Verdict: GUILTY for both Millard and Smich of 1st degree murder #2

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Any idea what facility they're at? When it's said that DM doesn't have access to the internet, since he's representing himself in the LB case, would he not be able to use a computer and have supervised access to the internet?

Presumably they are at Millhaven for the intake and assessment process, which takes several weeks; after that they will be assigned to a maximum security prison but the location will not be made public.

As for internet access, no, prisoners do not have internet access, supervised or not. For the LB case, DM was given access to a laptop and the needed material on DVDs.

http://www.annrbrocklehurst.com/tag/laura-babcock

Some prisoners manage to circumvent the lack of internet access, posting on blogs or Facebook (however, they could be doing this via an accomplice who takes out their posts as text and posts it for them), though this article suggest that contraband smartphones have become a problem:

http://montrealgazette.com/news/loc...-mock-authorities-by-posting-facebook-updates

The above also confirms that Corrections Canada does not permit access to the internet.
 
Juror 4 should have told the court on day one that she couldn't do it.
Weak people shouldn't go on juries.

Respectfully, I personally don't think the juror is considered weak for requesting counselling.
 
Couple of Questions..if you please

Where do the appeal notices fit in with CN's trial? Wondering about time frame to grant or refuse. Because "technically" an appeal could turn over a verdict. If DM is not found guilty, where does CN's involvement come into play? If he's not guilty of anything, she's can't be found guilty as an accessory (not that I think in a million years this would happen, I am just wondering if they put her trial on hold until that messy appeal process is settled????)

If by chance, any info was garnered from DM's cell phone ( or MS or any other one of the "lucky their asses aren't in jail crew" for that matter) to implicate him in LB's death or his father's death while they were searching for info on TB, does that make it null and void? How broad are search warrants? If LE only stated they were looking for TB evidence and fell into a well of info on others would they have had the option to stop what they were doing and request "permission" to proceed further on other cases or is it accepted that any other evidence of crime is accepted? How does that work?

Thanks in advance for your help in my understanding of this!
 
Couple of Questions..if you please

Where do the appeal notices fit in with CN's trial? Wondering about time frame to grant or refuse. Because "technically" an appeal could turn over a verdict. If DM is not found guilty, where does CN's involvement come into play? If he's not guilty of anything, she's can't be found guilty as an accessory (not that I think in a million years this would happen, I am just wondering if they put her trial on hold until that messy appeal process is settled????)

If by chance, any info was garnered from DM's cell phone ( or MS or any other one of the "lucky their asses aren't in jail crew" for that matter) to implicate him in LB's death or his father's death while they were searching for info on TB, does that make it null and void? How broad are search warrants? If LE only stated they were looking for TB evidence and fell into a well of info on others would they have had the option to stop what they were doing and request "permission" to proceed further on other cases or is it accepted that any other evidence of crime is accepted? How does that work?

Thanks in advance for your help in my understanding of this!

Terrific questions!


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Couple of Questions..if you please

Where do the appeal notices fit in with CN's trial? Wondering about time frame to grant or refuse. Because "technically" an appeal could turn over a verdict. If DM is not found guilty, where does CN's involvement come into play? If he's not guilty of anything, she's can't be found guilty as an accessory (not that I think in a million years this would happen, I am just wondering if they put her trial on hold until that messy appeal process is settled????)

If by chance, any info was garnered from DM's cell phone ( or MS or any other one of the "lucky their asses aren't in jail crew" for that matter) to implicate him in LB's death or his father's death while they were searching for info on TB, does that make it null and void? How broad are search warrants? If LE only stated they were looking for TB evidence and fell into a well of info on others would they have had the option to stop what they were doing and request "permission" to proceed further on other cases or is it accepted that any other evidence of crime is accepted? How does that work?

Thanks in advance for your help in my understanding of this!

Good questions! I hope people here who know more about this will answer. I tried to look up the answers & the following is my understanding:

TB's death was ruled a homicide. On the second day of his charge to the jury, Justice Goodman said that there was no evidence to support the notion that TB's death was an accident.

Both DM & MS themselves placed themselves as the only two people there when TB was killed. When DM was arrested, he had nitrile gloves in his possession that had TB's blood, DM's DNA & CN's DNA. In theory, (IMO) if DM were ever to be found innocent, CN is still linked to TB's murder. Not only with the glove evidence, but through text messages ('mission' discussion), moving the eliminator, wiping off prints off the trailer...and I'm guessing more evidence that will be revealed at her trial.

She also wrote 'cannot prove because no prints' on a note found in her room- to me signaling consciousness of guilt.

I found this about search warrants:

From: https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Canadian_Criminal_Procedure_and_Practice/Search_and_Seizure/Warrantless_Searches/Incident_to_Arrest

In the situation of an arrest, it is generally permitted that upon lawful arrest, police have the power to search a person for officer safety reasons as well where there is "some reasonable prospect of securing evidence of the offence for which the accused is being arrested" and to secure that evidence.


A legally unauthorized search to make an inventory is not a valid search incidental to arrest (Caslake at para. 30);
The three main purposes of a search incidental to arrest are: (1) to ensure the safety of the police and the public; (2) to protect evidence; (3) to discover evidence (Caslake at para. 19);
The categories of legitimate purposes are not closed: while the police have considerable leeway, a valid purpose is required that must be “truly incidental” to the arrest (Caslake at paras. 10, 20 and 25);
If the justification for the search is to find evidence, there must be a reasonable prospect the evidence will relate to the offence for which the person has been arrested (Caslake at para. 22);

From: https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Canadian_Criminal_Procedure_and_Practice/Search_and_Seizure/Warrant_Searches/Execution
Whenever evidence, other than records or documents, are seized pursuant to a search warrant or incidental to a search, the officer must file an initial Report To Justice under s.489.1 regardless of whether charges are contemplated.

They found a DVR in CN's closet. As we now know, that that digital video recorder contained footage from DM's air hangar in the hours after TB's murder (DM, MS & DM's dog walking through the hangar before the outside CCTV footage of the hangar & the eliminator flames).

That was found at CN's home, but used against DM & MS at their trial.

IMO, her possession & control of the DVR, & DM's letters make her guilty of being an accessory after the fact to murder - she knew TB had been murdered when police found those items in her possession. And I think that's only part of the evidence.

The Canlii information online about Iisho aka MWJ's arrest on drug charges also illustrates how an arrest and following search of his home unfolds into a list of charges for himself & the woman he was living with:

https://www.canlii.org/en/on/oncj/doc/2014/2014oncj570/2014oncj570.html?searchUrlHash=AAAAAQAUbWF0dGhldyB3YXJkIGphY2tzb24AAAAAAQ&resultIndex=1
 
Juror 4 should have told the court on day one that she couldn't do it.
Weak people shouldn't go on juries.

WOWZERS!!!! I strongly disagree with you and your quote! I believe that counselling should be offered to all jurors.
A "weak" person is....someone who cannot lift 5 lbs? What does that have to do with sitting on a jury?
I surely hope you are not thinking that anyone with a "mental health" issue is weak, as you are hugely mistaken!!!
 
WOWZERS!!!! I strongly disagree with you and your quote! I believe that counselling should be offered to all jurors.
A "weak" person is....someone who cannot lift 5 lbs? What does that have to do with sitting on a jury?
I surely hope you are not thinking that anyone with a "mental health" issue is weak, as you are hugely mistaken!!!

Thank you for your reply.
Oreck, unfortunately, it seems to me, it's people like you that carry the negative stigma towards mental health. In today's society, there is no room for ignorance when it comes to this topic. IMO
We all know someone who is suffering with a mental disorder, either in silence or is confident enough to talk abut the journey to wellness with others.
I was flabbergasted that the jury wasn't appointed health care professionals during and after this trial.
Some may call those suffering with mental illness weak, and yet, in reality, those that suffer, are some of the strongest people I personally know.
Hope everyone is doing well during this "downtime".
Again....all moo
 
WOWZERS!!!! I strongly disagree with you and your quote! I believe that counselling should be offered to all jurors.
A "weak" person is....someone who cannot lift 5 lbs? What does that have to do with sitting on a jury?
I surely hope you are not thinking that anyone with a "mental health" issue is weak, as you are hugely mistaken!!!

Thank you for your reply.
Oreck, unfortunately, it seems to me, it's people like you that carry the negative stigma towards mental health. In today's society, there is no room for ignorance when it comes to this topic. IMO
We all know someone who is suffering with a mental disorder, either in silence or is confident enough to talk abut the journey to wellness with others.
I was flabbergasted that the jury wasn't appointed health care professionals during and after this trial.
Some may call those suffering with mental illness weak, and yet, in reality, those that suffer, are some of the strongest people I personally know.
Hope everyone is doing well during this "downtime".
Again....all moo

I apologize, sincerely.
I did not realize that there was a mental illness involved here.

Weak was a very poor choice of words also.
They used to call it LMF.
Please disregard my post #1159.
 
O/T

I've lost CN on Pintere**, OMG! ;) Is there another user name?
 
Brian Greenspan is one of the best criminal defence lawyers in Ontario, if not all of Canada. I wonder how this will play out.
 
Now knowing what the jury did not — for example, that Millard and Smich were facing other first-degree murder charges — she had a constant headache during the five days of deliberations, as she anxiously awaited the call from court staff that a verdict had been reached.

When the jury returned with their verdicts on June 17, she sat nervously, with the general public, in the packed courtroom gallery. As the two first-degree murder convictions were delivered — sending both men away to prison for at least 25 years — she smiled.

"Justice was served," she says.

The above quoted from the newspaper article regarding the excused juror... it isn't that the jury members were not aware that DM and MS were facing other first degree murder charges, I'm sure that at least some of them *were* aware, if not most of them, or even all of them, whether they admitted it or not. When the many many potential jurors went through their vetting process before they were chosen, the main part of that process was that the defence wanted to feel satisfied that each juror, whether they were aware of other things or not, could put all of that aside and judge this case only on its own via whatever they heard/saw as evidence in the courtroom during this trial.

To me, in my humble opinion, it is completely inappropriate for that juror to say publicly that 'justice was served', after noting in the article that she 'now' knew what the jury did NOT know, after being excused as a juror. The other charges were as yet unproven in court and were to have zero bearing in *this* trial and that was established over and over during the trial by way of the judge stating on a number of occasions that only the evidence heard/seen in the courtroom was to be considered in making their judgements of the accuseds. To me, she has publicly admitted that she was not capable of judging only the evidence presented, and I'm glad she was excused prior to deliberations.

Where is it said that this juror had/has mental health issues? I think I missed that article.
 
New twist in Bosma case by Susan Clairmont:

http://m.thespec.com/news-story/6784469-bosma-dellen-millard-s-girlfriend-hires-celebrity-lawyer/




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Guess she finally recognized the seriousness of what she is facing. Hope her trial still begins in November.

Greenspan may ask for more time to prepare for the trial, or he may have scheduling issues, which could push the opening into 2017.

And who is paying Greenspan's fee? He is a brilliant lawyer with an impressive reputation. Many in the legal community speculate he is the highest paid criminal defence lawyer in Ontario. Greenspan is known for representing celebrities and wealthy business people accused of white collar crimes.

Noudga's parents are chiropractors in Toronto and live in a modest Etobicoke bungalow.
 
Guess she finally recognized the seriousness of what she is facing. Hope her trial still begins in November.

That is the impression I get as well. I got the feeling when she testified at the trial, that she thought it was all very minor and it didn't matter the impressions she broadcast. I think her charge is rather open-ended as far as the possibilities for sentencing if convicted, and she could end up in jail for a long, long time. Perhaps it finally occurred to her what kind of damage this whole thing could do to her life as she knew it, and the plans she had for her future. Her defence has *got* to be funded by DM, and now makes me wonder if she has agreed to become DM's spouse while he rots in prison, and perhaps become mother to his as yet unborn children that he thinks he could father so well.
 

Thank you for posting these.

They are very interesting, but I hope that someone might be able to explain them in layman's terms, lol ... I have read them 3 times now, and still don't have a clear understanding.

Thanks in advance for any help in deciphering the contents. [emoji851]


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Guess she finally recognized the seriousness of what she is facing. Hope her trial still begins in November.

From the same Spec article: "But for her effort, could Millard be bankrolling her defence fund?"
 
Thank you for posting these.

They are very interesting, but I hope that someone might be able to explain them in layman's terms, lol ... I have read them 3 times now, and still don't have a clear understanding.

Thanks in advance for any help in deciphering the contents. [emoji851]


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:thumb:

Me too, Mrs. T! :D
 
Thank you for posting these.

They are very interesting, but I hope that someone might be able to explain them in layman's terms, lol ... I have read them 3 times now, and still don't have a clear understanding.

Thanks in advance for any help in deciphering the contents. [emoji851]


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The Motion is to lift the stay of proceedings so that Millard Properties can give MB $75,000 to pay for DM's legal fees in connection with his ongoing criminal charges. Prior to the motion being granted, DM was not able use any monies in MIllard Properties. HTH
 
Thank you for posting these.

They are very interesting, but I hope that someone might be able to explain them in layman's terms, lol ... I have read them 3 times now, and still don't have a clear understanding.

Thanks in advance for any help in deciphering the contents. [emoji851]


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I'm certainly no expert, but from what I can gather, MB and DM were requesting $75,000 from WM's estate (held by Millardair) go to MB to cover both DM and MB's legal fees. That request was approved.
 
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