Found Alive WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *Arrest* #38

[MesquiteO21]

I don't think that anyone is suggesting that they should have investigated that car on the way to the crime scene. If it was noticeable enough that the responding officer puts it IN THE CRIMINAL COMPLAINT that he seen a maroon Taurus then why was that not made public 3 months ago? THAT ONE TIP that they drained into our heads for three months could have come much, much sooner. Who knows what horrors that man did to her that could have possibly been stopped so much sooner. Thank God Jayme was able to save herself.

it does seem odd. vehicles of interest were that black suv and orange whatever, or something, i forget exactly what they were. but if they had mentioned a maroon taurus maybe that paired with JTP shaving his head would've made someone stop to think twice and call it in as a tip, who knows. and i know hindsight is 20/20 and they probably didn't want to put it out there if they weren't sure how important it was. but like you said, it was enough for the officer to put it in the complaint. And we know now that LE did put out two unrelated vehicles so they apparently had some weak basis for thinking those cars were important, yet ignoring the car that WAS important.

and i really don't mean to criticize or seem like i'm blaming LE - JTP is the sole person with culpability here - but it's worth going over maybe what LE could've done differently for future cases.

 

[Sjm_qc]

Yes he seems very intentional about the great lengths he went to to avoid being connected to the crime, but then confesses in almost his first breath of encountering LE after the escape...definitely a disconnect there! It does seem like maybe he was trying to script his own episode of Criminal Minds.

I think it’s @MassGuy & some others who have pointed out that there appears to have been a lot of planning going up to & including the murders & abduction, but little (as far as we know so far) forethought as to “what happens/happened” next. I.e. keeping an unwilling JC captive.

I’d speculate that the latter part is where his imagination of his fantasy scenario/life coupled with putative lack of social skills let him down.

He seems to have run the “what if” risk assessments upto & including capturing & securing JC, but I’m going to guess he didn’t think much further than that. Or his fantasy scenario aftermath didn’t play out.

 

[SeekingJana]

It's all good.

 

[Deleted member 158085]

Good Morning All:

@JerseyGirl indicated she would set up an Incel thread for us. I'm not sure when - we know our Mods can be swamped - but hopefully today.

Mod came in and said no. She said those interested could start a private conversation, which can include up to 20 people.

 

[girlhasnoname]

The brown jacket? Shaved head? Saying he was police, open up as you suggest.

This is from the Complaint itself:

The defendant stated he believed James had a flashlight and was shining it outside. The defendant stated he hollered for James to get on the ground, but James kept shining the flashlight and looking outside. The defendant stated he then approached the front steps and opened the glass storm door. The defendant stated he then pounded on the wooden entry door. The defendant stated he saw James looking outside through the small glass (decorative glass with wrought iron design in the center of the wooden entry door) window. The defendant stated James made some comment like, show me your badge, and assumed James thought he was the police. The defendant stated he then raised the shotgun and purposely aimed at James’ head and pulled the trigger. The defendant stated he knew James immediately collapsed to the ground.

Tell me this doesn't scare the bejesus out of you?

 

[BradB]

Contrary to what you may believe there is absolutely nothing to predict future behavior. Nothing. All the books, knowledge, systems, profiling does not help. Vegas shooter had minor run ins with the law. Many shooters have no background or minor run ins with the law.

We only can gather why. Motivation. But it still won’t prevent future crimes.

 

[MesquiteO21]

just FYI...reposting because my previous post mentioning that JTP would've opened fire if the responding officers had stopped him was deleted since i didn't source the article-

Police sped past only one car on their way to Jayme Closs's home. She was in the trunk. - CNN

near the bottom:

"He said he had driven "what he thought to be 20 seconds from the house" when he yielded to three passing squad cars traveling toward the Closs home with their emergency lights and sirens on.
If there had been an encounter with police, it likely would have been violent. Patterson told investigators that if he had been stopped by police on his way from the Closs home, he "most likely would have shot at the police" with the loaded shotgun he had in the front seat."

 

[girlhasnoname]

I apologize if I offended by asking. So many have called JP a psychopath or sociopath. Is it ok ask why? My post had nothing to do with analyzing JP but rather why he was given these labels.

No worries, you did not offend me, I took your post as a genuine interest in understanding why so many have speculated about JP. There is nothing wrong with asking, but I deleted my post because it seemed to be upsetting to some.

 

[Deleted member 158085]

Contrary to what you may believe there is absolutely nothing to predict future behavior. Nothing. All the books, knowledge, systems, profiling does not help. Vegas shooter had minor run ins with the law. Many shooters have no background or minor run ins with the law.

We only can gather why. Motivation. But it still won’t prevent future crimes.

Evidence? Studies that say such? Please share.

 

[bellyup]

Contrary to what you may believe there is absolutely nothing to predict future behavior. Nothing. All the books, knowledge, systems, profiling does not help. Vegas shooter had minor run ins with the law. Many shooters have no background or minor run ins with the law.

We only can gather why. Motivation. But it still won’t prevent future crimes.

Can you provide information to support that past behavior has no implications on future behavior? Just about every study I've ever seen on serial killers, mass murderers, pedophililes, etc. contradict your claim that there is "absolutely nothing" that can predict future behavior.

I'd be interested in seeing scholarly articles that state otherwise.

 

[Rosiebones]

The very nature of the personality development of person like JP is the bits and pieces that are not significant when they are seen in isolation as a school child or teen or young adult. Each of these behaviors then are collected and noted AFTER a significant event (this crime) We all say AHA after we have the time to pull all these characteristics together into what we think is a sociopath. We have no reason to label a person who struggles socially with many of these characteristics if he doesn't do something terrible, why would we. I doubt the ex-boyfriend of his sister who mentioned his lack of interaction immediately thought "that guy is a sociopath" he just thought he was unfriendly. Or an uncle who learned he had left basic training thought he would commit a crime. He is an anomaly.

 

[crhedBngr]

Mod came in and said no. She said those interested could start a private conversation, which can include up to 20 people.

Okay, got it. Thanks for letting me know.

 

[girlhasnoname]

I DELETED MY POST. You may have grabbed it because you can, but it is wrong to say things against me about this topic because I retracted my statement, changed my thoughts and deleted them almost immediately after posting them.
Also, I have many years' experience to back up a broad based Personality Disorder mentioned in my past posts. However, after seeing this today, I will not ever say anything that can be used against me like this do it again on WS.

Please delete your post.I would if it was you who thought better of their post and deleted it.

I just read your post and deleted my response to your post as you asked.

 

[MassGuy]

Contrary to what you may believe there is absolutely nothing to predict future behavior. Nothing. All the books, knowledge, systems, profiling does not help. Vegas shooter had minor run ins with the law. Many shooters have no background or minor run ins with the law.

We only can gather why. Motivation. But it still won’t prevent future crimes.

False. There’s actually a saying: “The best predictor of future behavior is past behavior.”

No you can’t stop every event, or literally see into the future, but there are things that can be done to stop certain criminals in their tracks.

A level 3 sex offender is released from prison.

Why is he a “level 3?” Because his past behavior indicates his risk level to reoffend.

What you do in the past, you more likely to do in the future.

 

[BradB]

In my opinion, there is nothing to predict future behavior. It’s as simple as people will do whatever they want to do. It doesn’t even have to do with violence and this specific case. Sometimes people act on impulse. One minute you’re happily married the next you’re not. You can only find out why but you can’t predict future behavior. You just can’t.

 

[tnith]

From Complaint / Confession:

"J.L.C. stated Patterson broke down the bathroom door and told her mother to hang up the phone. J.L.C. stated Patterson told her mother to put tape over J.L.C.’s mouth, which her mother did, and then Patterson shot her mother."
"The defendant stated he pulled out a flattened partial roll of black colored Gorilla brand duct tape, handed it to Denise, and told her to place the tape over J.L.C.’s mouth. The defendant stated Denise was struggling to do that and he set the shotgun down on the bathroom sink. The defendant stated he took the tape from Denise and wrapped tape around J.L.C.’s mouth, and completely around her head."

I have a tendency to believe JP's version but have no trouble understanding why Jayme might have been unaware of certain details. She had to have been in severe shock at that point in time, imo.
http://media.graytvinc.com/documents/Jake+Patterson+Criminal+Complaint.pdf

BBM

JTP's account of his own actions, depicting himself as so threatening he could set down the weapon he'd just used to murder only moments before.

The weapon he selected and carefully prepared ammo for, because he intended to slaughter a household and 'didn't want to take any chances'.

This is from the Complaint itself:

The defendant stated he believed James had a flashlight and was shining it outside. The defendant stated he hollered for James to get on the ground, but James kept shining the flashlight and looking outside. The defendant stated he then approached the front steps and opened the glass storm door. The defendant stated he then pounded on the wooden entry door. The defendant stated he saw James looking outside through the small glass (decorative glass with wrought iron design in the center of the wooden entry door) window. The defendant stated James made some comment like, show me your badge, and assumed James thought he was the police. The defendant stated he then raised the shotgun and purposely aimed at James’ head and pulled the trigger. The defendant stated he knew James immediately collapsed to the ground.

Tell me this doesn't scare the bejesus out of you?

Another account in which JTP credits himself as impressing 'authority' on an intended victim.

Of course, everyone has their own ideas and questions about the veracity of a grown guy. Why wouldn't we trust him, after all police even postulated Jayme was freely able to 'choose' to 'come home'.

And just like the fruitless goose chase in which we attempt to divine the method from the madness over vehicles, I'm more than happy to chalk it all up to LE crafting a complex trap for their perp to fall into.

It was never about us or what we think.

 

[Gumbeaux]

@human I absolutely agree. Their approach is paving the way for her to re-enter life in this small town. They are removing the mystique and not allowing "stories" to take root that might otherwise if she were to be kept shrouded in mystery. I grew up in a small town and I think what they are doing is probably a good thing. Hopefully it will take the curiosity down a bit.

Thank you for your thoughts on this! I have been appalled at the numerous photos of Jayme, and while I still believe they are going too far — you raise excellent points. Small town life is different, and some of their sharing maintains the “every girl” aspect for Jayme.

There are no rules for some life situations, and we must navigate according to the winds.

 

[StarEyes]

They can make noise when you dial. It depends on your settings. Everyone should disable the option for sound when dialing or typing. I had to tell my sister to do this.

You’d likely be able to hear the 911 operator talking, I would think. My iPhone has a 911 feature where you click one of the volume buttons a few times quickly and it gives you an emergency prompt. Idk if it dials immediately, but it may.

 

[Myrtlesandroses]

Lurker unlurking briefly just to say, thank God Jayme listened to her instincts and escaped when she did (see Kare11 article linked below).

Based on what we do know, I don’t think my heart can handle what has yet to be revealed.

Patterson applied for job the day before Jayme Closs escape

 

[heed101]

In my opinion, there is nothing to predict future behavior. It’s as simple as people will do whatever they want to do. It doesn’t even have to do with violence and this specific case. Sometimes people act on impulse. One minute you’re happily married the next you’re not. You can only find out why but you can’t predict future behavior. You just can’t.

Watch "Evil Lives Here" Investigation Discovery ... "there were signs"