Would you lie in court to save your child? CLOSED FOR REVIEW

[tasylshari]

Would you lie in court to save your child?

NOPE.

I am trying very, very hard to teach my two children that if you never lie, you never have to remember anything.

If they choose to lie, I choose to let them suffer the CONSEQUENCES.

Period. The choice, and the decision is theirs. So are the consequences of these things. Period.

 

[Oakley]

I would beg and plead for my child's life, throwing myself on the mercy of the court but I would not lie to achieve that. One thing I've learned over the past 3 years in observing the Anthony's is what a slippery slope mis-truths, half-truths and out-and-out lies lead to. I don't like or trust liars. JMO.

 

[mommy24]

Not if she killed my grandchild!!! If she killed my son in law, that would be different! Just kidding!

 

[mydailyopinions]

There are no innocent victims of forced opinions on this board, everyone volunteers and every last one of us is guilty. YES, I’M TALKING TO DIRECTLY TO YOU… it doesn’t matter if you only lurk, come & go or actively post… feel passionate about a position one day and change it the next.

Between the "how could you's?!", the "you didn't love your daughter or granddaughter enough or in the proper way's", the “poor CA she just breaks my heart with how disillusioned she is from grief”, the “CA is conflicted, broken hearted, torn”....

I like consider myself a very rational person that can appreciate both sides of an argument. I’m a fixer, it’s what I do; everyone needs to be happy and well. Maybe I suffer from a bit too much of the "touchy feely 70's child Kumbaya syndrome" but I'm cool with it cause it beats the alternative. However….

I’ve also flipped the switch to absolute apathy, with very scary ease… a few times…. AND… I’ve had the rug pulled out from under my feet by people that I trusted completely – by people I should have been able to trust & by a few that I shouldn’t have trusted. One was a textbook Dark Triad that gas lighted me so well that I fought my rational head and consistently broken heart for 6 years!!! I will never have peace of mind because it just doesn’t compute on so many emotional and rational levels.

My point is there is NO RIGHT ANSWER to any of this. If you have never been completely fooled by someone, never been let down or had your heart broken repeatedly, lost someone so precious to you by the hands of someone else that also holds your heart in those same guilty hands… then I don’t think you can stand with such honest conviction for truth & justice and also be telling the truth.

I don’t think my signature has ever been more appropriate than it is today, "Life is pretty much in the grays for the most part and if you insist always on black and white... you are going to be very unhappy."

Now Imma jump off my box and go back to the bloopers, what did we learn polls and maybe even downstairs for a bit so I can get my warm and fuzzies back on…

Peace Ya’ll… and for goodness sake…. before you give yourself or someone else a stroke… play nice and laugh a little now and then! :heartbeat:

FBM

Great Post.:tyou:

 

[Solomisskitty]

I don't know and I hope I don't ever have to know. It's easy to answer a question when your not in the actual position. You find out that your only daughter gets pregnant, o.k. that happens a lot, it's not the end of world. You fall in love with this child, like she was your own. Then two and a half years later she is taken away from you, and the person who is suspected of doing it is your own flesh and blood. Working for the state for a couple of years, I've seen a lot worse, but the loss of any child is awful. I use to look at the parents and wonder, did they feel responsible, did they have a feeling that something like this would happen one day. What comes to mind is don't criticize unless you've walked in their shoes. I just hope I'm never put in that position.

Said so well I had to give more than just a thumbs up.

 

[merib]

I see a tremendous amount of dysfunction with this family, however, what family doesn't have something wrong these days. I cannot imagine how Cindy is thinking, only know she is looking at her child and already greiving for her granddaughter, I don't know how I would deal with that. I love my daughter soooo much, and I say "Praise the Lord" she would never harm one of her 3 children and I know I will never face this. I feel so badly for Cindy and I couldn't say how I would be in her shoes.

 

[Solomisskitty]

I see a tremendous amount of dysfunction with this family, however, what family doesn't have something wrong these days. I cannot imagine how Cindy is thinking, only know she is looking at her child and already greiving for her granddaughter, I don't know how I would deal with that. I love my daughter soooo much, and I say "Praise the Lord" she would never harm one of her 3 children and I know I will never face this. I feel so badly for Cindy and I couldn't say how I would be in her shoes.

Exactly. Whose family can be held up as perfection - and who is to judge what perfect is? I believe KC is guilty, and CA is not on trial for murder.
KC is, and was an adult, and is responsible for her own actions. Don't hold mommy responsible for an adult child's actions.

 

[Quiche]

I voted no, but in reading a little, I have to admit I might be overly optimistic in a penalty phase if it were a death penalty. I would exaggerate every decent attribute my child had. Definitely not in the guilt phase, however. jmo

 

[smartsass]

Hi smartsass and :welcome4:

TY! You guys are great! :great:

 

[donnam]

I admire your vehemence, here.

As for me, if lying to save my son from being put to death means I lack integrity, no character, and am immature - I couldn't care less. I would lie to save my son. Period. What this says to others about my character, or lack thereof, is of no concern to me at all.

Thank you

 

[donnam]

There are no innocent victims of forced opinions on this board, everyone volunteers and every last one of us is guilty. YES, I’M TALKING TO DIRECTLY TO YOU… it doesn’t matter if you only lurk, come & go or actively post… feel passionate about a position one day and change it the next.

Between the "how could you's?!", the "you didn't love your daughter or granddaughter enough or in the proper way's", the “poor CA she just breaks my heart with how disillusioned she is from grief”, the “CA is conflicted, broken hearted, torn”....

I like consider myself a very rational person that can appreciate both sides of an argument. I’m a fixer, it’s what I do; everyone needs to be happy and well. Maybe I suffer from a bit too much of the "touchy feely 70's child Kumbaya syndrome" but I'm cool with it cause it beats the alternative. However….

I’ve also flipped the switch to absolute apathy, with very scary ease… a few times…. AND… I’ve had the rug pulled out from under my feet by people that I trusted completely – by people I should have been able to trust & by a few that I shouldn’t have trusted. One was a textbook Dark Triad that gas lighted me so well that I fought my rational head and consistently broken heart for 6 years!!! I will never have peace of mind because it just doesn’t compute on so many emotional and rational levels.

My point is there is NO RIGHT ANSWER to any of this. If you have never been completely fooled by someone, never been let down or had your heart broken repeatedly, lost someone so precious to you by the hands of someone else that also holds your heart in those same guilty hands… then I don’t think you can stand with such honest conviction for truth & justice and also be telling the truth.

I don’t think my signature has ever been more appropriate than it is today, "Life is pretty much in the grays for the most part and if you insist always on black and white... you are going to be very unhappy."

Now Imma jump off my box and go back to the bloopers, what did we learn polls and maybe even downstairs for a bit so I can get my warm and fuzzies back on…

Peace Ya’ll… and for goodness sake…. before you give yourself or someone else a stroke… play nice and laugh a little now and then! :heartbeat:

FBM

Excellent post. :clap:

 

[Studio_Medic]

No, I would not lie for my son, in any instance. As a home-schooling Mom, I taught my son as soon as he could talk and understand, to follow the Ten Commandments. Now at age 13, he is a very smart, bright and wonderful kid who knows right from wrong. He won't even hang out with certain neighborhood kids because as he says "All they do Mom is lie, cheat and steal and God doesn't like that". I am not overtly religious nor would I ever place my beliefs on anyone else, but I do believe if you obey the Ten Commandments, you will not go wrong.

1. Thou shalt have no other gods before me.

2. Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain.

3. Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them.

4. Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.

5. Honor thy father and thy mother. (Which I told him includes DO NOT LIE)

6. Thou shalt not kill.

7. Thou shalt not commit adultery.

8. Thou shalt not steal.

9. Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.

10. Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife.......

 

[Chiquita71]

It truly frightens and disturbs me to hear there are parents that would lie for their "child"-I think it should be clarified we are speaking of adults here, yes? But I suppose no matter their age, what is being said is the parent would cover for the child's behavior, crime.

I don't think the love I have for those I love is any less than anyone else's, of course-so I don't understand the argument that it would be for "love" the parent would be lying.

Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth.

What about Dahmer's mother? Should she have lied to save her son? How about little Charlie Manson? He has a mother, a grandmother. It is mothers(and fathers)that are supposed to teach children right from wrong. How else would they learn? And, if your "child" murders someone in cold blood-especially an innocent(a child)and society has decided we give a pass to parents who lie to get their "child" free, then we better change what we teach "our" children.

But I guess we are just conditioning them to lie, as we tell them how wrong it is and then do it ourselves finding loopholes as to why it is "okay." When so many parents are so willing to admit how they would lie, -when they know that person is guilty of murder or abuse gives me the answer I needed to society's ills. Those same parents who would protect their child when they have hurt another, would wail in protest should something befall their child.

Where does it stop?

:twocents:

 

[Turnadot]

Where does it stop?

When my son isn't strapped to a gurney and injected with a death cocktail.

The rest of your post is conflating different issues and appealing to philosophical concepts I don't give a damn about when it comes to saving my son's life - doesn't matter if he's 4 or 40.

 

[21merc7]

This is a difficult question to answer, hoping that none of us every have to find out.

Having worked for defense attorneys that specialize in Capital Murder for defense for nearly twenty years makes it even more difficult. Fortunately, the main attorney I work for has integrity and will not lie for his clients, and he tells them so repeatedly. The evidence alone usually would make it absurd and unethical. It comes out in Court. The parents lying is usually blatantly clear in Court also, and seems to cause more harm than good.

In any case where the parents must testify during trial phase, I would hope the parents have the very best attorney available to them and follow his/her advise.

What would I do for my DD? I hope I never have to find out.

 

[Chiquita71]

Suggestion: we should add the word "life" to the title of the thread if that is the subject. Should it read: Would you lie in court to save your child's life?

I do think where the death penalty is concerned it would make a difference to some but not to all. If I thought what my child had done was terrible, wrong, a crime-how can I blame society, the law-for wanting punishment for that crime? Aren't parents supposed to punish children when they do wrong? And, if we are talking about adult children then the punishment comes from the law.

I am not saying a parent shouldn't stand by their child, get them the best defense, anything in their power to save their child, short of lying. Short of doing wrong themselves.

My husband's mother would cover for him when he did wrong. He has had therapy and worked with those issues. I asked him, because of this trial especially, how that made him feel. He said, "like I could get away with anything."

What is to be said to the victims? So, every parent that has a son(or daughter)who rapes someone should lie for them? How is this right? I also do not understand the upset the opposite opinion seems to cause. How can it not be seen that someone outside of loving your child would simply find lying to let a murderer go free as wrong? I understand a parent having that in their heart and saying, "I would lie for my child" but taking some kind of stance on this subject is over my head. :dunno:

Cindy should be able to lie for Casey, her whole family should be allowed to lie because they love her? In my world view that is the furthest thing from love. What about love for Caylee? Lies always leave someone out in the cold. And lies are not love.

:twocents:

 

[Turnadot]

Suggestion: we should add the word "life" to the title of the thread if that is the subject. Should it read: Would you lie in court to save your child's life?

I do think where the death penalty is concerned it would make a difference to some but not to all. If I thought what my child had done was terrible, wrong, a crime-how can I blame society, the law-for wanting punishment for that crime? Aren't parents supposed to punish children when they do wrong? And, if we are talking about adult children then the punishment comes from the law.

I am not saying a parent shouldn't stand by their child, get them the best defense, anything in their power to save their child, short of lying. Short of doing wrong themselves.

My husband's mother would cover for him when he did wrong. He has had therapy and worked with those issues. I asked him, because of this trial especially, how that made him feel. He said, "like I could get away with anything."

What is to be said to the victims? So, every parent that has a son(or daughter)who rapes someone should lie for them? How is this right? I also do not understand the upset the opposite opinion seems to cause. How can it not be seen that someone outside of loving your child would simply find lying to let a murderer go free as wrong? I understand a parent having that in their heart and saying, "I would lie for my child" but taking some kind of stance on this subject is over my head. :dunno:

Cindy should be able to lie for Casey, her whole family should be allowed to lie because they love her? In my world view that is the furthest thing from love. What about love for Caylee? Lies always leave someone out in the cold. And lies are not love.

:twocents:

Yes I would.

Other people's views of what "Love is", or what I should do, based on the Law and social mores is not important to me at all, when it comes to my son's life. I don't care how "Right" it is, or if he "Deserves" it. In this hypothetical scenario, my son could be strapped to a gurney, then lethally injected. Truth, justice, stranger's ideas of what love is, and lies cease to matter to me the moment my son's life is on the line.

Yes, lying to save him would mean, depending on the person, that I'm a piece of sh--t, but I don't care about that. Why in hell would I? I only care that my son isn't dead.

If my stance is over your head, that's fine, to each their own.

 

[IfIMay]

I think that if you are willing to lie for your child in court under oath, then quite possibly that is precisely why you would find yourself in that position. If that is what you teach your child, then they will take you to the limit and over it. I personally respect the Hacking and Unibomber (can't think of their name so sorry!) families. They love their family members but understand they must face the consequences of their actions. Not excuse them.

 

[Turnadot]

I think that if you are willing to lie for your child in court under oath, then quite possibly that is precisely why you would find yourself in that position. If that is what you teach your child, then they will take you to the limit over it. I personally respect the Hacking and Unibomber (can't think of their name so sorry!) families. They love their family members but understand they must face the consequences of their actions. Not excuse them.

It isn't. Again, different issues are being conflated. I would lie to save my son from the death penalty. I don't teach my child that lying is OK, in word or deed.

 

[Chiquita71]

I think that if you are willing to lie for your child in court under oath, then quite possibly that is precisely why you would find yourself in that position. If that is what you teach your child, then they will take you to the limit and over it. I personally respect the Hacking and Unibomber (can't think of their name so sorry!) families. They love their family members but understand they must face the consequences of their actions. Not excuse them.

:tyou: IfIMay

You have stated what I have been afraid to say. I am afraid of people who admit they would lie for someone, anyone- who has brutally murdered another human being. As a victim of abuse, to hear people say they would protect and lie for a person who hurts innocent people is more than I can comprehend.

A parent that would lie for their child when they had done something so terrible as to bring about the death penalty(which I do not support) did not just start covering for their child. To each their own opinion yes, but let's not mince words-to attack people who think lying is wrong-is wrong. And scary for me, personally.

A person who admits they have done wrong, will do wrong, does wrong in front of you...and then says "you don't like it? oh well..." Is very scary to me. And I want to be real mad at my mom, who taught me to not lie-that was supposed to make me a good person and help me to get along with people in society...guess that isn't working out too well. You would think, taking the stance that being a liar is wrong, that lying is wrong that helping a guilty person who has taken the life of another is wrong-would make you popular.

It does not.

:twocents: