What info did Lee A take to the defense team?

[Controversialist]

I agree, he should have called LE on the spot...I don't know why the tow yard manager didn't call when he looked in the window and smelled it...however, we are not looking at this through the prism of a grandfather who cannot let his brain think that his granddaughter is dead. Your mind does funny things and I think George believed the smell was garbage because he desperately needed to believe it. I don't think he believed it for very long, but the main thing right then was there was no body in the trunk and at that moment that was all he cared about. Deep down George knew his life was changed forever when he smelled that car, but he talked himself into accepting the garbage as the smell because he wasn't ready to accept anything else.

Yes, I agree that hindsight is 20/20, it's easy to analyze GA's actions from my Lazy-Boy recliner after the fact.

So maybe when GA found the car he had a subliminal desire to delay finding out out the inevitable, and kicked the can down the road for awhile. By calling LE he might have had to immediately face the realization of an unthinkable scenario.

And yet---what saith the law? Was GA obligated by law to report such a finding despite his apprehension? :waitasec:

 

[Studio_Medic]

I keep reading posters stating that GA was a homicide detective which is incorrect. He was actually a street deputy for 2 years and then went on to work as a detective in the auto theft division for 6 years. After that he then went in as an undercover detective in the drug and surveillance division for 1.5 years. He started LE in 1975, left LE somewhere in 1984.

However, he was NEVER a homicide detective, he states he would occasionally cross over and help out in the violent crimes/homicides division, but was never assigned to that division.

"We had an auto theft division, which I was basically assigned to. We also had a homicide division, which I occasionally worked in".

Quoted from his deposition...http://www.thehinkymeter.com/Library/CMA/depos/ganthonydepo080509.pdf

 

[Controversialist]

i think they wanted to get Casey's story before calling LE and hoped there would be an answer. Didnt GA or CA call LA an say "we got the car, Casey is in trouble"
they were probably very confused since Casey was supposed to be in Jacksonville. The smell in the car made them desperate to find Casey and CA started looking immediately. CA called 911 when she found Casey thinking the threat would make ICA produce Caylee for her. I think they just couldnt wrap their heads around the fact they were smelling decomp and really wanted answers hoping their suspicions were wrong.

I think your logic is as clear a crystal. :bowdown: The fact that LE has never charged GA with obstruction (to my knowledge) suggests to me that GA and CA had plausible grounds for delaying their call.

However--- Does this exonerate CA on cleaning the car?? Yes, CA may call ICA to get her story, but I'm not sure CA's 42 point cleaning of the Pontiac was kosher. :waitasec:

I know the A's were going through an emotional whipsaw, but, in hindsight, just leave the car as is, until you get ICA's feedback. This would have guarded the A's from suspicions of a cover-up, after the fact.

:coffeews:

 

[Controversialist]

MOO-

Because when you are used to pretending that someone is something that they are not, you are used to covering for them. They needed a minute to realize how to act normally, IMO. Their "normal" was to cover up a possible mistake.

I think your point has tremendous merit. I recall that prior to the Sunfire discovery, on July 3, 2008, CA's Myspace page had a mini-essay about her travails with ICA.

Maybe CA's appetite for covering ICA's backside was beginning to erode at that point. Certainly, on the 911 call CA appears to have crossed over into full, prosecution mode with ICA (albeit, while still clinging to the fictional fantasy about Zanny the kidnapper). fftobed:

 

[shaye]

About LEE on the stand... please remember that he DID father a child! (refer to his past myspace postings...)and the mother of that child terminated the pregnancy (without consulting LEE/didn't include him in the decision...) - IIRC He could get torn up by that IMO...

eta: http://www.docstoc.com/docs/5395527/Lee-Anthony-Myspace-Blogging

Dec 10 2006 entry...

Wow...interesting to read all that again if I didn't know better I'd think he was talking about KC w/all that drama, lol.

The emails between Cindy and her brother Rick are there too...Rick sure had KC's number, wonder what Cindy thinks about that now?!?

 

[Francine]

JP did not meet Casey until 2007. No way possible he is the dad...

How do you know for sure? She had lots of one night stands. Maybe she nor he remember. Maybe he doesn't want to get involved. I read JP's depo and he waffled about the 2007 first initial meeting date (ref. pps. 12 - 13). He said it was "probably" or "possibly" around the summer of 2007. Considering he had a couple of years to prepare for questions in the depo, there was a lot of "I don't remember" or "I don't recall". He came across as evasive to me. Manson, Baez, Ashton and LDB did not push for him to be specific about dates and times for that answer as well as many others in his depo.

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/80282073/20100604-JP-Chatt-Depo

Caylee was not the daughter of Lee. She certainly didn't look like Casey (who looks a lot like her father), so Caylee would most likely look more like her bio dad's side of the family.

 

[Francine]

One of my sons doesn't look a DARN thing like his father, instead, looks just like mine. He is 100% my husband's though!

So he takes after your side of the family does he? Same with my child, he doesn't look at all like my husband, but he strikingly looks like my sister. I don't think my sister and I look that much alike, but strangers do. He resembles my side of the family.

 

[Francine]

Even if Caylee didn't look like Mark, that doesn't mean he wasn't the father. For years my daughter looked like two of her paternal aunts...and not her dad.

Seems like she takes after your side of the family, just like my son takes after my side of the family. He doesn't look at all like my husband or his parents or brothe and sister. Caylee didn't look at all like Casey or George.

I'm not a geneticist or a biologist by any stretch of the imagination, but I can generally tell from looking at children and their parents, which side of the family they resemble the most.

Just my opinion.

 

[larryphx]

I would hire either one of these guys..what a great watch..Thank you!!!

This is a great watch... I agree Jose thought Lee was going to throw George under the bus... EVERYONE should watch this video.

 

[miss plum]

This would also explain why CA was so mean to LA when he asked about her pregnancy. Could also be why he was kept away from the hospital. His tears on the stand could be from remembering how he felt when CA treated him that way. Who knows I wouldn't put it past KC to have told LA he was the father, he may have believed he was the father until FBI ran DNA because when Jessie was found not to be the father it probably made him think he MUST be her father, CA and GA would also believe him to be the father for sure since Jessie wasn't. Maybe the CMA comments at the memorial had something to do with how CLOSE LA and KC were. WOW....

The above was a response to a post of mine and I just want to make it very clear that I don't believe LA could have thought he was Caylee's father because I don't believe he ever had a sexual relationship with KC. She has not even claimed that. But I think it's possible she lied about it to CA so she would get support and sympathy and that would explain why he was kept out of the loop.

 

[MADJGNLAW]

I'm not sure what Lee took to the defense..at one time I thought he was the one that helped Casey dispose of the body, maybe he had more of the duct tape and was going to admit it was him not George that helped dispose of the body. Then I thought he must of had something to do with the clean up, that could of been the reason at the memorial he had said. "CMA" I will always keep my promise to you. I want to know what Promise he is talking about...

But...O/T: Maybe I have something in my ear..I can only hear out of one as it is. DID YOU GUYS NOTICE WHEN BAEZ ASKED LEE WHEN DID HE FIND OUT CASEY WAS PREGNANT HE SAID IN 2008? I listen to that part over and over on the DVR to make sure I was hearing right. Wonder why Ashton didn't ask him what that was about?


Baez had to remind him that it was not 2008, he had said Casey had picked him up from the airport in 2008 when he found out she was pregnant.

Then later on when Ashton asked him he kept saying 2008 again. He also told Ashton that he noticed when Casey had came out of the bathroom. He was still living in the home and was waiting for her to come out of the bathroom then he noticed her belie.

Video with Baez: http://www.wftv.com/video/28347568/index.html

IMO, something happen in 2008 between Lee, Casey and Caylee..why would he keep yr 2008 in his mind?

 

[Eileen730]

My 5 year old hid his "accidents" better!

IMO this was all ICA and trying to cover up the murder by making it look like a "set up"- being "framed" etc...
BUT she didn't realize she couldn't EVER get rid of the smell.

MY question is what former homocide cop takes home a car smelling like that one did? HAD HE CALLED ORANGE COUNTY RIGHT THEN...
he wouldn't be sitting where he is now...

there is something hinky about why he took the car...
and that COULD lead to one juror thinking, well he tried to hide the car/eveidence for ICA ... so just maybe he tried to hide Caylee for ICA too (make it look like a kidnappier tried to frame ICA for murder)
iT won't work but could have been the line of thinking... on JB's part.

I think George and Cindy knew after the smell in that car that the baby was dead
the cover up started that day...

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

I was under the impression that the information he provided to defense was something he heard while he was in the courtroom before he testified. I didn't hear that it necessarily came from his parents.

I believe that any information that he provided to the DT would be beneficial to ICA AND that it would be information that GA or CA would NOT want the DT to know about......

I think that GA, CA and LA are all in agreement that they do not want ICA to receive the death penalty.

I think the answer lies in how/why those 3 parties might have a different opinion on a critical issue. I can't imagine what this issue might be.

All I know is I am more confused now that I was before this circus began. I'm so tired of hearing that because there are photos of Caylee in a pool that now there is reasonable doubt???? I have hundreds of pool/beach photos of my daughters - and they are both still alive. NONSENSE All of it!!!

BBM..I also wonder how those photos of Caylee getting into the pool came in as evidence? I've never seen them through discovery documents so how was this able to come into evidence? I see the State objected but they were overruled...

I'm wondering if LA heard of the sexual abuse and the fact that ICA implicated GA in this untruthful drowning scenario (He had to have heard the DT's OS)...Baez seemed to have backed off the sexual abuse allegation with LA. He had him on the stand and didn't ask if he ever molested ICA!

I also wonder if this legal matter has to do with ICA backing down off her theory...the defense didn't think this through, it has too many gapping holes...JMHO

Justice for Caylee

 

[downport]

I agree, he should have called LE on the spot... I don't know why the tow yard manager didn't call when he looked in the window and smelled it [\B]...however, we are not looking at this through the prism of a grandfather who cannot let his brain think that his granddaughter is dead. Your mind does funny things and I think George believed the smell was garbage because he desperately needed to believe it. I don't think he believed it for very long, but the main thing right then was there was no body in the trunk and at that moment that was all he cared about. Deep down George knew his life was changed forever when he smelled that car, but he talked himself into accepting the garbage as the smell because he wasn't ready to accept anything else.

o/t sorry but ... the tow yard manager bothers me to no end. The whole 'not my problem, not getting involved' attitude of people is disturbing. You pick up an abandoned car & know for an absolute fact it smells like a dead body & don't call the police THAT VERY MINUTE ? Even if he had x-ray vision & KNEW there wasn't a body in the trunk, (which he DIDN'T), he still should have called. Then you contact the owner & THEY DON'T RESPOND ? The guy is no hero. Sorry but I have very strong feelings about his behavior & actions.

How different would this case have been if this 'not MY problem' guy had met his responsibilities as a decent person the day he smelled a dead body in an abandoned car ? He really bugs me.

 

[Queenofwands]

And just as an aside, I think the mother of this baby gives her nyquil to sleep, I think this because it was in her diaper bag and I can see her doing it. Not against the law and nothing I can prove. If I bring it up, she might cut me off. What do you do?

Contact child protection!!! Nyquil is ONLY for people over the age of 12, IIRC. :banghead:

 

[logicalgirl]

BBM..I also wonder how those photos of Caylee getting into the pool came in as evidence? I've never seen them through discovery documents so how was this able to come into evidence? I see the State objected but they were overruled...

I'm wondering if LA heard of the sexual abuse and the fact that ICA implicated GA in this untruthful drowning scenario (He had to have heard the DT's OS)...Baez seemed to have backed off the sexual abuse allegation with LA. He had him on the stand and didn't ask if he ever molested ICA!

I also wonder if this legal matter has to do with ICA backing down off her theory...the defense didn't think this through, it has too many gapping holes...JMHO

Justice for Caylee

Thanks LiveLaughLuv - I'm with you on curious about the pool photos - and as CA was testifying I was thinking this is new and where are we going with it. I have seen pretty young kids go up the ladders of slides at the park, but those "ladders" are not open at the sides like the pool ladder, so I have real trouble seeing Caylee climbing the pool ladder by herself. And I don't believe "someone" left the ladder up by mistake.

It's also interesting that most posters view the info about Lee going to the defense team as automatically taking them something to help them. There is the question of whether it was to help them or to warn Baez that he would not be cooperating with Baez if Baez was using false information. He may have told Baez he would not go along with abuse allegations that were not true. Baez was not his usual aggressive self with Lee, in fact he kind of tippy toed around him. You notice when CA was on the stand all teary, he asked her if she needed a break. No such question to Lee. Baez had the perfect opportunity to ask Lee about the abuse when he was on the stand and he didn't even hint at the question.

And last, I laughed out loud at the JVM story of the elevator and George turning away to face the wall. JVM has been one of the talking heads who has been the most aggressively negative to the males in the Anthony family and the most pro-Baez talking head. Would you have given her anything to use in the elevator ride. George was more likely trying to restrain himself from decking her.

 

[RoseTree]

o/t sorry but ... the tow yard manager bothers me to no end. The whole 'not my problem, not getting involved' attitude of people is disturbing. You pick up an abandoned car & know for an absolute fact it smells like a dead body & don't call the police THAT VERY MINUTE ? Even if he had x-ray vision & KNEW there wasn't a body in the trunk, (which he DIDN'T), he still should have called. Then you contact the owner & THEY DON'T RESPOND ? The guy is no hero. Sorry but I have very strong feelings about his behavior & actions.

How different would this case have been if this 'not MY problem' guy had met his responsibilities as a decent person the day he smelled a dead body in an abandoned car ? He really bugs me.

I agree with this. I almost think that he may have set the tone. I know that the tow yard manager's non nonchalant attitude about the decomp smell probably didn't help George to feel like it was neccesary to call LE. I'm not letting him off the hook, but sometimes it's easier to do what is hard when everyone is on board. He was probably just thinking that he wanted to get the "Da*n car" home.

BUt seriously, why didn't the tow yard manager call police if he was so sure? Sheesh! At least he contacted LE later.

 

[RoseTree]

I think George and Cindy knew after the smell in that car that the baby was dead
the cover up started that day...

I AGREE! In this family, the cover up for iCA's lies and pretending are what they do naturally. For them to not do so is unnatural, which is why we see CA flip flop back and forth, imo.

 

[grammieto5]

I only listened to LA's testimony off and on. I did see him get emotional, when the shower was mentioned. I thought at the time NO MALE gets that upset about not being included in a baby shower. I believe I heard LA say he really wasn't involved with KC during her pregnancy becasue they didn't include him, so I also thought, maybe, at that time it was a possibillity LA could be the father, I know he's not but at that time ??? with this family you never know! I will watch the testimony again, I believe the part I'm looking for is when JA is doing the cross. I know I have not seen any of that part, I know it will be interesting. I really do believe there is something about LA. I don't even know what type of relationship LA had with baby Caylee, was he a hands on Uncle, or just someone baby Caylee saw only on special occasions? I would also like to know what LA meant when he asked KC is this like the last time, what was the promise LA made, and also what secret is he keeping. I'm beginning to think LA is just filled with a lot of guilt, and maybe some anger too. Well time will tell, or maybe not, with this family you can never tell!!! I just told my hubby this morning this case is like reading a really good mystery novel Was LA impeached? Was LA given immunity?

 

[grammieto5]

Preface... I mean this in a serious way. I wonder if GA is being medicated or watched out for, in case of another suicide attempt? I think he's deeply involved in all of this, and he's not totally stupid, he was, after all a police det. at one point. He has to see what's coming, or is he not worried because he is going to throw himself on the sword when called to the stand??

Granted, I think he is the one that orchestrated the whole kidnapping conspiracy/cover-up, but I think one member of the family dying is enough. BTW, if you haven't surmised yet, I'm opposed to the DP, but that's each individuals opinion to form for themselves. JMOO

Or not opposed Now there's a good topic for a thread ????? anyone???