AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #19

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daisy6441 said:
They could have life insurance through their jobs. With Jayme gone there is no one to pay it out to. Jennie-O probably paid as a gesture of kindness.
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They could. But even if Jayme was the sole beneficiary she would not be able to collect life insurance money at her age. They would have had to have set up a trust account and appointed a guardian for Jayme who would manage her money until she turned 18 or 21 (laws vary by state). If they had a will and arrangements like this they would also have had someone named in case the entire family died (including Jayme). People with legal wills write up all those contingency plans.

It's only my opinion they may not have had one because the majority of people I know who are blue collar workers do not have wills and trust accounts set up in the event of their untimely deaths. My grandparents have all passed away and they had wills and trust accounts set up which is how I know a little about it, but from talking to my friends I believe that it is not the norm. I recently attended a funeral of a family member of a friend of mine and he had left no will. My friend was both devastated at his loss and surprised he had no will and she was trying to figure out the probate process, which varies by state. Here is some info about Wisconsin probate law:
Wisconsin Probate and Estate Tax Laws - FindLaw
 
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kkdj said:
I want to stay open minded about the possibilities. I originally thought this had something to do with someone obsessed with Jayme. I want to allow other ideas to be considered. I am not (at least not yet) leaning towards meth heads because why take Jayme? So, I'm thinking someone obsessed with Jayme, professional hit, someone involved with LE or ex military, maybe political. If the point was to murder the parents and not from an emotional position, then bringing Jayme to someone might fit. Maybe kind of getting out there, but we don't have much info to go on.
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True, we dont. And because of just that, it leaves a lot of possibilities open. This family, no matter how quiet or even outgoing, was very low profile. I feel if it was something of this nature, it was a misunderstanding or goes deeper than what we would be allowed to discuss here, or that we would probably even find. I have seen nothing yet that I could bring for dicussion, even if it was allowed.
 
daisy6441 said:
Even a private plane should require the same passenger information as flying a commercial airline.
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Yeah. A guy who commits a brazen home invasion type crime like we have here, isn’t the type of guy to have a plan in place that involves the use of an airplane.

We just don’t see planes used in crimes like these, especially nowadays, where they type of thing is far more regulated than in the past.
 
rainynights said:
Yes, seems JS was referring to mail being delivered to their home in error. Here's the CNN.com - Transcripts from AB's show:

BANFIELD: Can I ask you about the Closs family? I mean, this is just such a horror that is been visited on them. I think most people are wondering, what were they like?

SMREKAR: You didn`t see them out in the yard doing anything. At least we didn't.
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Snipped to respond to this statement.
Denise reportedly had a love for gardening and flowers by her own father.
This woman may not be a reliable "witness".

"Denise Closs, 46, grew up in nearby Cornell. She taught religious education classes at several Catholic churches in the area. Loved ones remembered her as a gentle soul who grew flowers, fed birds and helped everyone, any way she could."
Hundreds turn out to remember parents of missing Wisconsin teen Jayme Closs
 
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One thing about "hits". They aren't always carried out by "professionals".

I was in a military school in another state, at least a day's drive away. One of the students in the class - from the same general area as me - got the news the last day of class that his house burned down and his wife died in the fire. Months later we read that (1) he was separated from his wife and (2) she didn't die in the fire, but was dead when the fire started, strangled to death. The officer had an alibi as he was in class with us. Several months after that a senior enlisted man was arrested for murder. He worked for the officer and took the 'contract' for the officer for a $10K portion of the life insurance proceeds. They were both convicted of her murder.

Drug users have been known to take "contracts" and others in need of money. A police officer once told me that if you have the money and the right connection you can get a hit on someone for as little as $5K or even less. But these aren't hit men in the sense that they do it for a living.
 
Does any remember that case where the older man was killed in his home- his son and daughter in law showed up to bring him a pie and they were held hostage for a bit and the suspects took their license and wallets, belongings etc. The son was accused at first of killing his father and finally suspects girlfriend came forward and admitted she knew about it that her boyfriend killed the man for his gun collection?!! Suspect ended up being the son or grandson of a man that the victim was friends with! It was one of the craziest crime stories I have heard and how it all came full circle was crazy!

This case reminds me of this somehow... lol that’s my point!
 
GordianKnot said:
SABBMFF from Whiskers' (Superb!) Case Details Summary:
  • Ongoing Investigation
    • The FBI and National Center for Missing and Exploited Children are assisting in the investigation. Fitzgerald says the FBI technicians are specialized in missing children. [5]
    • Deputies searched the area around the family's home with drones and infrared equipment, but they didn't find any clues as to her whereabouts [9]
    • Officers also were at Jayme's middle school talking with her friends and acquaintances, hoping to develop some leads [9]
    • Authorities just told volunteers that this is a 14 mile long crime scene. From city of Barron all the way to Turtle Lake. [11]
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Made red by me...
- I really hope the FBI guys they brought in have experience in homicide, not just missing kids!!
- The crime scene was 14 miles long? What the heck? What made them think that?? Now I"m leaning towards someone came home with James from the casino and he parked fast, ran to the house and tried to lock the door behind him when someone came up and opened fire.
- I'd sure like to know what he was wearing if anything on his feet? Somehow now I'm not picturing him answering the door to a knock in the night.
- One of the first places LE contacted was the casino. What made them do that? Could someone have been in casino uniform (James maybe?)... What made them decide the crime scene was 14 miles long? That is pretty large, and specific!
 
JnRyan said:
You've got to be kidding! That is truly a bizarre theory!

Then, this is a bizarre case. I'll add it to my list of scenarios.
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I don’t see it as all that bizarre, moo. The only thing that wouldnt maybe fit is taking Jayme. Who knows why someone might have wanted them dead, and after watching a two hour Dateline on hit men for hire on the dark web, one would be surprised how many people actually inquire about these services! $5K on up, sometimes even less.
 
daisy6441 said:
@Gardener1850 Jennie-O in Barron has two openings for a shift worker and a "supply person" (machine operator). Only other openings I can see are for interns. Could these be James and Denise's jobs?

"Excellent pay and benefit package including health, dental, vision, life & disability insurance, vacation, holidays, flexible spending accounts, retirement savings plan with 401K match, continuing education, and much more."

Sounds like the benefits were pretty good. And it says life insurance.
Since the next of kin is gone any money they had is even more tied up than normal. The rest of the family might not have been able to pay and they would definitely have a hard time becoming executor to get the funds James and Denise had in their bank account or insurance.
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I saw a direct quote about what dad did at the plant.
I'll get the link.

Jim was all about sports,” she said. “He was a big Packer fan. Just a normal guy — go to work, go home.” James Closs worked in the plant area that deboned turkeys, and he delivered meat orders that Ruffin would weigh for shipping.

Hundreds turn out to remember parents of missing Wisconsin teen Jayme Closs
 
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Gardener1850 said:
They could. But even if Jayme was the sole beneficiary she would not be able to collect life insurance money at her age. They would have had to have set up a trust account and appointed a guardian for Jayme who would manage her money until she turned 18 or 21 (laws vary by state). If they had a will and arrangements like this they would also have had someone named in case the entire family died (including Jayme). People with legal wills write up all those contingency plans.

It's only my opinion they may not have had one because the majority of people I know who are blue collar workers do not have wills and trust accounts set up in the event of their untimely deaths. My grandparents have all passed away and they had wills and trust accounts set up which is how I know a little about it, but from talking to my friends I believe that it is rare. I recently attended a funeral of a family member of a friend of mine and he had left no will. She was both devastated at his loss and surprised he had no will and she was trying to figure out the probate process, which varies by state. Here is some info about Wisconsin probate law:
Wisconsin Probate and Estate Tax Laws - FindLaw
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With no will everything should go to Jayme since she is their only living child (other relatives would then have a chance to make claims against the estate). It could be put into a trust or not. It just depends on how they set it up in probate court. Someone could petition to be her guardian and some assets could be held in trust like life insurance payouts while other could be awarded to the guardian to be used for her care. They might sell the house and use the funds for Jayme or the house might be used as a residence for her and the guardian. I worked for an attorney in Texas so it might work a little differently up there. A trust could be set up to pay a sum by month or year or as needed. All you have to do is submit a claim and the guardian of the trust determines validity. They could also set it up where nothing comes out until she reaches a certain age or condition. But with her now gone it is going to be tricky. There is a possibility she could be found so anyone laying claims as executor would have to plan for that. They might not even be able to move forward with it until it is determined if she is living or not.
 
photographer4 said:
Made red by me...
- I really hope the FBI guys they brought in have experience in homicide, not just missing kids!!
- The crime scene was 14 miles long? What the heck? What made them think that?? Now I"m leaning towards someone came home with James from the casino and he parked fast, ran to the house and tried to lock the door behind him when someone came up and opened fire.
- I'd sure like to know what he was wearing if anything on his feet? Somehow now I'm not picturing him answering the door to a knock in the night.
- One of the first places LE contacted was the casino. What made them do that? Could someone have been in casino uniform (James maybe?)... What made them decide the crime scene was 14 miles long? That is pretty large, and specific!
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They believe that the crime scene was 14 miles long simply because they believe that to have been the escape route.

The crime didn’t end in that house, as it continued in the form of a kidnapping.

The perpetrator(s) has to escape using roads, and that believe that road was likely the one that he used.

Edited to add that those FBI agents have extensive experience with kidnapping and murder.
 
daisy6441 said:
@Gardener1850 Jennie-O in Barron has two openings for a shift worker and a "supply person" (machine operator). Only other openings I can see are for interns. Could these be James and Denise's jobs?

"Excellent pay and benefit package including health, dental, vision, life & disability insurance, vacation, holidays, flexible spending accounts, retirement savings plan with 401K match, continuing education, and much more."

Sounds like the benefits were pretty good. And it says life insurance.
Since the next of kin is gone any money they had is even more tied up than normal. The rest of the family might not have been able to pay and they would definitely have a hard time becoming executor to get the funds James and Denise had in their bank account or insurance.
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When jobs in factories come open they usually are put up for bid. After all of the bidding is complete, then they fill the jobs that are left. Being that they were senior employees, their jobs were probably bid upon by other employees. This may not be the case at Jennie-O, but in all the factories that I have worked this is the case.
 
I just noticed this comment.
It has changed my line of thinking!

“It was all about Jayme, everything,” said Ruffin. “[Denise’s] world revolved around Jayme. When she was younger she had her in beauty pageants, ‘please vote on my daughter’s pictures’, you know, so that she wins the contest. She was all about Jayme.”
Funeral held for James and Denise Closs in Cameron
 
VeryVeritas said:
1) Canada, MSP, Mexico, or walking distance are all possible.
2) MO = experienced criminal or killer (military, hunter, ex cop, etc)
3) Motive. This is where my mind is focused. It would be extremely unusual that if Jayme were the motive, that a sudden forced home entry and double murder would occur. Clearly perp(s) were well prepared. To me there is something else going on here. It is possible that this was an execution. But for what? Its possible there is a psycho (BTK type) right under the nose of LE who did this just on impulse, yet they knew how to do this with skill. There is no doubt in my mind the perp(s) have killed before.
If someone wanted to abduct Jayme, there are far less brazen ways to try. If this was purely about Jayme, this scene is incredibly rare. So, I have to think there is another motivation. Money, Revenge, Drugs, Organized crime, Psycho all seem highly possible to me. It also seems that they know the area pretty well... lots of study = pro, or someone that is local or frequents the area.
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Good post! I agree on 2. I am leaning to ex-military or hunter. I keep thinking of black steel-toed boots kicking that door in. I have no idea what the motive is, but think this is a local, or from nearby.

Amateur opinion and speculation
 
gngr~snap said:
When she was younger she had her in beauty pageants
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Respectfully snipped for focus.
I imagine every sleuther who read this immediately thought of Jon-Benet.
No disrespect to those of you who have participated, or have your kids in pageants.
I hate them. A pedo's paradise. OPINION ONLY.

Amateur opinion and speculation
 
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