WI WI - Evelyn Hartley, 15, La Crosse, 24 Oct 1953

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PGHJW said:
I'd love to know where the transcript of the recording actually came from. I know where to find it, I've read it. It just doesn't make a whole lot of sense, even looking past the redactions.

Came across a podcast called Casefile. Episode 224 is the Hartley case. I only listened to the portion regarding the recording. Bits and pieces of info that I'd never read anywhere, but nothing groundbreaking. The most interesting is that an author visited Dorien "Whitey" Barclay, the man questioning "Tywee" in the recording, at the assisted living home. Barclay was said to have been fairly far gone at that point but acted oddly at the mention of the name Evelyn Hartley. Barclay died in 2007 and his obituary is still online. He may not have participated in the event, but he's certainly guilty of not disclosing info back then...
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Are you talking about the transcript in post #718 on this thread or a different one?

Some locations and names were eliminated from this transcript at the request of La Crosse police.

Whitey Barclay : That's about the time. about the time you hauled that Hartley girl down there (unintelligible) [owner of house deleted] That right?
Clyde Tywee Peterson : I's up on that deal.
Whitey Barclay: Huh?
Clyde Tywee Peterson: I's up on that deal.
Whitey Barclay: You was up or down? What everything else [location deleted].
{Unintelligible}
Clyde Tywee Peterson: Up, up, up.
Whitey Barclay : What do you mean, up? ---(deleted)---- why not? Why not?
Clyde Tywee Peterson: .. dig up graves and everything else [location deleted].
Whitey Barclay: but the thing is, you hauled her from La Crosse down to --( house location deleted)----and back to La Crosse. huh?
Clyde Tywee Peterson: no.
Whitey Barclay: You didn't haul her back every time?
Clyde Tywee Peterson: no.
Whitey Barclay: You did haul her up there, though?
Clyde Tywee Peterson: .. no witness.. no proof. they haven't found her, have they?
Whitey Barclay: I don't give a sh-- (deleted)----about proof.
Unidentified Woman #1: What girl?
Whitey Barclay: The Hartley girl.
Unidentified Woman #1: What Hartley girl?
Whitey Barclay: Yeah, well this is the Hartley girl that disappeared in La Crosse, and he hauled her to---( location deleted)---and she disappeared.
Whitey Barclay: He {unintelligible}. You know damn right he all done it and I know it, and he told me with his own mouth.
Unidentified Woman: From La Crosse?
Whitey Barclay: Yeah. That's the girl they never did solve the mystery on, see.
Whitey Barclay : I'll tell you another thing that's ridiculous, (unintelligible) won't tell him Jack Gaulthair he went crazy and shot himself.
Whitey Barclay : Yeah. yeah.
Whitey Barclay: He knows about it, too. ---( name deleted)---- knows about it, and you know ---(deleted)---- is scared to death of his kids because he's afraid he's goin' to kill {unintelligible}, and I think ---( deleted)---- knows about it, too.
Whitey Barclay: I'll be damned.
Whitey Barclay: I think, I think she's buried down there, too. and old --( deleted)----is just scared of his kids! ---( name deleted)---- was the biggest man there was. Why is he scared of his kids?..... 'cause he knew where she's buried, didn't he? You think I'm right or wrong? I, I can read between the lines Tywee.. and, and, shut it off, shut it off. ~End of transcript~
 
Quoththeraven said:
Are you talking about the transcript in post #718 on this thread or a different one?

Some locations and names were eliminated from this transcript at the request of La Crosse police.

Whitey Barclay : That's about the time. about the time you hauled that Hartley girl down there (unintelligible) [owner of house deleted] That right?
Clyde Tywee Peterson : I's up on that deal.
Whitey Barclay: Huh?
Clyde Tywee Peterson: I's up on that deal.
Whitey Barclay: You was up or down? What everything else [location deleted].
{Unintelligible}
Clyde Tywee Peterson: Up, up, up.
Whitey Barclay : What do you mean, up? ---(deleted)---- why not? Why not?
Clyde Tywee Peterson: .. dig up graves and everything else [location deleted].
Whitey Barclay: but the thing is, you hauled her from La Crosse down to --( house location deleted)----and back to La Crosse. huh?
Clyde Tywee Peterson: no.
Whitey Barclay: You didn't haul her back every time?
Clyde Tywee Peterson: no.
Whitey Barclay: You did haul her up there, though?
Clyde Tywee Peterson: .. no witness.. no proof. they haven't found her, have they?
Whitey Barclay: I don't give a sh-- (deleted)----about proof.
Unidentified Woman #1: What girl?
Whitey Barclay: The Hartley girl.
Unidentified Woman #1: What Hartley girl?
Whitey Barclay: Yeah, well this is the Hartley girl that disappeared in La Crosse, and he hauled her to---( location deleted)---and she disappeared.
Whitey Barclay: He {unintelligible}. You know damn right he all done it and I know it, and he told me with his own mouth.
Unidentified Woman: From La Crosse?
Whitey Barclay: Yeah. That's the girl they never did solve the mystery on, see.
Whitey Barclay : I'll tell you another thing that's ridiculous, (unintelligible) won't tell him Jack Gaulthair he went crazy and shot himself.
Whitey Barclay : Yeah. yeah.
Whitey Barclay: He knows about it, too. ---( name deleted)---- knows about it, and you know ---(deleted)---- is scared to death of his kids because he's afraid he's goin' to kill {unintelligible}, and I think ---( deleted)---- knows about it, too.
Whitey Barclay: I'll be damned.
Whitey Barclay: I think, I think she's buried down there, too. and old --( deleted)----is just scared of his kids! ---( name deleted)---- was the biggest man there was. Why is he scared of his kids?..... 'cause he knew where she's buried, didn't he? You think I'm right or wrong? I, I can read between the lines Tywee.. and, and, shut it off, shut it off. ~End of transcript~
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That's the one. To me it just doesn't read out at all like the articles from the time it was discovered made it out to. Maybe it would be different to actually hear it. I can't tell in what way Barclay is talking. Is he aghast? Is he virtually celebrating it? It's very hard to tell. And Tywee barely says a word.
 
PGHJW said:
That's the one. To me it just doesn't read out at all like the articles from the time it was discovered made it out to. Maybe it would be different to actually hear it. I can't tell in what way Barclay is talking. Is he aghast? Is he virtually celebrating it? It's very hard to tell. And Tywee barely says a word.
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I understood that both Gaulthair and Peterson had discussed the case with Barclay in the past. I'd like to listen to the whole CD because there's obviously more to this conversation that was left out including the redactions by the La Crosse police. I hope the full conversation is released one day because it appears the La Crosse police are doing nothing to further this case.

I believe the transcript of that taped conversation was in Susan T. Hessel's book about Evelyn Hartley and mentioned in the article below from the Journal Gazette Mattoon, Illinois · Saturday, May 22, 2004. The bartender taped the conversation and Whitey Barclay was aware he was being taped because in the end he told Mel Williams, the bartender, to shut off the tape recorder. According to the taped confession, Clyde Tywee Peterson, Jack Gaulthair and an unidentified mutual friend kidnapped Evelyn and took her to the unidentified mutual friend's farm. IMO, the unidentified mutual friend may have been Marion Driscoll, also of La Farge, who, along with Jack Gaulthair (not Gaultphair), abducted another 15 year old girl, took her to a bar and then up to a bedroom (see news article) The casetext link below also states what happened in that case.

State v. Driscoll, 263 Wis. 230 | Casetext Search + Citator

Read State v. Driscoll, 263 Wis. 230, see flags on bad law, and search Casetext’s comprehensive legal database
casetext.com

Journal_Gazette_2004_05_22_Page_7 (1).jpg
Article from the The Sheboygan Press
Sheboygan, Wisconsin · Wednesday, February 04, 1953

driscoll gaulthair.jpg
 
evelyn_grace_hartley_1.jpg
evelyn_grace_hartley_2.jpg

Evelyn Grace Hartley, 15​

Missing since 24 October 1953 from La Crosse, Wisconsin​

LINK:

crimeblogger1983.blogspot.com

The Kidnapping and Murder of: Evelyn Grace Hartley

I am an Investigative Blogger who mainly covers disappearances but I do cover true crime in general.
crimeblogger1983.blogspot.com crimeblogger1983.blogspot.com
 
Some accounts mention that a witness saw two men with a girl who looked like Evelyn in a 1941 Buick. Here are some photos of that year and make car:



This pre World War II automobile was used as an Army staff car painted in Olive Drab color. Such cars were featured in movies "Saving Private Ryan" and "Pearl Harbor".

 
SkyBoomer said:
I know! And V. Mortenson is a wonderful actor!
Click to expand...
And Viggo Rasmussen (father whose children Evelyn was babysitting) was also probably a good professor. Imagine how traumatic it would be for a young couple to have their babysitter murdered while they were at the college football game.

It's behind a paywall. As much as I'd like to subscribe to the LaCrosse Tribune, I wouldn't read it enough to make it worthwhile.

lacrossetribune.com

Rozalyn Rasmusen recalls childhood terror on 64th anniversary of Evelyn Hartley's disappearance

Rozalyn (Rasmusen) Lina was 7 years old when she saw her father cry for the first time.
lacrossetribune.com lacrossetribune.com

Here's a link at Newspapers.com

Private Article Clipping

The largest online newspaper archive, established in 2012. Used by millions every month for genealogy and family history, historical research, crime investigations, journalism, and entertainment. Search for obituaries, marriage announcements, birth announcements, social pages, national and local...
www.newspapers.com www.newspapers.com

The article says Mr. Rasmusen sold the house immediately and relocated to a different house in town. There he installed bars on the windows. Poor family. The older daughter, Lina said her dad, Viggo, had a nervous breakdown. He became paranoid about his wife and children, always asking they check in with him to make sure they were safe. Lina married and moved to California in the late 60's, but her parents stayed in LaCrosse until they passed many years later.
 
Evenlyn Harley is still missing since October 24th, 1953. Photos from the house currently. I spoke with the owner a few months ago. This is the window that she was presumably taken out of. We both concluded that the metal window well / frame wasn't there in 1953. There'd be no way that Evenlyn, let alone two men (who we can assume were bigger than her), could fit through there as it stands today. The basement window pictured is on the right side of the house. The siding and garage were added on years after the incident, of course

IMG_8505.JPGIMG_8507.JPG
 
bigals said:
Evenlyn Harley is still missing since October 24th, 1953. Photos from the house currently. I spoke with the owner a few months ago. This is the window that she was presumably taken out of. We both concluded that the metal window well / frame wasn't there in 1953. There'd be no way that Evenlyn, let alone two men (who we can assume were bigger than her), could fit through there as it stands today. The basement window pictured is on the right side of the house. The siding and garage were added on years after the incident, of course

View attachment 486058View attachment 486059
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Wow! I had no idea the window was so small! Even without the metal thing I have a hard time believing anyone would for through? In real life does it look like she would have fitted through?
 
Ciriii57 said:
Wow! I had no idea the window was so small! Even without the metal thing I have a hard time believing anyone would for through? In real life does it look like she would have fitted through?
Click to expand...

Yeah it is super small! And no, I don't think anyone apart from a small child could fit through there. However, it was a newly built house and I guess there wasn't even grass there at that time. So, I would guess that the dirt/lawn/yard was much "lower" than it is now... so it might've been much larger than it is now (the window)
 
bigals said:
Yeah it is super small! And no, I don't think anyone apart from a small child could fit through there. However, it was a newly built house and I guess there wasn't even grass there at that time. So, I would guess that the dirt/lawn/yard was much "lower" than it is now... so it might've been much larger than it is now (the window)
Click to expand...
That's true, although the window frame was still in the same place and that can be seen in your photo. I'm not sure anyone fit through this window now.

And yet apparently Evelyn's father entered the house this way! I'm not sure I wouldn't get stuck.

Maybe the outside cladding didn't reach as low down back then?
 
Ciriii57 said:
That's true, although the window frame was still in the same place and that can be seen in your photo. I'm not sure anyone fit through this window now.

And yet apparently Evelyn's father entered the house this way! I'm not sure I wouldn't get stuck.

Maybe the outside cladding didn't reach as low down back then?
Click to expand...
That's a good thought too... I actually looked from the inside so I could have seen how tall the window could've actually been but didn't get a picture and didn't think to check for that.

And yeah, for sure nobody could fit through there now! The metal could not have been there, and I bet you're right, the window was larger in some other way at the time of the crime. Just crazy
 
I mean im definitely not questioning it, obviously no one at the time believed it was impossible it just shocked me because I had always imagined it as a bigger window, especially with it having a screen lol
 
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