Who was George Brody?

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I thought that originally about Dalton, but there was a problem when the draft cards for MD and 3 other states were scanned. When you pull it up, it will show the front of the correct person's card, but the back of the previous person's. Ancestry.com has a note about about it if you pull up their typed info instead of the actual image. They say they are aware of the situation and trying to correct it.

I thought I had physical descriptions of a lot of people I had researched in WV, but it's the same way there.

Sorry.
 
Since PA comes up a lot in this case, I should say for future reference that it's also a state with the problem with the draft registration cards. (DE is the fourth.)
 
Found Dalton's draft registration for WWII. His height is listed at 5'8". I think he's back in the ballgame.

Card seems to be in his own hand writing. Anyone able to compare with samples of Brody's?
 
Tolbert Percy "Jack" Dalton
Missing since July 4, 1948 from Catonsville, Maryland.
Classification: Missing
Vital Statistics
Date Of Birth: July 3, 1885
Age at Time of Disappearance: 63 years old
Height at Time of Disappearance: 5 feet, 10½ inches
Distinguishing Characteristics: Brown hair
AKA: Jack Dalton.

Despite a facial resemblance between Dalton and GB, I doubt this is the same man. 5'10" vs GB 5'6" ish.... unless he had major osteoporosis, chances he would shrink that much is slim.

George would have been 93 at the time Anna disappeared.
 
There are many folks who shrink with age. I don't remember where it was said that GB was only 5'2". Even looking at this pic, he looks taller than that.

For some reason, WebSleuths won't let me access this picture. Can you post it again?
 
Card seems to be in his own hand writing. Anyone able to compare with samples of Brody's?

That's a good point about the handwriting. There are draft registration cards for Dalton for WWI and WWII available online, and he signed them both and appears to have filled them out. Right now I can't download them and post them here at work, so if nobody does it sooner, I'll do that this evening.

I also can't pull up the samples of GB's writing right now, but I'm looking at Dalton's now, and from what I remember I don't think they're a match. Dalton did mix cursive and print some, but it seems much more legible to me. I don't see anything strange about Dalton's. That could be because they were official documents, but GB doesn't seem to me like the type of guy who would go out of his way to make things legible for others.
 
I'm sorry. I'm still having trouble saving and posting the draft reg. cards to compare the handwriting. Sherlock, do you mind posting it again?
 
For some reason, WebSleuths won't let me access this picture. Can you post it again?
Never mind; I just figured out from the context what this picture was. I thought it was something else. Doogie was right; they are going down steps. Brody definitely was no taller than I am (5'4").
 
Annasmom--- DO you still have anything that might have George Brodys DNA on it? I wonder if a DNA profile could be done and run through CODIS to see if there are any matches--either to unsolved crimes, missing persons etc. Also--has his fingerprints been run? Sorry if I am asking this, if it has already been answered...
 
Annasmom--- DO you still have anything that might have George Brodys DNA on it? I wonder if a DNA profile could be done and run through CODIS to see if there are any matches--either to unsolved crimes, missing persons etc. Also--has his fingerprints been run? Sorry if I am asking this, if it has already been answered...
No, I don't think anybody has asked this, but unfortunately, I don't have anything that might have his DNA on it. They were unable to get DNA from Anna's little shoes (boy, was it hard to give up those shoes! At least I kept her cowboy boots.) So even if I had anything GB had touched in those days, it probably wouldn't be possible to get DNA from it. It is possible that there would be fingerprints on some of the letters, but they have been handled a lot and I don't think LE would even consider looking for fingerprints in the absence of some positive evidence of a crime. So we have to keep thinking....
 
What a shame--dna or a fingerprint would be definitive. Did the military take fingerprints in the 20's-30's? Wouldn't that be neat if after all this work, we could find out who he by a simple fingerprint? :)

No, I don't think anybody has asked this, but unfortunately, I don't have anything that might have his DNA on it. They were unable to get DNA from Anna's little shoes (boy, was it hard to give up those shoes! At least I kept her cowboy boots.) So even if I had anything GB had touched in those days, it probably wouldn't be possible to get DNA from it. It is possible that there would be fingerprints on some of the letters, but they have been handled a lot and I don't think LE would even consider looking for fingerprints in the absence of some positive evidence of a crime. So we have to keep thinking....
 
I finally recalled why this Brody & Margaret could not be the same as our GB and MK:

1) Margaret Kukoda was born in 1917, so the earliest mention of a Margaret in 1928 would have occured when Kukoda was only eleven. There are also references to George Brody and his wife Margaret in other states prior to 1928, so it is clear that they are two different sets of people.

2) We know from our talks with the Kukoda family that Margaret moved to San Francisco during World War II, which would mean probably around 1942, not circa 1928.

Once we hit the 1950's, when both sets of GB's and Margaret's are living in San Francisco, it becomes more difficult to unravel which is which. I suspect that one source of confusion is the list of suspected references to our Brody and Kukoda that Joe Ford prepared decades ago may include references to both sets. Joe, working in the 1980's, was probably unaware of the secord GB and Margaret - the information was not obvious then with the limited resources available.

Since the GB who was involved in the auto accident was listed as living in San Francisco (and at an address very close to a much later address listed for the SF Brody), I now believe that "Accident Brody" and "SF Brody" are the same guy and not our Brody. Even without this info being a match to our Brody, we can still place GB in the Bay Area much earlier than previously thought.

We know now that our initial suspicion of Anna being passed to an unsuspecting member of the Kukoda family is unlikely, so I am much less interested in tracing Margaret's whereabouts. The value of discovering Brody living in Oakland as early as 1936 is that it eliminates all of our speculations and efforts to link Brody to the mysterious "Russell" who was Margaret's boyfriend in Pennsylvania, to various boxers in Philedelphia, etc. His links for the forty years prior to Anna's disappearance are in California, which greatly narrows the focus of our research. It also helps us to know that he has been "Brody" since 1936, so that is most likely his real given name, not an alias. And we also know that his given birth-year of 1923 is obviously false.

What I would like to uncover now is some sort of birth records for Brody and gain some understanding of how he went from being a salesman and junior research assistant (seemingly a normal working guy) to being the spiritual-guru/con-man that we saw by 1967.

by little search, just my opinion....
previous finding by this forum:

1. 1923 SF George Brody, 1060 Page – Plummer, Dec.
2. 1928 SF George Brody, 2375 20th Ave – Hdw. Dealer, Rep. (Margaret Dem)
3. 1930 SF George Brody, 2375 20th Ave – none listed, Rep. (Margaret Rep)
4. 1932 SF George Brody, 2375 20th Ave. – Merchant, Rep. (Margaret Dem)
5. 1933 SF George Brody, 2375 20th Ave. – Merchant, Rep. (Margaret Dem)
6. 1938 SF George Brody ( really: George "N" Brody), 458 (430 right) Divisadero – Merchant, Dem.
7. 1940 SF George Brody, 831 Fulton – Merchant, Dem.

and by me:

8. 1940 SF George Brody,1651 Market st-merchant-Dem

9. 1944 SF George Newton Brody 641 Hayes st- machinist




well all this records could be abt same man;

George Newton Brody, born in Ohio ( but it will be true???) abt in the 1890; father born in Ohio, mother born in Germany; married abt in the 1918/9 (unknown place: in Philadelphia records I found not the marriage record) at Margaret V ( surname: Murphy ???born abt 1895/6- New Jersey; father birthplace: New Jersey; mother birthplace: New Jersey):

-in 1920 resident in Philadelphia: George N Brody plumber profession; married at Margaret V; with Anna or Ellen or Elano ( or similar spell-no much readable on the census) Murphy, 16 old, sister in law living in the family born in Delaware( father birthplace: Maryland; mother birthplace: Delaware.... as was this girl the sister in law is a mystery, or maybe it is the sister in law of other family inhabithant whit GNB ); no children.. ; in same house address: 32 N Frazier St, Philadelphia, PA USA, it was living also: Charles Scherff ( of Germany heritage) and Maude wife

-in 1930 San Francisco: George Brody ( is listed not as GNB but only as GB, but is the same of 1920 Phila census) resident with Margaret V wife in 2375 20th ave, San Francisco, CA (in same area of all records); father: unknown birthplace; mother born in Germany; profession: merchant; no children.. house owner address: 2375 20th ave; so from 1928 until 1933 THIS GB no changed house because he was owner...

after 1933 year, start for this GB the house changements, and seeming to me, that he divorced or in any case no living with wife, because all other records mentioning not Margaret V Brody.

So by property house act of 2375 20th ave San Francisco ( value 7000$)maybe it will be possible to know more abt this George N Brody... I believe he buy in the 1927/8...

Obviously ,this Margaret V Brody is not MK;

but in this part of San Francisco, in this area, personally, I think that is impossible so much GB peoples, so I believe that the merchant and the plumber are same man, as a well the machinist in the 1944 directory...
in fact in 1920 GNB was plumber -ship yard in Phila; moved in SF and again making plumber profession; changed in merchant and so is listed until 1940, when by records appearing 2 GB, both merchants, both democratics, but they are only 1 man, the same man, because the directory date is different, if I'm not in error:

-1940 SF George Brody, 831 Fulton – Merchant, Dem-to and including in 18 July 1940
-1940 SF George Brody,1651 Market st-merchant-Dem -to and including 26 September 1940

in 1944 he is machinist profession....

after 1944, we know by this forum:

1945-46: George Brody, 480 Ellis
(Brody not in 1948-49 Directory)
1951 George & Marian Brody clk. r. 1507 Cal
1953 Kukoda Margt nurse 1905 Fulton Apt. 5
(No listing for Brody in 1953)
1955-56: Brody Geo. r. 480 Ellis
1957: Margt. Kukoda, agt. for Stroll-O-Chair Display Co. h. 3009 Mission, Spt. 310
(No listing for Brody)
1958: Kukoda, Margt. M (Oriental & French Imports) r. 3019 Mission
1959: No listing for Brody, Kukoda or Mary Kay
1960: Mary E. Kay, 3141 Franklin, Apr. 4. No Kukoda, no Brody listed
1961: Mary Kay, r. 1006 Noe, Apt. 3
1962: Same listing
1963: Mary Kay, r. 1006 Noe, Apt. 3
1965: Not in directory
1966: Kay, Mary M. (widow of John) dir Beeline Fashion Home, h 1006 Noe.

no other GB seeming listed... the last in the 1955/6; after this year only MK (Margaret Kukoda/Mary Kay) .. the area is the same, so, reasonably, he was resident in same area of San Francisco, different addresses, almost from 1923.. and no listed more in the directories from 1956... appearing only MK, until 1966...

This means that between 1945 and 1950 or more, GB meet MK..


the picture by Margaret Kilroy studio, with phrase, show a GB with a nose a little different of other pictures....

the nose seeming a bit swollen as a nose that had a recent surgical operation...
also the picture made expressly for declaring all him love for MK, is a picture sure made just after courting success...

It is so for all, so falling in love was recent....
the phrase on the picture is almost of 1951 when James Jones wrote the book with same title; but I believe that GB could have copied the phrase by movie ( Fred Zinnermann)title from 1953; in any case the phrase on the picture is no a him mind's birth....

also MK had nurse license revoked, for illegal abortion's cause, after the GB meeting, and most probably because needing of more money;

from 1960 MK changing name...

the other profession that MK made after 1960, seeming no with much money profit...
GB no working, and also I believe that: as plumber, machinist or merchant he was no very able, otherwise the wife Margaret V no let it...

I cannot find the WWI draft registration card as a well the WWII abt a:

George N Brody, or George Newton Brody, or only George Brody born in Ohio in the 1890 circa.... maybe someone can help; it will be interesting to know the birthdate of this man... if someone already found it, please to say us...

Thanks a lot,
raf
 
Didn't Annasmom find something in the BFH that said George's middle name began with an L?
 
Didn't Annasmom find something in the BFH that said George's middle name began with an L?
I found that initial under some adhesive tape blocking out Brody's name and Otis Hotel address on an old envelope, but don't know how much we can depend on that...however, when looking for the various George Brodys, we need to refer back to Doogie's post #232 on this thread. As we have seen, there seem to be hundreds of George Brodys in the world.
 
Yes Annasmom, it are so many GB in the world, but I believe that in San Francisco, in the interest years was only a GB; as I already said, this man appear as GNB and GB only from 1920 census in Philadelpia and after in San Francisco... nothing before, as him life, well it seems starting from 1920....

I made today a very deep search and he don't appearing in nobody other censuses( no in 1900 and not in 1910); no in WWI and WWII draft registration cards also.... so I believe that GB or GNB really could be a alias...

the last hope is to find the property act of him house to 2375 20th Ave adddress... best regards, raf
 
Raf, you have spent a lot of time gathering all this information on GB. Could either of the GB's listed be the George Brody from Michigan who was a judge?
 
Raf, you have spent a lot of time gathering all this information on GB. Could either of the GB's listed be the George Brody from Michigan who was a judge?
Hi SherlockJR, I believe of not, because as Annasmom saying ( if I remember well), he had a culture and a language .. as old vittorian.. and as a people that read the books by himself ... but, also, since he no knew the right pronounce of a name, and I believe, frankly, this is impossible for a judge....

I'm searching.. and I'm pretty sure that all GB addresses in SF are abt same person... and I believe that he could be our guy.... obviously are only suppositions, but it is very probable.... as I'm pretty sure that the 1920 Pennsylvania census is right....

I believe that is better have not trust in the GB declarations... because they are lies....sure, as him philosophy ... a crazy philosophy of a crazy mind...

From what I understood of this person, he was no very able in astrology, as a well in the tarots or similar thing...
maybe in numerology... but just by itself.... I believe he read so much books on this argument and studied by itself....
if the our bad guy GB is GNB ( just for make a difference abt the initials) I believe that him business was no with much profit... as a peole that instead of to work, it spent him life following the numerology.... the numerology devasted him mind... I believe that he made this bad bad action to Annasmom for jealousy and envy... and it destroyed a family's love... especially, jealousy abt the little Anna... I believe he never had a child in the life...

also I believe that was not a Leo, because Leo is between the winner signs (or marks..? oh my bad english!:mad: ) in the zodiac... instead he seeming to me a flop ...

I spent many hours also today searching WWI draft registration card abt this GNB... nothing.. no in Ohio .. no in Pennsylvania ...no in any states... what I think that GNB declared just only a thing: Germany mother birthplace... maybe he really born in Ohio, it are so much Brody.... but I cannot find it..

Descovering who was George Brody meaning to know better what he made to little Anna.... If I understood well, when JF sent the letter, GW no open it, no read it... but he saying abt Tot death.... Seeming as a phrase, only for who was earing in other hotel's room: JF.
I believe Anna no died...

Also abt the dreams... After the first dreams, seeming that Annasmom no dreamed more Anna.... this happen when a living people forgets the other... and this it could mean that she is living... otherwise, if really Tot died, Annasmom dreaming many other times Anna....
because this other life's dimension is different from our... it is a bit long of to explain, but it is so...
For this I believe that Anna is living...

but where is Anna?

God know it... and we must have feith that he can help us, using us...
Best regards, raf
 
I believe that is better have not trust in the GB declarations... because they are lies....sure, as him philosophy ... a crazy philosophy of a crazy mind...
From what I understood of this person, he was no very able in astrology, as a well in the tarots or similar thing...
maybe in numerology... but just by itself.... I believe he read so much books on this argument and studied by itself....
if the our bad guy GB is GNB ( just for make a difference abt the initials) I believe that him business was no with much profit... as a peole that instead of to work, it spent him life following the numerology.... the numerology devasted him mind... I believe that he made this bad bad action to Annasmom for jealousy and envy... and it destroyed a family's love... especially, jealousy abt the little Anna... I believe he never had a child in the life...

also I believe that was not a Leo, because Leo is between the winner signs (or marks..? oh my bad english!:mad: ) in the zodiac... instead he seeming to me a flop ...

I spent many hours also today searching WWI draft registration card abt this GNB... nothing.. no in Ohio .. no in Pennsylvania ...no in any states... what I think that GNB declared just only a thing: Germany mother birthplace... maybe he really born in Ohio, it are so much Brody.... but I cannot find it..

Descovering who was George Brody meaning to know better what he made to little Anna.... If I understood well, when JF sent the letter, GW no open it, no read it... but he saying abt Tot death.... Seeming as a phrase, only for who was earing in other hotel's room: JF.
I believe Anna no died...


Also abt the dreams... After the first dreams, seeming that Annasmom no dreamed more Anna.... this happen when a living people forgets the other... and this it could mean that she is living... otherwise, if really Tot died, Annasmom dreaming many other times Anna....
because this other life's dimension is different from our... it is a bit long of to explain, but it is so...
For this I believe that Anna is living...

but where is Anna?

God know it... and we must have feith that he can help us, using us...
Best regards, raf

Raf, I am very moved by the time and effort and thought you have put into the search for Anna. Much of what you say makes sense to me. I do think the Georges had some idea that someone was listening to them. I do think Brody's so-called occult knowledge was based on things he had read. About the dreams, however, I have had thousands of dreams of Anna. I mentioned only the most vivid ones to KivaSupporter. I think many dreams are wish-fulfillment, or trying to make sense of things, but sometimes they seem to be messages of some sort, whether from another sphere or from our own unconscious, I do not know.

Please do not apologize for your English. It is very easy to understand your meaning. Besides, you should hear my Italian! All I can say is piano, forte, presto, adagio, things like that!
 
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