsight, daggone my supplies look suspicious! Thankfully there was also $150 worth of feed for the critters around here as well.


My thoughts are still NK as mastermind, thrill kill. Used the knowledge of DE being in an inappropriate relationship to pressure or encourage him to help in her plan. Her plan being to murder someone for entertainment. Someone she didn't know, had no emotional connection to. Just wanted the thrill of killing. Everything was pointing directly to DE as far as actual contact with Nicole, and internet history. Truly nothing was linked to NK that we know of, unless she was to be his alibi, they were together, at the dorm, therefore couldn't have done anything. However, NK rolled. She backstabbed DE as soon as she could. She didn't go with being his alibi. She threw him to the lions. AND hey, it's worked in the past! Maybe not with NK, but other women have planned, and committed awful crimes, but lead LE to believe the man was in charge, or the man did the crime, and in many cases the female becomes state's witness, or gets a much less charge, and sentence.

Problem here, the state hadn't charged anyone but DE at the time. From the get go LE probably knew they were looking for a David that Nicole was going to meet up with, and scoured those social media sites. What they couldn't see, they got a warrant for, and lead them to DE.

NK had no reason to talk, and talk, and talk except that she control her excitement. She HAD to share! She wanted to relive those moments! Tell them to someone. She was bursting at the seams to talk it seems. Her mistake. Had she kept quiet, it would have taken longer to connect to her any of this, and perhaps might not have. If she had said she didn't see DE that night, could have been of their questions. But, she left her boyfriend's place, took LE right to the blanket, to the body, details about murder weapon, planning of murder, etc. State has no reason to cut any deal with her now. She's told them what they needed, without them needing to deal with her. She truly locked herself into a story that will be interesting to see if defense can weave a different way.

JMO