Who Killed Jon Benet Ramsey? Poll

[Anti-K]

Patsy wrote the note. No examiner could eliminate her. And Carnes simply didn't allow the examiners that were anti Patsy to testify.

And let's not forget that Patsy's print was on that page despite her denials of ever touching it.

Patsy wrote the note.

Just because the Ramsey's lawyers were far better, and were clever enough to convince Carnes, does not make her decision to disallow certain handwriting experts correct. Just because they weren't allowed to speak, it does not negate what they had to say.

Just like when Johnny Cochrane said the glove didn't fit, it didn't mean the glove didn't fit. All it meant was that he was a better lawyer than Chris Darden.


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Nope, you got this all wrong.

Mrs Ramsey’s print was not on the ransom note.

Carnes did not consider expert’s conclusions when deciding against experts. Wong was disqualified because she was not found to be credible; even Epstein said she wasn’t credible and Kane, in preparation for the Grand Jury, wrote Wong a letter explaining why he did not consider her to be credible. Epstein was found credible as an expert but his conclusion was not allowed because he was unable to show how he arrived at his questionable conclusion (100% certainty).

None of the other experts identified Mrs Ramsey and that, too, is a fact. Quote from Carnes: …the experts' consensus was that she "probably did not" write the Ransom Note. (SMF, 196; PSMF 196.)14 On a scale of one to five, with five being elimination as the author of the Ransom Note, the experts placed Mrs. Ramsey at a 4.5 or a 4.0. (SMF 203; PSMF 203.) The experts described the chance of Mrs. Ramsey being the author of the Ransom Note as "very low."

These are Facts.
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AK

 

[Anti-K]

And also she changed the way she wrote starting with the handwriting samples. At least her letter a. I mean, it really doesn't look good. Similarities can be dismissed to a point, but going around trying to disguise your writing post ransom note looks really, really bad.


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It is not a fact that Mrs Ramsey changed her handwriting; however, when the whole world seems to think that you murdered your child and that you wrote the ransom note, then altering one’s handwriting might seem a sensible thing to do. it seems more an act of paranoia than of guilt.
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AK

 

[InstantProof]

She denied ever touching the ransom note?

 

[InstantProof]

It is not a fact that Mrs Ramsey changed her handwriting; however, when the whole world seems to think that you murdered your child and that you wrote the ransom note, then altering one’s handwriting might seem a sensible thing to do. it seems more an act of paranoia than of guilt.
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AK

But then you couple it with the video of her claiming she does not know who wrote the captions in her children's photo album- written child-like and resembling the RN- and it's pretty obvious she wrote the RN.

 

[andreww]

She denied ever touching the ransom note?

She sure did. But there's her print on there. And we know whoever wrote it did a practice note first, so the odds of Patsy's print being there from the previous usage is slim.

 

[Ellie9]

It is not a fact that Mrs Ramsey changed her handwriting; however, when the whole world seems to think that you murdered your child and that you wrote the ransom note, then altering one’s handwriting might seem a sensible thing to do. it seems more an act of paranoia than of guilt.
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AK

It was apparently written in Steve Thomas' book. The quotes are listed here. I'm kind of guessing you'll just say this is wrong and Thomas is wrong. It's hard to talk to anyone who won't even consider for a second any evidence that they don't like.

 

[andreww]

It is not a fact that Mrs Ramsey changed her handwriting; however, when the whole world seems to think that you murdered your child and that you wrote the ransom note, then altering one’s handwriting might seem a sensible thing to do. it seems more an act of paranoia than of guilt.
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AK

I think you are aware as I am that the Ramsey's were very stingy in providing any relevant samples from prior to the murder, so proving she changed her handwriting becomes more difficult. However, in the few samples that were found it was certainly evident that she was making her "a"s differently from the way she had been before the crime. You are also aware that she began typing her notes to Burkes school rather than hand writing them. She also denied writing in the family photo album. Again, with the Ramsey's you are always making excuses for them, "maybe she hurt her hand and had to type those notes" of "maybe she had a housekeeper put her photo album together?". These people are always followed by coincidences that point directly at them, and AK, you're always there to come up with far fetched explanations for them.

 

[andreww]

It was apparently written in Steve Thomas' book. The quotes are listed here. I'm kind of guessing you'll just say this is wrong and Thomas is wrong. It's hard to talk to anyone who won't even consider for a second any evidence that they don't like.

Thomas? I noticed her altered writing style long before I knew anything about Thomas's opinion of it. Its that obvious!

 

[InstantProof]

She sure did. But there's her print on there. And we know whoever wrote it did a practice note first, so the odds of Patsy's print being there from the previous usage is slim.

An attempt to distance herself, yet it would make more sense to just pick it up, especially since it is laid out on the stairs and her initial thought is that the housekeeper left it.

 

[andreww]

Nope, you got this all wrong.

Mrs Ramsey’s print was not on the ransom note.

Carnes did not consider expert’s conclusions when deciding against experts. Wong was disqualified because she was not found to be credible; even Epstein said she wasn’t credible and Kane, in preparation for the Grand Jury, wrote Wong a letter explaining why he did not consider her to be credible. Epstein was found credible as an expert but his conclusion was not allowed because he was unable to show how he arrived at his questionable conclusion (100% certainty).

None of the other experts identified Mrs Ramsey and that, too, is a fact. Quote from Carnes: …the experts' consensus was that she "probably did not" write the Ransom Note. (SMF, 196; PSMF 196.)14 On a scale of one to five, with five being elimination as the author of the Ransom Note, the experts placed Mrs. Ramsey at a 4.5 or a 4.0. (SMF 203; PSMF 203.) The experts described the chance of Mrs. Ramsey being the author of the Ransom Note as "very low."

These are Facts.
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AK

Did you read what I said? Just because Carnes rejected the experts that felt Patsy wrote the note, does not make it so. In fact the experts she rejected all went on with their careers, testifying in other cases without issue. You know damned well that your pall Lin Wood worked his *advertiser censored* off to get those experts booted.

And why do you call them Mr. and Mrs. Ramsey? Sounds like you work for them or something lol.

 

[Ellie9]

An attempt to distance herself, yet it would make more sense to just pick it up, especially since it is laid out on the stairs and her initial thought is that the housekeeper left it.

Does anyone else find it really weird that in a house that's so huge this intruder placed the note exactly where PR usually receives notes? What the heck? If I was going to leave a kidnapping note I'd put it in the kitchen (most people get at least coffee before going out.) When I leave notes for my husband I just put them on this side table by his favourite chair in the living room. He's always there to drink coffee in the morning.

If we found a ransom note in this exact spot in our own home, I'd expect police to think it was suspicious. Especially if I declared this was the usual location for notes in my family, but that an outsider had to be responsible.

 

[andreww]

An attempt to distance herself, yet it would make more sense to just pick it up, especially since it is laid out on the stairs and her initial thought is that the housekeeper left it.

When would her housekeeper have put it there? She sneak in to the house While the slept? Busy place that Ramsey house.

 

[andreww]

Does anyone else find it really weird that in a house that's so huge this intruder placed the note exactly where PR usually receives notes? What the heck? If I was going to leave a kidnapping note I'd put it near the kitchen (most people get at least coffee before going out.) When I leave notes for my husband I just put them on this side table by his favourite chair in the living room. He's always there to drink coffee in the morning.

If we found a ransom note in this exact spot in our own home, I'd expect police to think it was suspicious. Especially if I declared this was the usual location for notes in my family, but that an outsider had to be responsible.

Of course it is suspicious. Thats where Patsy's housekeeper would leave notes. The one that asked to borrow money. The one that had a key. The one that Patsy threw under the bus.

You get the picture? There was a deliberate attempt to implicate LHP, or so it appeared, but how would an intruder know to leave the note there?

 

[TroyinTX]

Of course it is suspicious. Thats where Patsy's housekeeper would leave notes. The one that asked to borrow money. The one that had a key. The one that Patsy through under the bus.

You get the picture? There was a deliberate attempt to implicate LHP, or so it appeared, but how would an intruder know to leave the note there?

Yes, that has always been a huge red flag. How would an unknown intruder just happen to choose that location to leave the note? Not only that, but it seems this unknown intruder was quite able to find his way around the huge house quite easily, right down to a little used room in the basement. It's also funny that virtually everything used in the crime (the pen, the pad, the garrot handle, the blankets, etc..) came from the Ramsey's home.

 

[Ellie9]

Of course it is suspicious. Thats where Patsy's housekeeper would leave notes. The one that asked to borrow money. The one that had a key. The one that Patsy through under the bus.

You get the picture? There was a deliberate attempt to implicate LHP, or so it appeared, but how would an intruder know to leave the note there?

This is especially sad considering two things... the housekeeper apparently wrote a sweet note of condolence before police questioned her. And the worst thing here is singling out a person who definitely could not afford to hire the legal defense she would need to be cleared if it went to trial.

 

[Annapurna]

I've always heard there were no fingerprints on the note at all. Which is still a tiny bit strange since the R's both admitted to handling it. At least sort of, you had PR "stepping over it and turning around" which is a little awkward, and then you had JR "spreading it out on the floor" in his undies

That said it is possible to handle things without leaving fingerprints if your hands are clean and dry. Sebaceous glands (sweat/oil gland) are not present on the palms of the hand.

* (Note, I was wondering how it was possible to get sweaty palms without those glands and it turns out there are so called Eccrine glands on the palms, they are triggered by the sympathetic nervous system "The glands on palms and soles do not respond to temperature but secrete at times of emotional stress." wikipedia. Just something I found interesting)*

The R's threw any and everyone under the bus. That was part of this whole charade, throw everything out there to point away from them and see what sticks. From LHP (who by the way was harassed by jameson long after this, accusing her husband of making child *advertiser censored*, horrible) to the Whites, to Jeff Merrick (I think thats his name?) the so called"disgruntled employee" of Access Graphics and so on. The point of all the staging is to point outwards. This is true even if you believe in IDI! The scene was staged, by whoever. This is evidenced by the fact that she was wrapped in the blanket in a different location than the urine stain which shows where she expired (right outside of the WC door IIRC).

 

[Anti-K]

But then you couple it with the video of her claiming she does not know who wrote the captions in her children's photo album- written child-like and resembling the RN- and it's pretty obvious she wrote the RN.

No, it isn’t obvious. You just made that up. If it was obvious than BPD’s experts – all the experts – would have identified her as the author, but that didn’t happen. if it was obvious, there would be no disagreement and we wouldn’t be having this discussion.
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AK

 

[andreww]

I've always heard there were no fingerprints on the note at all. Which is still a tiny bit strange since the R's both admitted to handling it. At least sort of, you had PR "stepping over it and turning around" which is a little awkward, and then you had JR "spreading it out on the floor" in his undies

That said it is possible to handle things without leaving fingerprints if your hands are clean and dry. Sebaceous glands (sweat/oil gland) are not present on the palms of the hand.

Yes, and with John just getting out of the shower, one would assume that his skin would be anything but dry. But not a single print.

As for Patsy's print, I'll have to look it up but I think it was a partial palm print.


ETA - Patsy prints were found all over the pad (5 of them to be exact). Also a print was found from the officer that handled it as well as a print from a forensics guy that handled it. So how did the note get moved all over the house without Mr. and Mrs. Ramsey's prints getting on it?

 

[Anti-K]

She sure did. But there's her print on there. And we know whoever wrote it did a practice note first, so the odds of Patsy's print being there from the previous usage is slim.

No fingerprints were found on the ransom not. You are spreading a lie.
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AK

 

[Anti-K]

Did you read what I said? Just because Carnes rejected the experts that felt Patsy wrote the note, does not make it so. In fact the experts she rejected all went on with their careers, testifying in other cases without issue. You know damned well that your pall Lin Wood worked his *advertiser censored* off to get those experts booted.

And why do you call them Mr. and Mrs. Ramsey? Sounds like you work for them or something lol.

Carnes reasons for rejecting Epstein and Wong are clearly and soundly stated in her decision.

I call them Mr and Mrs because I don’t know them. They aren’t my friends. We’re not a first name basis.
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AK