GUILTY Yoselyn Ortega charged with 2 counts ea-1st and 2nd Degree Murder of Krim Children

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The newspaper also reported that the Krims offered extra hours to Ortega, a native of the Dominican Republican who has been a U.S. citizen for 10 years. They also referred her to another family for a baby-sitting job on the side, though that family turned her down because they found her "a little too grumpy," a law-enforcement source told the Post.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/10/2...oney-woes-deteriorating-mental/#ixzz2Bq9WExCj

A native of the Dominican Republic, Ortega had been a naturalized U.S. citizen for 10 years.
Friends had introduced the family to Ortega, and she had worked for them since Leo's birth two years ago, police said.
She lives at another address on Manhattan's West Side with her son, her sister and her niece, Kelly said.
http://edition.cnn.com/2012/10/26/us/new-york-nanny-deaths/index.html

Besides her mental health woes, in recent months, Ortega had been kicked out of a Bronx apartment she'd been renting from an acquaintance when said acquaintance returned from the Dominican Republic. Ortega was then forced to move with her 17-year-old son into her sister and niece's apartment in a tenement building in Hamilton Heights. The super for the Hamilton Heights building told the New York Times that Ortega was especially sad about having to leave the Bronx apartment because she'd sunk a lot of money into maintaining it.
http://gawker.com/5957773/new-yorks-killer-nanny-is-actually-a-very-troubled-mentally-unhealthy-older-woman

Okay, this is what I've found so far. The first 2 are almost the same information, but one is from a right leaning news source and the other from a left leaning one. I included both to show that it's one thing that seems to be agreed on by all sources discussing it.

BBM: JUST MAYBE the article should have said Return to her sisters apartment in Harlem where she lived before.
She took that Bronx apartment after she decided to bring her son here from DR. She did not live in the Bronx very long at all just a few months.

Maybe she wanted to start her own home, and it saddened her that her friends took it back, so she had to return to where she lived before.

We have all had disappointments in life, but we do not go to insane extreems because we can’t get our way.
:moo:
 
http://www.dnainfo.com/new-york/201...stress-spiked-after-son-moved-nyc-sources-say

Ortega’s relationship with Marina Krim, her husband David, a CNBC executive, and their children seemed flawless. They treated Ortega as though she were part of their family, and traveled to the Dominican Republic to meet her family before they hired her. Several other times, they escorted her there when she visited her son, who was living with one of Ortega’s sisters at the time.
Roughly eight months ago, Ortega decided to bring Jesus to New York to live with her in her new apartment in the Bronx.
“She thought he would do better here,” a source explained.
Like the many affluent mothers on the Upper West Side she saw every day, Ortega enrolled her son in a private school in the Bronx.
While a brother agreed to pay for the initial year’s tuition, he said that Ortega would be responsible for the ensuing tuition bills."

Looks like she moved to NYC 10 years ago...leaving a 7 year old to be raised by her sister

Read more: http://www.dnainfo.com/new-york/201...after-son-moved-nyc-sources-say#ixzz2BqNWDhiv

BBM-1: Marina Krim's husbands name is KEVIN (not David)

BBM-2: yes she moved to NY and lived at her sisters in Harlem 10 years ago....Her son came to NY to live, last MAY 2012 that is only 5 months ago. That Bronx apartment was a sublet unit that belonged to someone else. She never had a lease.
 
At one time, YO was an accountant, correct? Or did she just work for an accounting firm in some capacity? She may have had aspirations of providing for herself and her son. I'm curious to know what happened with that job.

Seems she had an office job for a short time, then went back to DR when she came back she could not get another office job.
IMHO - accountants are always in demand, ALLWAYS.
I think if she can count she may have been a bookkeeper, those jobs are a dime a dozen.
that is MOO. DOUBT she ever had an accounting job doubt it BIG time.
Before she got the job with the Krim family she was cleaning homes, that is my understanding of her.
NO LINK.
 
Seems she had an office job for a short time, then went back to DR when she came back she could not get another office job.
IMHO - accountants are always in demand, ALLWAYS.
I think if she can count she may have been a bookkeeper, those jobs are a dime a dozen.
that is MOO. DOUBT she ever had an accounting job doubt it BIG time.
Before she got the job with the Krim family she was cleaning homes, that is my understanding of her.
NO LINK.

It says yes, did graduate from a college in DR. Also said most of the siblings lived here.

Seems she was an office manager for print shop in Manhattan before nanny job.


http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/ne...napped-before-taking-life-two-young-children/
 
Seems she had an office job for a short time, then went back to DR when she came back she could not get another office job.
IMHO - accountants are always in demand, ALLWAYS.
I think if she can count she may have been a bookkeeper, those jobs are a dime a dozen.
that is MOO. DOUBT she ever had an accounting job doubt it BIG time.
Before she got the job with the Krim family she was cleaning homes, that is my understanding of her.
NO LINK
.

That's the problem; other people have provided links to what they've said. If you just met her after she become a nanny for the Krims, how did you come to have more accurate information about her life over 10+ years ago than those who have interviewed her and her family about it? No offense intended, but I'd like to know if your source of information is somebody close to her or just more gossip among neighbors/nannies. For the record, I believe she actually came here longer ago than 10 years - she became a US citizen 10 years ago, but that doesn't happen the day you get off the plane here. I believe she would have had to live her for at least 5 years first. I know that makes things sound worse for her rather than better, but I'm just looking for the truth, I'm not trying to defend her or make her look better. TIA for any info you give. MOO
 
I don't get it. If she could pay the monthly rental for the Bronx apt, why couldn't she pay monthly rental for another apt at the same price?
 
It says yes, did graduate from a college in DR. Also said most of the siblings lived here.
Seems she was an office manager for print shop in Manhattan before nanny job.
http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/ne...napped-before-taking-life-two-young-children/

Thanks. That link has a lot of the info I was looking for.
Her sister(YO) emigrated to the United States in the early 1980s after graduating from accounting studies at Santa Ana College in Santiago.

Yoselyn Ortega worked as the manager of a print shop in Manhattan, until she separated from the father of her child. She returned to Santiago for a while, but then went back to the U.S., her sister said.
That doesn't really sound like someone who can't hold down a job. It says she moved here in the 80s and worked as a shop manager until she and her son's father split up, which is when she and her son went back to DR. It doesn't say how long she stayed there, but it does say she took the nanny job when she came back and couldn't find an accounting job. I question how accurate some of it is though. Many sources say she's been a US citizen for 10 years, but this one says she went back to DR for a while after splitting with her son's father in 2001. It also says she took the nanny job when she got back to NY, but I think it's confusing some things. She took the nanny job after returning from the Bronx from what I've read elsewhere (and from the other quotes I provided). :banghead:

I think I'll go back to waiting for more information to come out during the trial. :waitasec:
 
I don't get it. If she could pay the monthly rental for the Bronx apt, why couldn't she pay monthly rental for another apt at the same price?

Because she had paid for the other place, and invested all of her money into it. It sounds like she was saving to be able to keep paying for her son's tuition, which she wasn't paying when they were in the Bronx. MOO
 
I don't get it. If she could pay the monthly rental for the Bronx apt, why couldn't she pay monthly rental for another apt at the same price?

If she was subleasing the Bronx apt. then it might have been way below the current prices. It is hard to find deals like that. Maybe she couldnt find another great deal below current rental rates.
 
Her investment in a sublet would be what exactly? I don't think she would be remodeling, changing appliances, refinishing the floors. Not that kind of "investment." Why would she do that in a temporary situation? More likely she bought furniture. And then she enrolled her son in a private school. Something tells me that her hard working siblings, who are to be much admired for their sense of family and their generosity...somehow I don't think they lived above their means.

The big turnoff in this case is when this woman wakes up and shows not one bit of remorse, but a sense of justification, that the Mom had it coming, that SHE the Nanny was the victim.
I think she had this attitude long before she met the Krims. She never had to take tesponsibility. Someone else always cleaned up her mess.

Not THIS TIME. Good luck in prison!
 
ETA: In reading back, I just noticed that this reporter actually called KEVIN Krim, David? My gosh! How accurate is the rest of his reporting? This dnainfo reporter until a couple of years ago, worked for 17 years as a reporter for the NYPost. Before that he reported for the NY Daily News. Just a FYI.
Maybe author thought that Krim was Jewish .. and automatically called him David, for some reason (... just kidding) :)

But .. that is what i was saying few days ago.. - Anything you see in the Media (even MSM often) .. should be taken with somewhat skeptisizm and a grain of salt...

Lot's of boo-boos in those articles .. typos etc etc..

All this is not evidence anyhow .. just some details, rumors to "get us by", basically :)

The best is to wait for official evidence in court ;)
 
It says yes, did graduate from a college in DR. Also said most of the siblings lived here.

Seems she was an office manager for print shop in Manhattan before nanny job.


http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/ne...napped-before-taking-life-two-young-children/


NO the Office job was when she first came to the US 10 years ago, then she returned to DR
after a couple of years in NY and was in DR for a while not very long then returned to NY again
this was very very long ago, years ago.

The Nanny job is the most recent 2 YEARS.

That article you gave, said she worked in office till Ortega separated from the father of her child.
I read somewhere that the son’s father has Either not seen her or been in contact with her in over 9 years.

Now that makes Ortega’s job history very sketchy from where I sit.
there are years between her nanny job and her long ago office job.
 
That's the problem; other people have provided links to what they've said. If you just met her after she become a nanny for the Krims, how did you come to have more accurate information about her life over 10+ years ago than those who have interviewed her and her family about it? No offense intended, but I'd like to know if your source of information is somebody close to her or just more gossip among neighbors/nannies. For the record, I believe she actually came here longer ago than 10 years - she became a US citizen 10 years ago, but that doesn't happen the day you get off the plane here. I believe she would have had to live her for at least 5 years first. I know that makes things sound worse for her rather than better, but I'm just looking for the truth, I'm not trying to defend her or make her look better. TIA for any info you give. MOO


The links I read are all here -
there is a recent link here somewhere that speaks of the boys father not seeing Ortega in 9 years
there is another link that says she stopped her office job when she split up with her sons father.

Her nanny job was 2 years.


The first or second night there was also a link about her doing housework.

I realize people also send me e-mails from all around with links but
I doubt that I had anything more then you all have from media.
 
I really don't care where she worked BUT I do care why she left her jobs. Was she dismissed for any particular reasons?
 
I don't get it. If she could pay the monthly rental for the Bronx apt, why couldn't she pay monthly rental for another apt at the same price?

I think he had a regulated lease, those leases are no more, but the old leases are indelibly renewable if you stay within the rule. The rents are far less than a comparable market rate apartment. A regulated apartment can hold on to a regulated lease as long as the rightful lease holder lives in it, otherwise the landlord can up the rent by a lot for any illegal sublease.
So if she had a “deal” they are hard to replace.
She probably had a deal for way below a thousand dollars. now the rates are about $1400 market rate if you can find it...

She should have given them an adjustment time, to see if they come back from DR - before she put her money into the apartment.

I am real tired, I am making mistakes I best get to bed....
 
No one is vilifying her son. It is not his fault that his Mother left him to be raised by others so she could fulfill HER dream of living in NYC. We can assume, in fact, that he is a fine young man.

It is a sad fact that his name is being mentioned in articles and his Mother is probably one of the most hated murderers in NYC...but THAT too is another outrage to lay at YO's feet.

The things that YO has already admitted and her own attitudes...but most of all the hideous atrocity she committed...smear her far worse than any words on this Board.

I'm not sure if you are aware but millions of immigrants from third world countries leave children behind when they leave to find work in another country. They invariably do it out of necessity. Not because they are desirous of giving up the responsibility of caring for their kids.

The Dominican Republic is a very poor, third world country. It is very hard to survive there. Many immigrants leave there and send money home.

I believe, with much respect, that you are making baseless assumptions, stretching a few facts to create a very detailed picture where there is little detail at all.
 
These boards are all about us speculating, reading clues through our perspectives, and giving opinions. I am sharing mine....within the rules.

We are all trying to find the motivation for the merciless slaughter of two defenseless children by a caretaker they probably loved and certainly did not fear. We are trying to understand how a woman who has held those babies for two years....plunges a knifeinto them repeatedly, looking at their terrified little faces, and then waits for the satisfaction of seeing their Mother destroyed.

YO had supportive family. And the living situation in the DR, if you saw the photos of the family home, were hardly a third world hovel. THE idea that this family is third world poor is also a "baseless assumption." The Krims actually stayed in their home and were entertained by the family for several days according to Marina's journal. I doubt the Krims would take advantage of a poor third world family or stay in primitive conditions.

In any event, I cannot attribute any cocoon of victimhood to YO...as if any finanicial disparity somehow condones THIS kind of envy and rage. That makes the KRIMS somehow responsible for their babies deaths because...they had too much? Or makes what YO did just a little bit...understandable?

In any event, if the struggling "third world" assumption does not fit YO then she left HER child only because she "loved NYC" as her sister said. I see that as a woman putting HER needs before her child.

And YO was educated. I too want to know her work history. Her family appears hrad working and admirable in every way. But she may have been The one in the family that was the exception.

YO seems to feel she is the "victim" If she had snapped, one would assume her first words would have been for those children and terrible remorse. But instead, she was justifying her actions, repeating her gripes. Maybe she has bought into feeling sorry for herself vs the Krims...that they OWE her something because life hasn't given her material things. Obviously, working five more hours was not seen as "helping" but so infuriated her that she did The UNthinkable.

Maybe she will make herself a victim in court . It might be a winner if her attorneys can spin the Krims as evil ...because they had too much materially. Maybe YO is not done yet with destroying the Krims because of her envy and jealously.
 
These boards are all about us speculating, reading clues through our perspectives, and giving opinions. I am sharing mine....within the rules.

We are all trying to find the motivation for the merciless slaughter of two defenseless children by a caretaker they probably loved and certainly did not fear.
<SNIP>

I'm not going to go into your speculations, but I wanted to comment on the part I quoted. As long as we're just speculating, why would her jealousy have to be about money? If I were in her place, I'd be less envious of the money they had that I didn't, and more envious of the children's mother being able to spend so much time with them while they're young and watch them grow up after missing out on so much of it with my own child. She may have also been feeling jealousy (and guilt) because of all of the things these parents are able to give and do for their children that she'll never have a chance to do for hers. Not an excuse, but possibly an explanation. I know that in my own life, money means nothing in the long run, but my sons mean everything. MOO
 
I agree that it may well have been a different nanny and kids in the elevator, otherwise the time line just would not fit.

We really have very few facts in this case, and I am afraid we just have to be patient.

It seems logical that she killed Leo while he was sleeping, which would have been easier and quieter.

We need to stick to logic, and the few facts that we have.

Witness statements are often not reliable, as much as we would like them to be...so I never count those as facts.

My opinion only

There would have to be alot of coincidences for the elevator witness to have identified the wrong children. First, the children were of the right age range, with a girl about 6 and a todder boy in a stroller. There are lots of kids in a building of this type, but not that many, and that particular combination is more rare. Most times I see just one kid with a nanny so two kids is something that would stick out to me. NYC apartments are generally too small for multiple kids, so most families with multiple kids move to the suburbs when they have a school age child. Also, usually when I see multiple kids it is with a parent, not a nanny. So I imagine there would be a very small handful - if any at all - of children in that building with that combination of gender and age with a nanny.

Second, the girl mentioned dancing to the elevator witness. That would be very coincidental for another child to have mentioned that, given that Lulu was suppose to have been at dancing class at that time and might have mentioned dancing because maybe she thought she was going dancing. Also, I am not sure if this is true or not, but if in fact the elevator witness actually saw the nanny and two kids exit at the second floor (the same floor as the Krims), or even if they saw them exit at a floor below their own, that too would be very coincidental for the family not to be them. IMO, it has to be them.

Between the two things, right age range and gender, and child mentioning dancing, it would be pretty coincidental. Add to that the fact (possibly?) that you have the right age and gender, with a child mentioning dancing also getting off on the Krims floor, and I think it is pretty clear cut. Question is where was Nanny with kids between 3:15-4:50?

NYC is a very impersonal place and kids in these buildings really do look interchangeable, especially when you mostly see them in the elevators and they are all buddled up in their jackets, and are in strollers, etc. You don't really recognize or even see their faces. So I think it is much easier to recognize a family group by recognizing the adult in that group, rather than the kids themselves. NYC is not the type of place where, even if you see a family everyday, you will say, "Oh those are the Smith kids." Rather, you might recoginze the man or woman with the kids, but you wouldn't be able to pick out which kids go with which parent, because they all look alike. I know personally if I was in this situation, I would only be able to identify the kids after I saw the picture of the parent or nanny and then I could identify the kids indirectly.

Doorman too don't always see people go in the building. Sometimes, they take a break to go to the bathroom and someone else fills in for a few minutes, or they might help pick up the USPS packages, or they might be outside hailing a cab for someone. So while it is the case that the front door is always monitored, sometimes, they switch off responsibilites on that for a few minutes. I am not sure if this building has two doorman or a doorman and a porter or concierge, but often there are 2 people who swipe off duties.

Also the doorman has to be wrong. He had to have seen them at some time and maybe didn't realize it or else he was on a break. Nanny had to have picked Lulu up at school so she had to have entered the building sometime between 3:15-5:30, and doorman, as I understand it, never saw her entered, so if you took the doorman's word literally, she and the kids would not be in the building at all. We know that is not true, as we know Lulu came home after school, so it must have been the case that the doorman just didn't see them. They had to have entered the building sometime after 3:15 and no one saw them in the building except the elevator witness, as I understand. So the fact that the doorman did not see them has absolutely no bearing on whether the elevator witness identified the right family, as some have said that the fact that the doorman did not see them must mean that the elevator witness is wrong. Holding true to the doorman would also mean that they were not in the apartment at all, or that Lulu never came home from school, either of which we know is not correct so we cannot draw conclusions from the doorman.

Sometimes, I think when the doorman is busy, hailing a cab, etc., he just kinda monitors the door to make sure random people off the street are not coming in. So he might have just saw a nanny and kids entering, not knowing which specific nanny and kids they were, but not stopping and questioning, because they looked like they belonged there. A nanny with two little kids does not pose much a security threat, so them entering might have went over his head if he was busy doing other stuff ("oh, just another nanny with kids,I am not going to stop what I am doing to go see exactly which nanny and kids they are because it is not necessary to know"). Also, as I mentioned, kids with nannies look interchangeable, and especially if this doorman was new, as I think he was, he might not have known specific names or faces or perhaps not be able to say definitely whether or not he saw them. He might not know.
 
I agree that it may well have been a different nanny and kids in the elevator, otherwise the time line just would not fit.

We really have very few facts in this case, and I am afraid we just have to be patient.

It seems logical that she killed Leo while he was sleeping, which would have been easier and quieter.

We need to stick to logic, and the few facts that we have.

Witness statements are often not reliable, as much as we would like them to be...so I never count those as facts.

My opinion only
I saw them wheel the nanny out in a gurney. I am sure it was her in the elevator.
And you have a right to think I was wrong. I wish I was wrong. I really do.
Sadly remembering my exchange and big smiles in the elevator with Lulu has kept me awake many nights.
That along with Moms screams.

But regardless, carry on.
 

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