Found Deceased WY - Gabby Petito, Grand Teton National Park #87

[JennieM]

Can someone please summarize fr those of us who remain X-less?

Thanks!

JB Biunno #HeyJB
@WFLAJB


JUST IN: The Laundries have filed a proposal of settlement in the civil lawsuit filed against them in the #GabbyPetito case. The terms of the proposal are unknown. This comes after the first attempt to settle, which came from attorney Steve Bertolino.

 

[housewife]

This is not about money. It's about obtaining information that the Laundries don't want to share willingly. So they are going to drag it out of them.

I agree.
INFO > $
(Information is greater than money in this case)

 

[Laura456]

I agree.
INFO > $
(Information is greater than money in this case)

What good will information do? Closure is a myth and it won't bring back Brian or Gabby.

 

[al66pine]

Closure?

What good will information do? Closure is a myth and it won't bring back Brian or Gabby.

@Laura456
Agreeing about closure, largely a myth.

Have not followed this case closely, but imo doubtful that anything short of an admission & apology by BL's parents would bring any sense of closure to GP's parents.
Closure-by-apology would likely imo have to cover:
1. Lack of initial response to GP's parents's questions re GP.
2. Lack of later communication, before & after remains were located.
3. Lieing thru their atty (stmt claiming lack of knowledge re GP's whereabouts, hoping that GP will be located & reunited w family).
4. BL causing GP's death.

Admission & apology made PUBLIC? Extreeeemely doubtful.
Once GP's parents filed the petition, closure-by-apology, either private or even public, became implausible imo.

And maybe def'ts paying plaintiff's atty's fees? IDK.

I'd predict if parties reach a pre-trial settlement, the terms of agreement will not be made public.

Both families have suffered the worst tragedy they likely will ever bear. I cannot imagine being in their shoes.

 

[LinasK]

An attorney can leave a case with just client's approval.

Not always. Didn't happen in Jodi Arias's case. Jodi badly wanted to be rid of Kirk Nurmi. Judge wouldn't allow him to leave. The judge has to approve a client firing their lawyer- at least in some states.

 

[LinasK]

I agree.
INFO > $
(Information is greater than money in this case)

Just like Beth Holloway finally got Joran Van Der Sloot to confess that he killed her daughter Natalie Holloway.

 

[LinasK]

What good will information do? Closure is a myth and it won't bring back Brian or Gabby.

Only in your opinion. Having a relative murdered, I can attest to the need for answers to help bring closure.

 

[al66pine]

Change of Attorney on Client's Request?

Not always. Didn't happen in Jodi Arias's case. Jodi badly wanted to be rid of Kirk Nurmi. Judge wouldn't allow him to leave. The judge has to approve a client firing their lawyer- at least in some states.

@LinasK Thx for your post. As you said, does not always happen.
Def't's in crim cases often make that request before and after trial (as you know).

Afaik, Laundries have not requested a change of atty (I'm not saying that your post said that they did).

Comparing Jodi Arias & Kirk Nurmi case to this case.
Differences?
- JA 's case in CA; here FL law & ct. Different states, as your post said.
- JA's was a criminal case, and this is civil case.
- Timing of client's request? IiRC, altho ICBWrong, Jodi requested apptmt of different atty (or firing KN) after TRIAL began.

 

[al66pine]

My Apology re my Earlier Post.
@Laura456 said:
"What good will information do? Closure is a myth and it won't bring back Brian or Gabby."

Only in your opinion. Having a relative murdered, I can attest to the need for answers to help bring closure.

@LinasK
I am sorry for my post about closure being "largely a myth."
The sweeping generalization was overly broad, and I regret making it.

By learning more information about the circumstances of their loved one's death, like thru a trial, some survivors feel a sense of closure. Some others, maybe not at all.

As I said in other posts, I cannot imagine being in the shoes of either family, w both suffering one of the most, or the most, tragic events in their lives.

Sadly, you too are a member of the club nobody wants to join.
I'm sorry for your loss.

 

[al66pine]

Attorney "Leaving a Case." W. Just "Client's Approval"

An attorney can leave a case with just client's approval.

@Smelly Squirrel
Nor sure what above post is responding to, but I'm curious as to ostensible
source.

@Smelly Squirrel Link & quote pls. Anyone? TiA.

 

[ch_13]

Attorney "Leaving a Case." W. Just "Client's Approval"

@Smelly Squirrel
Nor sure what above post is responding to, but I'm curious as to ostensible
source.

@Smelly Squirrel Link & quote pls. Anyone? TiA.

The Petito's switched lawyers due to their original attorney moving to another firm. I asked a question about that in post #388. A few people responded, including Smelly.

 

[Smelly Squirrel]

Substitution of attorneys with a client's consent are routinely approved. Kirk Nurmi wanted to withdraw from the case despite Arias's opposition. Different circumstances.

 

[bestill]

Personally I would think any details about those last few days leading up to her murder and after the murder will be of interest to Gabby's family. Anything the Laundries knew may have helped them. Their silence didn't help this situation at all and I don't think Gabby's family is going to be interested in settling. All JMO.

 

[al66pine]

Can Client "Choose" to Continue w. Departing Attorney?
Or Is Atty "Required" to hand the case over to someone else???

From the article...
Matthew Luka took a new job at another law firm, which required him to hand the case over to someone else, he said. He will be replaced by Ryan Gilbert.
Is this true? I was always under the impression that the client got to choose if they wanted to stay with the firm or go with the departing attorney.
But I may have picked that up from LA Law or Boston Legal or one of those shows. So perhaps not the most reliable source of information.

@ch_13 Oh, the things we see & hear on shows like LA Law. Some factual, some not.

Briefly.
Required? WIthout seeing the Engagement Letter, I doubt if anyone can make an educated guess about this purported requirememt.
Required? IDK, I cannot speak to this specific case but can offer some generalities.

Not So Briefly.
A person may think of an individual lawyer who advises them, files pleadings, motions, etc, and appears at hearings & trial in civil or criminal case, as "MY attorney."
The "engagement letter" (i.e., contract re legal services typically signed by atty & client) often names the LAW FIRM, as the party to the contract, not an individual attorney who may be an associate or partner of the law firm.
If an atty leaves the firm, Engagement letter terms likely allows firm to assign another atty to provide services to client.
But if client is not receptive to that, in some circumstances, the firm is willingly to disengage w client & case.

Other clauses of engagement letter may specify -
- other atty's in the firm may provide services.
- firm may subcontract w other atty's, not in the firm.
The client and (initially named) attorney may not be "yoked" together.

Engagement Letter may address procedure on atty's unexpected death, disability, impairment, or incapacity. Below, a sample paragraph from So. Car. Bar* (seems esp'ly appropriate for solo practioner). Also a paragraph from another website.

Clients do not always have the option to "go w the departing atty," not even if they want to.

A departing atty may join a law firm w current or past "Conflicts of Interest" under the applicable state's ct-issued Rules of Professional Conduct for attys. Some C./I.s may be waived by law firm disclosing the C./I. to client and client signing to acknowlege the C./I. Some C./I.s are not waivable by client.
Can't think ATM of C./I. examples likely in this case, but still a possibility.

Other reasons? In joining another firm, a departing atty may not wish -- - to continue representing the particular client (ex., personality clash?)
- to continue in that legal practice area (ex, medical malpractice, defamation, probate, auto accident-personal injury, estate planning).

And for various reasons, the new law firm may not want to "take on" a particular case.

Again, just a list of possibilities, which may not be applicable to this case.imo

ETA: a couple clarifications.
________________________________________
* Paragraph from So. Car. Bar sample Engagement Letter:
"... to protect your interests in the event of my unexpected death, disability, impairment, or incapacity. To accomplish this, I have arranged withanother lawyer to assist with closing my practice in the event of my death, disability, impairment, or incapacity. In such event, my office staff or the assisting lawyer will contact you and provide you with information about how to proceed."
https://www.scbar.org/media/filer_p...359836/sample_engagement_letters_sample_1.pdf

From eforms.com, another paragraph:
"ENGAGEMENT LETTER FOR LEGAL SERVICES"
"This Engagement Letter for Legal Services (“Letter”), made effective as of [DATE], between the law firm of [FIRM’S NAME] with [ATTORNEY’S NAME] as the appointed attorney (“Attorney”) and agrees to represent [CLIENT’S NAME] (“Client”) in regard to legal representation....
"SERVICES. Attorney agrees to provide the following Services: [DESCRIPTION OF SERVICES] (“Services”)....
"IN WITNESS WHEREOF, the Parties hereto have executed this Letter on the dates written hereunder."
Names, dates, & siggie lines for atty & client.

Attorney Engagement Letter

 

[LinasK]

Change of Attorney on Client's Request?


@LinasK Thx for your post. As you said, does not always happen.
Def't's in crim cases often make that request before and after trial (as you know).

Afaik, Laundries have not requested a change of atty (I'm not saying that your post said that they did).

Comparing Jodi Arias & Kirk Nurmi case to this case.
Differences?
- JA 's case in CA; here FL law & ct. Different states, as your post said.
- JA's was a criminal case, and this is civil case.
- Timing of client's request? IiRC, altho ICBWrong, Jodi requested apptmt of different atty (or firing KN) after TRIAL began.

Another example- yes it's a criminal case. In my cousin's case- his accused murderer has managed to change lawyers 7 times now, and that's why we haven't been to trial yet. Keeps getting pushed back.

 

[Cedars]

Just like Beth Holloway finally got Joran Van Der Sloot to confess that he killed her daughter Natalie Holloway.

Yes, but in this case, the Petitos know who murdered Gabby. They know when, who, how, where. Authorities recovered her body, so they were able to put her to rest.

Now, if Beth Holloway were to embark on a campaign to sue Van Der Sloots parents, that would be comparable, IMO.

 

[LinasK]

Yes, but in this case, the Petitos know who murdered Gabby. They know when, who, how, where. Authorities recovered her body, so they were able to put her to rest.

Now, if Beth Holloway were to embark on a campaign to sue Van Der Sloots parents, that would be comparable, IMO.

I was just going to edit my previous remark, instead I'll elaborate here. In my cousin's case- we know virtually nothing and the perp isn't talking. We know that my cousin is presumed dead and who the alleged murderer is. (There is DNA evidence). We know that it won't bring my cousin back, but we don't know what he did with his body, how he was killed, or even how they knew each other, or what his motive was for killing him. Only that my cousin was in possession of the perp's phone number, and that the murder occurred at my cousin's house. That's it. We would love to have some answers, especially to where Mark is. We'd bring him home for burial beside his mother. His father is in his 90's.

And Van Der Sloot's father died. Don't know the status of his mother.

 

[al66pine]

Another example- yes it's a criminal case. In my cousin's case- his accused murderer has managed to change lawyers 7 times now, and that's why we haven't been to trial yet. Keeps getting pushed back.

@LinasK Thank you for your post about the delays in your cousin's murder case.
IDK how relatives, friends, or the community can bear the agony of delays caused by seven atty & substitutions. Just beyond me.

i hope information surfacing at trial (someday) will bring closure for you and the others affected.

ETA. I read your post just above. Simply heartbreaking.

 

[al66pine]

The Petito's switched lawyers due to their original attorney moving to another firm. I asked a question about that in post #388....

@ch_13 Appreciate your response. Snipping for focus.

Linked article* said - ATTY SAID that he was "required to hand the case over to someone else."

My earlier post #434** did not question the accuracy of that statement in article (the atty said part).
I questioned whether the atty's stmt re being "REQUIRED to hand over to someone else" was factual.

I listed in that post several possible reasons why the Laundries MAY have engaged new atty/law firm.
Ex: A non-waivable Conflict of Interest under FL. Sup. Ct-issued Rules of Professional Conduct may have applied.
A Conflict of Interest which prohibits a law firm from accepting a case also prohibits a newly employed atty from continuing rep'ing a client orginally engaged at a former law firm, IIUC.

In practical terms, a Conflict of Interest like ^ hypothetical ^ would have REQUIRED Luka to discontinue his representation of the L's.
***ETA: But the choice of WHO the case was "handed to" was not Luka's decision to make. It was up to the L's to select a new atty or firm.***

The L's may have engaged a different law firm for OTHER reasons, but possibly not because atty Luka's change of law firm employment "REQUIRED" Luka to "hand it over to someone else."

Perhaps a picayune point, so I'll put my hair-splitting scissors back in the drawer At least for today.
_______________________________________
* Why the Laundries lost their attorney ahead of the Gabby Petito trial

** Post 434 ETA.
Wrong post was displayed, so I deleted what was "copied to clipboard."

 

[al66pine]

FL. Sup. Ct Rule

if there was a conflict of interest, he might have needed to transfer the case... usually an atty needs to ask the court for permission to stop representing a party IMO.

Rule 4-1.16 - DECLINING OR TERMINATING REPRESENTATION, R. Regul. FL. Bar 4-1.16 | Casetext Search + Citator

Read Rule 4-1.16 - DECLINING OR TERMINATING REPRESENTATION, R. Regul. FL. Bar 4-1.16, see flags on bad law, and search Casetext’s comprehensive legal database

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@acutename
Thank you for posting this reference to the FL. Sup. Ct. Rule 4-1.16 - DECLINING OR TERMINATING REPRESENTATION,
In posting on this thread today, I had inadvertently skipped over some posts, including yours. Helpful.