Was Burke involved?

[UKGuy]

I agree. Perhaps her maternal grandfather, and I always though the suitcase belonging to JAR with sperm on a sheet and a Dr. Seuss book inside was very strange.

I think JBR was molested the night of the pre-Christmas party at the Ramsey home, hence, the 911 call and JBR saying she didn't feel pretty. JMO

4Jacy,
I agree. And I think I know who her molester was and what steps were taken to protect this person and by whom. And how this relates to what took place some nights later and thereafter. It fits together like a jigsaw.

Fear of litigation prevents me from saying much more on this topic.


.

 

[belimom]

4Jacy,
I agree. And I think I know who her molester was and what steps were taken to protect this person and by whom. And how this relates to what took place some nights later and thereafter. It fits together like a jigsaw.

Fear of litigation prevents me from saying much more on this topic.


.

I think this makes sense and I can see it happening. But here is my question: would Patsy willingly allow something like this to happen? To her mini-me? If it were ever found out, her bubble would surely burst. OR... was she just covering it up, trying to minimize public exposure/knowledge over something which she had no control (from either BR, JR, both, or a mix of others)? I think the latter.

 

[UKGuy]

I think this makes sense and I can see it happening. But here is my question: would Patsy willingly allow something like this to happen? To her mini-me? If it were ever found out, her bubble would surely burst. OR... was she just covering it up, trying to minimize public exposure/knowledge over something which she had no control (from either BR, JR, both, or a mix of others)? I think the latter.

belimom,
I think the bubble burst at the xmas party. She possibly did not know who was actively molesting JonBenet. On this occassion it happened in the presence of those that were not family members, get it? Later the non family members were to cover their backs by suggesting they were going to have a talk with Patsy about JonBenet!

No the coverup was not for Patsy but for someone else.



.

 

[belimom]

belimom,
I think the bubble burst at the xmas party. She possibly did not know who was actively molesting JonBenet. On this occassion it happened in the presence of those that were not family members, get it? Later the non family members were to cover their backs by suggesting they were going to have a talk with Patsy about JonBenet!

No the coverup was not for Patsy but for someone else.



.

I get it. However, it seems to me that - if the non-family members became aware of something like sexual abuse - then as they started to 'see the light' and the probably truth of RDI (as I believe the Whites and BFernie did), then I believe they would have relayed whatever they knew to LE during the extensive questioning (or later, if they wanted to hide it at first). That is, unless their own child/ren were complicit in the abuse as well. Or, unless these non-family members that knew about the sexual abuse were ones that have cont'd to stand by the Ramseys.

 

[UKGuy]

I get it. However, it seems to me that - if the non-family members became aware of something like sexual abuse - then as they started to 'see the light' and the probably truth of RDI (as I believe the Whites and BFernie did), then I believe they would have relayed whatever they knew to LE during the extensive questioning (or later, if they wanted to hide it at first). That is, unless their own children were complicit in the abuse as well. Or, unless these non-family members that knew about the sexual abuse were ones that have cont'd to stand by the Ramseys.

belimom,
This is what I think happened, collusion amongst parents who knew who was molesting JonBenet. Later they rationalised their decisions by suggesting they intended to discuss JonBenet's behavior with Patsy!


.

 

[DeeDee249]

The only "theory" I have about the pineapple is that someone, (JR?) offered her a treat, but I reallly don't know.

On you second point, sorry, I cannot source/link it.

Best I can give you midwest!

Pineapple was a routine snack for JB and Patsy said she always bought fresh pineapple pre-cut. It can be found this way in any supermarket. Only Patsy's and BR's prints were on the bowl, so JB likely simply picked out pieces she ate.

On the second point, I had read that JR had a photo of Beth in his bathroom, not his shower.

 

[midwest mama]

Pineapple was a routine snack for JB and Patsy said she always bought fresh pineapple pre-cut. It can be found this way in any supermarket. Only Patsy's and BR's prints were on the bowl, so JB likely simply picked out pieces she ate.

On the second point, I had read that JR had a photo of Beth in his bathroom, not his shower.

DeeDee, do you recall ever reading anything about JR calling for someone to come to his hotel room and dress as a pageant queen, as was stated in post 773 in this thread? Or anything similar?

 

[DeeDee249]

DeeDee, do you recall ever reading anything about JR calling for someone to come to his hotel room and dress as a pageant queen, as was stated in post 773 in this thread? Or anything similar?

No-I had never seen that apart from this post.

 

[4Jacy]

Pineapple was a routine snack for JB and Patsy said she always bought fresh pineapple pre-cut. It can be found this way in any supermarket. Only Patsy's and BR's prints were on the bowl, so JB likely simply picked out pieces she ate.

On the second point, I had read that JR had a photo of Beth in his bathroom, not his shower.

I may be wrong about the picture of Beth in his shower. But still, in his bathroom??? I have pictures of my family all over my house, but somehow never thought to have them in my bathroom. I find that very kinky, JMNSHO.

 

[belimom]

I may be wrong about the picture of Beth in his shower. But still, in his bathroom??? I have pictures of my family all over my house, but somehow never thought to have them in my bathroom. I find that very kinky, JMNSHO.

I wonder if it was jealousy on PR's part? Just speculating, but perhaps the photo of Beth was relegated to *his* bathroom, to minimize her exposure to it, as well as an effort to minimize the importance of at least one of his children in order for hers to take the spotlight. I know she was deceased but perhaps there was still some jealousy there on PR's part.

(I say this from experience in my own family - both immediate and extended - where children from first marriages are seen as a threat to later-born children. I am in no way a Ramsey supporter but wondering if there is any significance to the photo being in his bathroom. I personally don't think JR was molesting JBR, but I know some folks do think that. If so, then maybe I can see the importance of the picture.)

 

[4Jacy]

I wonder if it was jealousy on PR's part? Just speculating, but perhaps the photo of Beth was relegated to *his* bathroom, to minimize her exposure to it, as well as an effort to minimize the importance of at least one of his children in order for hers to take the spotlight. I know she was deceased but perhaps there was still some jealousy there on PR's part.

(I say this from experience in my own family - both immediate and extended - where children from first marriages are seen as a threat to later-born children. I am in no way a Ramsey supporter but wondering if there is any significance to the photo being in his bathroom. I personally don't think JR was molesting JBR, but I know some folks do think that. If so, then maybe I can see the importance of the picture.)

Belimom, this is only my opinion, however, I don't think Patsy would have had the clout to "relegate" anything to JR, just saying. You are probably right, Patsy (God I hate typing her name) may have had some jealousy, and that is very sick and very sad.

In my not so very humble opinion, this family was not only highly dysfunctional, their grasp of reality was not at all normal, and their morals were disgusting. (Let's remember the tranvestites that were invited into their home for parties).

To me, personally, this was a family from hell, and JR/PR gave into any and every perverse activities that would either bring them pleasure or numb the pain of their shallow existience.

I suppose I must add MOO!

 

[AD0086]

I may be wrong about the picture of Beth in his shower. But still, in his bathroom??? I have pictures of my family all over my house, but somehow never thought to have them in my bathroom. I find that very kinky, JMNSHO.

I ... don't find this very weird? I've also never seen pictures of the R's bathroom though. I imagine it would be rather large and rambling. Maybe there was a shelf or two or even a large place on the sink area to sit the photo? It doesn't scream weird to me.

Also, I'm always struggling b/t RDI and BDI. Its plausible to me that BDI..but why would he ask "What did you find?" He KNEW what they found. I don't understand.

 

[midwest mama]

4Jacy - With reference to your posts #773 and #791, you mention JR calling for someone to come to a hotel room to dress as a pageant queen, and you also mention transvestites invited to the Ramsey home for parties. In all the written material I've seen, I've not seen these things.

But I still come across something every now and then that is new to me, so is this something I've missed? :dunno: Anyone else on this forum know of this?

I do recall reading about Patsy (and some gal pals?) parading around with a cigar and telling off-color jokes at the 40th birthday party that was thrown for her by her friends. :notgood: You know....the same PR that was such a good Christian person!

 

[Rashi'sDaughter]

Midwest Mama, I was going to post the same thing, but you beat me to it, LOL! Transvestites? Really????? French maids I could believe, but transvestites?

 

[4Jacy]

4Jacy - With reference to your posts #773 and #791, you mention JR calling for someone to come to a hotel room to dress as a pageant queen, and you also mention transvestites invited to the Ramsey home for parties. In all the written material I've seen, I've not seen these things.

But I still come across something every now and then that is new to me, so is this something I've missed? :dunno: Anyone else on this forum know of this?

I do recall reading about Patsy (and some gal pals?) parading around with a cigar and telling off-color jokes at the 40th birthday party that was thrown for her by her friends. :notgood: You know....the same PR that was such a good Christian person!

I read about both of these things happening. I'll check my books and ask others to help research also. I don't know where JB was staying when the hotel invite supposedly happened, but I believe he flew her in.

 

[Nom de plume]

Hi everyone! First post on this case.

I've followed this case from day one, although not as closely in the last few years. I may be a bit rusty on some of the players & details.

From the beginning I've always felt that JR was caught molesting JBR by PR. She strikes me as the type of "mother" that would blame the child instead of the pervert father. Learned behavior perhaps from her own childhood? I'm leaning towards PR doing the head bash. I'm fuzzy on the details from that point until the 911 call. I am certain in my own mind that PR wrote the "screen play"...er uh RN. I don't know what role he played, but feel BR was somehow involved, either directly or indirectly. I also feel sure that both JR & PR did the staging.

After reading up on the case, here and elsewhere, I'm now inclined to believe BR may have also been molesting JBR, and may have been molested himself. It's just too strange for two children in the house, ages 6 & 10 (almost), to be having such "accident issues". Classic sign of abuse. Even without abuse there were some serious issues going on in that house. Can you say dysfunctional?

I do remember hearing a long time ago about JR wanting an escort dressed as a beauty queen, but have no idea where I heard that now. It's not a far leap to me from JR marrying a beauty queen, to wanting a substitute when the original couldn't meet his needs. The substitute could be an escort, or it could be a much younger beauty queen.

This is all JMHO. I used to be very set in this theory, but after hearing some other theories here, I'm now more open to bending my own, as long as it doesn't include IDI! :floorlaugh:

 

[belimom]

As a psychologist, I'd like to comment on the nighttime accidents. It can be a sign of abuse and/or emotional trauma. However, it can also be a sign of sensory issues which are sometimes present in ADHD and/or learning disabilities. In the Ramsey household, I'm not sure what was going on. I think BR may have some Asperger's traits from what I've read, but bedwetting isn't really a symptom of Asperger's. And JBR didn't seem to have any sensory/coordination issues, if she could perfectly perform all of those routines that she did.

FYI, I'm speaking of wetting. The defecation? That's another matter entirely and is very rare at that age. It can have an emotional cause, or, very tragically, can be the loss of some sphincter control due to abuse.

Who knows what was going on in that household. I'd like to believe it was just a tragic accident or a fit of rage rather than abuse. But that's just because going down the path of chronic abuse in that home really creeps me out as well as makes me extremely angry. It's sick.

 

[midwest mama]

:welcome: nom de plume

Good post - hope you'll be back. FYI: I want to be under the palapa on your avatar! My favorite places to be for R&R, and Tahiti still waits on my top 5 places to see before I go on my final journey.

Somehow the recent comments about JR's "activities" make me feel like "yep, wouldn't doubt it", but sources and links always bring the hammer down.

I recall also that his business trips took him once where he and Patsy were seen walking on a "tour" that included the red light district. Guess there's a tour to suit every traveler? Knowing that, why would those good Christians want to chose a tour that included that area? hdear:

 

[Nom de plume]

:welcome: nom de plume

Good post - hope you'll be back. FYI: I want to be under the palapa on your avatar! My favorite places to be for R&R, and Tahiti still waits on my top 5 places to see before I go on my final journey.

Somehow the recent comments about JR's "activities" make me feel like "yep, wouldn't doubt it", but sources and links always bring the hammer down.

I recall also that his business trips took him once where he and Patsy were seen walking on a "tour" that included the red light district. Guess there's a tour to suit every traveler? Knowing that, why would those good Christians want to chose a tour that included that area? hdear:

Thanks MM! Dreaming about being under that palapa is what gives me reason to get through the other 51 weeks a year. Love the Caribbean and the South Pacific. Fiji & Tahiti are definitely are on my bucket list! lease:

I wonder what their church feels about some of the things the Rs have said and done? Is their behavior accepted in their church? Or are clergy and fellow members mortified about what they have found out regarding some of the R's activites?

Personally, I can't understand how any good mother, Christian or not, can put her child in some of the risque costumes and poses that JBR was in. IMO it is just sexualizing a defenseless child, advertising her to every pervert around. It seems especially strange, and wrong, for a woman that was supposedly abused herself as a child (and I'd bet that she was). OTOH, maybe that is exactly why she did it! She grew up that way, so she figured her daughter should too. I truely believe PR was a very sick woman, and I'm not referring to her cancer! :furious:

JMO

 

[midwest mama]

Thanks MM! Dreaming about being under that palapa is what gives me reason to get through the other 51 weeks a year. Love the Caribbean and the South Pacific. Fiji & Tahiti are definitely are on my bucket list! lease:

I wonder what their church feels about some of the things the Rs have said and done? Is their behavior accepted in their church? Or are clergy and fellow members mortified about what they have found out regarding some of the R's activites?

Personally, I can't understand how any good mother, Christian or not, can put her child in some of the risque costumes and poses that JBR was in. IMO it is just sexualizing a defenseless child, advertising her to every pervert around. It seems especially strange, and wrong, for a woman that was supposedly abused herself as a child (and I'd bet that she was). OTOH, maybe that is exactly why she did it! She grew up that way, so she figured her daughter should too. I truely believe PR was a very sick woman, and I'm not referring to her cancer! :furious:

JMO

I got lucky and had a 2 day layover in Fiji on a flight back from NewZealand in 2007. Trip of a lifetime - friend with family in NZ and travel connections invited me. First snorkeling experience in Fiji hooked me and can't go anywhere without my mask now!

There was info printed that many of their church friends from the early years disconnected from them. Then JR put out that pity party book last year that tripped my trigger into the forum - using his Christianity as an excuse to write about his healing and thereby make more money off his departed child just galls me to no end. And yes, I AM a Christian, and I AM judging him, and based upon my knowledge of the scriptures, I have justifiable righteous anger regarding JR and PR, though without the law making a call upon their guilt or innocence, I must withhold my full wrath and disgust trusting that our Lord has it all under control. Have to admit that I'm not always very patient with His timing - one of the weaknesses I have that keeps me busy praying!

Couldn't agree with you more about Patsy's illnesses! And that said, with Mr. Ramsey having been so significantly attached to her, what must his true character be like? And lets not forget the issues those poor children battled. Grandma Nedra was a quite a force to reckon with also, according to the printed word. I wonder how she managed to keep her whip so discreetly hidden?