VT VT - Lynne Kathryn Schulze, 18, Middlebury, 10 Dec 1971

[Mysteries1974]

Half of me feels like Lynne is a homicide victim the other half feels that she is alive and may have returned to Connecticut or made a life in NY. I wish that Lynne’s case could be put on NCMEC and maybe they can construct an age progression for her. As far as I know Lynne has a few living siblings, her parents died 20 something years ago.

 

[Zephyranth]

The thing is that police wouldn’t bring family members from multiple states to a specific property for closure unless they believed very strongly that the missing person died there. Honestly I’m not sure they would ever bring a family to a “maybe “site. What would be the point of that? That’s not closure. I think they found enough evidence to indicate Lynne died there, or at least have an overwhelmingly credible eyewitness statement. I think the missing persons case is closed; the homicide investigation is not, though. What was the history between Vilner and Durst and the Israels anyway? Three similar couples from New York… Kind of interesting. Vilner claims Israel was the only one (in their poker circle) who befriended Robert.

 

[Satch]

Never noticed this before - the December 9, 1971 edition of the school paper had an article about an abortion clinic in New York. Page 5 (right next to an advertisement for Wild Mountain Thyme).

https://ia600800.us.archive.org/1/items/middleburyNewspapers_1971-12-09/13933_text.pdf

That would explain so, so much, including Lynne's alleged talk the next day of a trip to New York, her distracted state of mind, her seeming indecision about her activities, the school's desire to list her as 18 and not 17, and the delay in presuming her missing.

Unfortunately, it would also provide potential motive for the father to harm her, perhaps especially if the father were not a student, but an adult. An adult would have additional motive and means to cause her to disappear if, for example, he was someone who was married, well or even prestigiously employed, had a vehicle, exerted greater influence over her than a student might, etc.

Consider A.I.'s now-less-mysterious statement: "If there are people that disappeared to make Durst's life a little smoother, a little softer to navigate, I'm not surprised."

That fact would apply to anyone who was the father, of course. The FBI contacted D.V. at least twice in 2014 or 2015, and according to his own statement, never asked about Durst; they asked whether D.V. himself remembered seeing Lynne in the store. Keep in mind that the store belonged to D.V. until at least the fall of 1971, in other words, weeks before Lynne's disappearance.

Rumors of Durst owning the store and the Ripton property are as-yet unproven by documentation, whereas D.V. is actually on-record, with zero doubt, as having owned both. The FBI questions D.V., and suddenly someone floats the (yet unproven) idea to the media that "a serial killer lived at 301 Robbins Crossroad."

D.V. claims Durst did not live there; A.I. claims Durst did.

Interesting.

A Question?

When did Durst claim ownership to "All Good Things?" And what about that process of ownership? If it was paperwork, at what point leading up to the signing of the Title Deed, would he have to be in Vermont to get the store property? Or could he have signed the papers to the store and legally claiming this store, while still in New York? (Assuming Durst was in New York when Lynne vanished?)

Satch

 

[Zephyranth]

Durst has never claimed ownership, at least not publicly, and no one including police has publicly stated by what means they know Durst supposedly owned it. Vilner claims to have sold it to Durst for cash just before Lynn’s disappearance on land Vilner owned.

 

[Zephyranth]

Keeping in mind that Vilner also said Durst never lived on the Ripton property, while Israel says Durst did.

Confusing, that one, unless for some reason Vilner doesn’t want people to think Durst lived there.

 

[Satch]

The thing is that police wouldn’t bring family members from multiple states to a specific property for closure unless they believed very strongly that the missing person died there. Honestly I’m not sure they would ever bring a family to a “maybe “site. What would be the point of that? That’s not closure. I think they found enough evidence to indicate Lynne died there, or at least have an overwhelmingly credible eyewitness statement. I think the missing persons case is closed; the homicide investigation is not, though. What was the history between Vilner and Durst and the Israels anyway? Three similar couples from New York… Kind of interesting. Vilner claims Israel was the only one (in their poker circle) who befriended Robert.

Zephyranth,

Your take is that Lynne is deceased, but there remains uncertainty as to whom, and why? I agree, there would not be any kind of family/relative closure meeting at Lynne's final resting place, unless there was overwhelming evidence that she died there. Or a deathbed confession that can be substantiated with physical evidence.

Than you have witnesses and questions like who came forward that are still alive? But worse, after after forty-seven years, memory may be to distorted over time, with no physical evidence. Concerning Lynne needing to run away if she was pregnant, and could not tell her parents, could be a reason for her leaving and starting a new life. Was she killed in some kind of love-triangle gone bad? I think closure is going to be very hard if not impossible for this case. If this happened, and Lynne never told her family, or even her closest friends, her whereabouts could remain unknown forever. Very sad.

Satch

 

[Mysteries1974]

The thing is that police wouldn’t bring family members from multiple states to a specific property for closure unless they believed very strongly that the missing person died there. Honestly I’m not sure they would ever bring a family to a “maybe “site. What would be the point of that? That’s not closure. I think they found enough evidence to indicate Lynne died there, or at least have an overwhelmingly credible eyewitness statement. I think the missing persons case is closed; the homicide investigation is not, though. What was the history between Vilner and Durst and the Israels anyway? Three similar couples from New York… Kind of interesting. Vilner claims Israel was the only one (in their poker circle) who befriended Robert.

I’m sure if Lynne’s body or evidence was found at the property then she wouldn’t be on any missing person’s website. I honestly think that Lynn ran away from Vermont and start a new life in Connecticut or New York. I’m not ruling out that she is a victim of a homicide but still.

 

[Zephyranth]

The subconscious is a strange thing.

For most of my life, I thought I'd accepted the logical probability of Lynne's death. Over the past 24 hours, I've realized I had never even truly allowed myself to accept its possibility.

<modsnip>
I would love to shut my eyes and continue hoping; but as of today, the question for me, personally, is no longer "Where is Lynne?" but "Who did it?"

 

[carbuff]

Keeping in mind that Vilner also said Durst never lived on the Ripton property, while Israel says Durst did.

Confusing, that one, unless for some reason Vilner doesn’t want people to think Durst lived there.

It's been generally believed that Durst backed quite a number of small local businesses with cash/under the table/loans. I've heard variously that he was generous to his friends, or that he was trying to buy friendship. This is all rumor and I mention it only in case it gives you some ideas for research.

Maybe what they found at the property was evidence that Lynne had been there, but nothing to indicate either way whether she was alive?

 

[Zephyranth]

Indeed - did Durst really own OM/All Good Things, or just back it? Did he have a deal with Vilner, and if so, why?

As the timeline currently goes, Vilner owned and operated the store, temporarily "sold" it for cash to Durst for "about 8 months," then reacquired it. It's tempting to note the potential convenience of temporarily un-owning the store just long enough for it to be Durst, not Vilner, whose Middlebury business conducted the last known financial transaction with a missing girl. All the more so if you correctly foresee that, within several years, police will decide that same girl died on your second property in Ripton.

I'm going with Vilner or Israel as candidates for the 2012 tip to police saying Durst owned OM/All Good Things, and Lynne bought prunes there. ("Israel and others are left wondering what really happened. 'What I want to know is who told them she was eating prunes at (Durst’s) store?”' she said. “Was Robert even there? And who gave them the 2012 tip?'”)

Note this from Lynne's sister:

"She liked meeting new people and getting into deep, philosophical discussions about politics, art, music and life in general....We speculate that Lynne got to know a group of people who lived in Middlebury or nearby, possibly Rutland or maybe Burlington," Anne Schulze said. "We surmise that some of them may know of Lynne's demise." (Burlington Free Press, Dec 11, 2011)

I've kept asking myself "Why 2012?" for the tip, but hadn't thought until just now of the fact that 2011 was the 40th anniversary. Probably natural for that to generate tips?

 

[Mysteries1974]

Indeed - did Durst really own OM/All Good Things, or just back it? Did he have a deal with Vilner, and if so, why?

As the timeline currently goes, Vilner owned and operated the store, temporarily "sold" it for cash to Durst for "about 8 months," then reacquired it. It's tempting to note the potential convenience of temporarily un-owning the store just long enough for it to be Durst, not Vilner, whose Middlebury business conducted the last known financial transaction with a missing girl. All the more so if you correctly foresee that, in several years, police will decide she died on your second property in Ripton.

Note this from Lynne's sister:

"We speculate that Lynne got to know a group of people who lived in Middlebury or nearby, possibly Rutland or maybe Burlington," Anne Schulze said. "We surmise that some of them may know of Lynne's demise." (Burlington Free Press, Dec 11, 2011)

Is this property mentioned on any of the websites or articles that mention Lynne? I’ve known about her case for a long time but the location thing is sorta new.

 

[Zephyranth]

It's been generally believed that Durst backed quite a number of small local businesses with cash/under the table/loans. I've heard variously that he was generous to his friends, or that he was trying to buy friendship. This is all rumor and I mention it only in case it gives you some ideas for research.

Maybe what they found at the property was evidence that Lynne had been there, but nothing to indicate either way whether she was alive?

Could well be. Do you know anything about the Frog Hollow arts centers (Middlebury and Burlington) history?

Lynne was reportedly doing whittling there; Celine Slator was also involved with the center. Slator is the one who used her own newspaper (Addison County Independent) to write an editorial claiming she'd seen Lynne at a restaurant ergo Lynne was not murdered as was being claimed (?! Who was claiming that? I'm trying to get a copy).

Nancy Dunn also worked at the Frog Hollow centers, and gave a confusing comment: "“I didn’t know her,” Dunn said. “She was only here for a few months, and, perhaps, if she had been here longer we might recall more.”

 

[Mysteries1974]

Could well be. Do you know anything about the Frog Hollow arts centers (Middlebury and Burlington) history?

Lynne was reportedly doing whittling there; Celine Slator was also involved with the center. Slator is the one who used her own newspaper (Addison County Independent) to write an editorial claiming she'd seen Lynne at a restaurant ergo Lynne was not murdered as was being claimed (?! Who was claiming that? I'm trying to get a copy).

Nancy Dunn also worked at the Frog Hollow centers, and gave a confusing comment: "“I didn’t know her,” Dunn said. “She was only here for a few months, and, perhaps, if she had been here longer we might recall more.”

Where would Lynne’s body be?

 

[Zephyranth]

What's giving me just a bit of pause is that Celine Slator died in June of 1976 at the relatively young age of 63. The Israels said Durst made a visit to them in 1976.

I've had a theory in the back of my mind that, if there is a reason to falsely associate Robert with Middlebury/Ripton in 1971, there might be a reason to falsely associate him with the same in 1976 (so that whatever happened could be blamed on him).

Well, and to be fair, if Durst *is* the baddie, then his return in '76 is interesting. I don't know, though. I don't have a strong feeling that Durst is responsible; it seems to me far more as if others are working very hard (and with shaky evidence) to try and claim he was responsible.

Anyway. It's worth keeping an eye on.

 

[Zephyranth]

Where would Lynne’s body be?

Ostensibly on Vilner's former property in Ripton (or the national forest the property is adjacent to).

 

[carbuff]

To correct one misstatement: Durst's connection to All Good Things was known long before 2012. It gave the name for Andrew Jarecki's 2010 film. All Good Things (film) - Wikipedia

The film was shot in 2008 so must have been written in 2007 or earlier.

Durst himself liked the film and gave a series of interviews to Jarecki, which became a second movie, The Jinx, from 2015.

Timeline of Durst's life and misdeeds: The Life and Crimes of Robert Durst: A Timeline

The interviews and a letter that he might have written appear to be what triggered a renewed investigation into his life, which might have been what brought to light the possible connection to Schulze. At the time she went missing he would have been nothing but another spoiled rich kid living the hippie life in Vermont. I suspect that LE knew some things that seemed innocent enough in the 70's but became much more sinister in retrospect.

 

[Zephyranth]

If Durst really bought and opened All Good Things, when did this happen?

As of December 9, 1971 - the day before Lynne's disappearance - it was still called OM.

 

[carbuff]

The ownership and the name change don't have to go together.

 

[Zephyranth]

The ownership and the name change don't have to go together.

True that, though it does help us focus in at least a little more narrowly as to when he potentially appeared on the scene (if in fact he did). The police have suggested he took ownership in "fall of 1971." My interest is in seeing, if possible, when in fall. If in fact the name change reflects anything, we know that sometime after December 9, 1971 and before February 1972 the listed name (and telephone number) change.

12-9-71 edition of Middlebury Campus, OM is listed with 802-388-9060
01-2o-72 No ad
01-28-72 No ad
02-24-72, All Good Things 388-2019
...

It will be worth expanding the view to, say, 1970-1973, to see what the advertisement pattern is and what it may represent.

 

[Zephyranth]

In the meantime--a fascinating discussion between a judge and lawyers who worked on a past Durst case: