17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #16

[Chris_Texas]

I also thought IF it was GZ screaming for help it just may have been done for added drama....

Yep. :twocents:

 

[Chris_Texas]

Anyway, good night all. :seeya:

 

[Reader]

Trayvon Martin family lawyers hit back at Wolfinger: 'This family deserves answers'

http://www.thegrio.com/specials/tra...at-wolfinger-this-family-deserves-answers.php

Trayvon Martin's family responded to Seminole County State Attorney Norman Wolfinger Tuesday, after Wolfinger called the allegations the family wants the Justice Department to review, "outright lies."
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Jackson said the family is "asking the same questions that the American people are asking." She added, in a pointed rebuke of Wolfinger, who, an anonymous source told theGrio, personally met with the chief on the night of the shooting, February 26th, after which the decision to release Zimmerman was made: "the family is getting the same information the public is getting, through the media, and that's not how it's supposed to be. They should be getting it from the source."

Jackson said Wolfinger's office failed to keep the family informed when he had the case, and added, "the only source who can get answers for this family at this point, is the Justice Department."

Jackson said Trayvon's parents have a core question: "why was George Zimmerman not arrested that night? Why did [Wolfinger's office and Sanford police] say there was no probable cause? We as Americans see there was probable cause. That is the core of the problem........

More at link....

 

[suzihawk]

I am trying to be very careful with what I type, so apologies in advance if this is a bit cryptic...

All of us who are white would love to believe that "white privilege" and the oppressive black experience ended generations ago.

Consider, however, that any older black person you meet, no older than some of us posting here, grew up in a nation in which the police would arrest them for daring to sit in the white man's seat on the bus, or drink from the white man's water fountain, or sit in the white man's chair. And if that black got uppity, if he forgot his place, he was liable to be murdered and those police he is expected to call today didn't even consider it a crime.

Distant past? The governor of my state, Texas, a former 2012 candidate for President, owns a camp that until recently had a sign on the front drive of his hunting camp calling it "Camp N*****head."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...charged-name/2011/10/01/gIQAOhY5DL_story.html

It's better than it was, obviously, but we have a long way to go still. And in my opinion the first step is to admit we have a problem and the second is to challenge those who with to perpetrate this evil and refuse to tolerate it frm anyone.

In my opinion.

Excellent post! Thank you.

 

[MarthaM]

It makes no sense to me, either. If Trayvon is on top of GZ and GZ shoots him, he would not fall back, he would stay on top of GZ, just 'dead' weight.
AND GZ would have blood all over him. IMO

So how did Trayvon get on his stomach with hands underneath?

Yes. How is it possible to hold one's hand over another's mouth while beating him up? I mean, what part of Zimmerman's body is Trayvon supposed to be beating at that point? And if Trayvon's on Zimmerman as Z claims, how did Z get his gun unholstered and get off a shot? He got the gun out and there was enough space to point it at Trayvon, while T was on top of him? And yes, how would Trayvon fall back and then end up on his stomach with his hands underneath?

I think Z's biggest mistake was saying that Trayvon fell back. He would have fallen forward, not back.

That little slip makes me say... pants on fire, Mr. Zimmerman.

 

[rotterdam]

Consider...

While it is certainly true that, were GZ's head resting against the ground or concrete, any blow to his face would transfer some of that force through his head and into the concrete, any force applied to the front would be absorbed and diminished (through deformation of the face and what not) before it got the the back of his skull.

To see this in action, place your hand flat against the wall or floor, then whack it with your other hand. Which part gets injured first, the part against the wall or the part getting hit?

In other words, if GZ were getting pounded in this way, the back of his head would be the last thing he would feel and complain about. His face would be GONE long before he became concerned about the minor damage to the back of his head.

I'll go as far that GZ did not know , he was bleeding on the back of his head.
Wonder at what point that multiple slamming of his head became part of his self defense. What is after somebody told him he was bleeding there?

 

[vlpate]

I assume if they don't have confidence of LE, they would be afraid under most circumstances.

It did address one kind of fear: Percent of African-American people who report sometimes being afraid of being stopped and arrested when they are completely innocent, 2000: 36%

They have many fears. One of my AA friends lives in a small town in Texas - Lubbock. He's 6'3" and a hot mess. While he was going to medical school 20 years ago, he worked at night. After work he would jog through his nice, mostly white neighborhood - many nights cop cars would pass by him slowly, then take another pass. He got stopped all the time because he drove a nice car. When he would stop by Walmart at midnight on the way home, he could feel people watching him and he'd mess with them, acting sketchy - it's what they expected. He would walk by cars in a parking lot at night and hear door locks engaging. When we'd go out together people would stare and smile as if they were ok with it - once when we went to see Les Miserables in Houston, three white guys walked behind us making comments about (racial slur) and white girls. Saddest to me was the time I introduced him to one of my friends - she asked what he did for a living, he said he was in medical school and her first reaction was to laugh, and then caught herself. Other people would always feel like the stupid thing to say would be, "I have a lot of black friends". He'd say, "yeah? What are their names?" hahaha - stumped 1/2 of them.

Another good friend is high up in the space program (was), he called me once while driving in Houston - he had a convertible something - he said the cool thing about the convertible is when he decided to act like the crazy (slur) speeding down the road, people got out of the way because they thought he had a gun, of course he was kidding, but he could. He was stopped a lot. Once, he was put up against the back of his car with two cops telling him they knew he was lying about where he had just been - there'd been a robbery close by - they detained him for two hours - even after telling them who he was. Sadly, he and my other friend were used to it and hardly worth mentioning at the end of the day.

You know what both of them agree upon when it comes to racism? They're way more comfortable with the outspoken, honest racist. They know exactly where they stand. They have both said it's the racists who act like they're not racist, that scare them. AA's instinctively know the difference.

Both agree a racist would do just what GZ is being accused of in the media - and a 17 yr. old whose been told all his life the white man is not to be trusted, would do just what Zimmerman said Trayvon did.

IMO, one only has to turn on the television in the past three weeks to see nothing has changed - white and AA children are still being told why they should fear each other. This case is the perfect storm.

 

[Concerned Papa]

Here's a conundrum for you. Why would a police department put this at the top of their incident report,

yet tell the suspect this?

Oliver says Zimmerman has been told by Sanford Police not to talk publicly about what happened

http://www.myfoxtampabay.com/dpps/news/local/032612-Zimmerman's-friend-defends-his-actions_18831412

What's that old saying? "Loose lips sink ships"?

Whose boat are they concerned about getting sunk?

 

[Allusonz]

Here's a conundrum for you. Why would a police department put this at the top of their incident report,

yet tell the suspect this?



What's that old saying? "Loose lips sink ships"?

Whose boat are they concerned about getting sunk?

Ok I am impressed finally someone got the reason I posted it besides the fact I truly had not seen it posted before. I found it to be an interesting statement.

 

[vlpate]

I am trying to be very careful with what I type, so apologies in advance if this is a bit cryptic...

All of us who are white would love to believe that "white privilege" and the oppressive black experience ended generations ago.

Consider, however, that any older black person you meet, no older than some of us posting here, grew up in a nation in which the police would arrest them for daring to sit in the white man's seat on the bus, or drink from the white man's water fountain, or sit in the white man's chair. And if that black got uppity, if he forgot his place, he was liable to be murdered and those police he is expected to call today didn't even consider it a crime.

Distant past? The governor of my state, Texas, a former 2012 candidate for President, owns a camp that until recently had a sign on the front drive of his hunting camp calling it "Camp N*****head."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/natio...charged-name/2011/10/01/gIQAOhY5DL_story.html

It's better than it was, obviously, but we have a long way to go still. And in my opinion the first step is to admit we have a problem and the second is to challenge those who with to perpetrate this evil and refuse to tolerate it frm anyone.

In my opinion.

I'm from Texas too, born and raised We have tons of deer leases, as you probably know. For those who don't, hunters lease acres of land to take their buddies and business associates hunting during deer season, but they don't own the land. Most leases are isolated and only the hunters and lease holders can find them. The sign is actually a rock. I wouldn't doubt that half the good old boys who saw this rock probably snickered at what it said, including all the indignant hunters whose trips were probably paid for by Perry. I have to laugh thinking about the AA friends I wrote about earlier, they would much rather have the sign up and know not to enter a lease full of white men with guns, than have the sign obscured and be unpleasantly surprised! Makes their point perfectly!

 

[rotterdam]

ITA with your post.The choice of words are setting himself up for self defense.I felt that way since I first listened to the call.

Or trying to get LE out there more expedient. His credibility might not be that great , too much like the boy that cried wolf.

I have been meaning to ask this question referring to the snip below. What is the significance of the button. Does that make somebody more suspicious? Puzzled.

GZ: He's got a button on his shirt -- late teens

 

[vlpate]

Here's a conundrum for you. Why would a police department put this at the top of their incident report,

yet tell the suspect this?



What's that old saying? "Loose lips sink ships"?

Whose boat are they concerned about getting sunk?

Zimmerman is not considered a suspect. Why would he talk about it? I'm sure his lawyer has advised him not to talk as well. The SPD's decision is being investigated - I would imagine his attorney has advised him as well. JMO

 

[What'sThatClue]

I'm not familiar with guns. That being said, doesn't a gun have to have the safety off or be cocked in some manner prior to firing?
So wouldn't GZ have had to have the gun ready to fire? Or not?
Or is it that easy to pull a gun out and just fire it?
(sorry if it's a dumb question)

 

[rotterdam]

I'm not familiar with guns. That being said, doesn't a gun have to have the safety off or be cocked in some manner prior to firing?
So wouldn't GZ have had to have the gun ready to fire? Or not?
Or is it that easy to pull a gun out and just fire it?
(sorry if it's a dumb question)

Semi automatic with extra bullet already in the chamber. All he had to do was to aim and pull the trigger.

 

[Elley Mae]

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/04/03/nbc-issues-apology-edited-zimmerman-11-call/?test=latestnews

Following reports that NBC aired audio of the call was edited in a way that implied Zimmerman was racist, the network launched an internal investigation.

 

[Elley Mae]

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/04/04/us-usa-florida-shooting-corey-idUSBRE83306620120404

"You can't worry about consequence if you're doing the right thing," Corey said. "If you're going to commit to doing the right thing for the right reasons, consequences have to fall where they may."

 

[Reader]

Or trying to get LE out there more expedient. His credibility might not be that great , too much like the boy that cried wolf.

I have been meaning to ask this question referring to the snip below. What is the significance of the button. Does that make somebody more suspicious? Puzzled.

GZ: He's got a button on his shirt -- late teens

I don't have the link right now but his mother said it was a pin in honor of a mentor of his that died recently....very scary, right?

 

[Angels_Not_Forgotten]

17 year old boys do not have the mindset of calling 911. Especially if they are people of color. There is a culture thing going on here that people just don't get.

Thank you just wasn't enough.

Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk

 

[Angels_Not_Forgotten]

I read this response and I am confused. I understand the age causing the different mindset because the brain is not fully developed at that age, but not the color of the person causing the different mindset doesn't seem valid.

Inquisitive, trying to understand

Seriously?! I've been pulled over and searched and told the reason it happened is because there was suspicious looking people in the car. I said how am I suspicious driving my car? He said its not you I'm talking about and looked at my 2 black passengers.

Also had a friend whos home was broken into. After they FINALLY arrived to ask questions the officer actually said "doesn't pay to deal drugs does it?" The man has never been a dealer. This is just two times where I can see this mindset as valid.

Jmo and all.

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[rotterdam]

The only people who need advocates are Children!

Really. I can think of many other groups that need advocates.
The sick, the poor, the disabled, the elderly, animals etc
Advocates for peace.Advocates for human rights etc. Frankly almost everybody needs an advocate at some time in their life and some are lucky enough to find one. IMO
Advocate is also another word for a lawyer.