17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #28

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  • #921
I wonder if GZ's testimony in court this morning regarding showing prior remorse is going to gome back and haunt him? His statements were recorded and documented and if he never showed the remorse he claims he did his credibility is already out the window.
 
  • #922
That was not an apology. That was self serving yada yada yada.
 
  • #923
ITA. Weren't a whole bunch of posters here upset Zimmerman didn't say he was sorry. Well now he did and they are upset over that.

Well a good start would be not telling a lie when one finally does offers up an apology.
 
  • #924
If he was cuffed in the front then he could still use the cell phone.

Police officers are never to cuff anyone in the front of the body. There was a case many, many years ago here in Florida where suspect was cuffed in the front and he had something in his pocket (I believe it was a key??) that allowed him to take the cuffs off and he killed I believe at least two officers.

They have to be cuffed with their hands behind their back.
 
  • #925
You are not allowed to cuff people in the front --- but then again, we're talking about SPD here and they don't even use gloves when searching people?

MOO

You are not allowed to cuff people in the front?
I've never heard of that.

I've seen many people cuffed in the front many times while following cases.
 
  • #926
BBM.

This is just not true. I was the victim of assault and had my head repeatedly slammed into a hard floor. My head wounds did not bleed and, because of my long hair, the painful lumps were not visible to others.

Then you are indeed fortunate..Most do not fair so well
 
  • #927
Ok, but it appears to me that is it accurate.

IMO it is GZ's head.
IMO it is in the condition LE stated it was in when they arrived.
IMO he is wearing the same jacket. Wasn't that jacket taken as evidence?
IMO this photo was taken at the scene, he is bleeding, it is authentic.

I agree in that it appears to be one the most authentic pieces of evidence we've seen so far. I don't understand how the top of his scalp lost a rectangle of hair but I suppose it could be the flash.

JMO, OMO, and :moo:
 
  • #928
Who was GZ calling when the pic of his bleeding head was taken??
 
  • #929
BTW, how can you tell he's not cuffed in this picture?

Look at the phone at his right ear?
If you Read the article associated with the pic this picture occurred "right after" the shooting and GZ yelled to the "person" taking the picture 'call my wife" as well
 
  • #930
GZ could have apologized through his numerous friends, family and his prior "lawyers"...oh, and on his website.

Yes, he could have.. Instead he put up quotes like this:

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil, is that good men do nothing. - Edmund Burke"

That speaks volumes. Way more than his disingenous and self serving apology.
 
  • #931
IDK, Why should someone accept or feel good about an apology that has a lie in it? Or maybe my standards are too high?

They don't have too. But saying they were 'ambushed' by the apology, I don't get that. He can apology till the cows come home, they don't have to accept it.
 
  • #932
If the witness meant that he saw GSR, and was speaking of the 'burn' type marks that surround a close range entry wound, on clothing or on skin, then yes, I understand that.

Thanks
 
  • #933
Seems that way, doesn't it?

Before all the posts come sailing that the investigator said this morning that he was shot in the chest, let me ask you something. If you were told that a victim had been shot in the head, does that imply a direction of the shot? What about if shot in the leg, arm, foot, etc. Do any of those terms dictate direction of the shot?

As long as a bullet goes into the head, the victim has been shot in the head. Isn't it at least, something to consider that for whatever reason may be, the SA could be viewed as saying the bullet went into the chest cavity, albeit from behind, so therefore he was shot in the chest?

IDK, I'm just reading what the same "eyewitness" who allegedly took this newest picture has said. If TM was shot from the front, how'd this person clearly see GSR on TM as he was lying face down unless he was shot in the back?

Here's the problem, though - the story claims that photo was taken 3 minutes after the shot. The shot was between 7:16:40 and 7:17:00 (one of the timelines linked in the last thread said the 911 call with the gunshot on it began at 7:16:11, I timed the shot at 44 seconds into that call or at 7:16:55). Officer Timothy Smith said he arrived at 7:17 and almost immediately placed GZ "in custody"; Officer Ayalla said he arrived at 7:19 and GZ was already "in custody".

I would assume "in custody" includes cuffing the suspect, but in this photo, claimed to have been taken at about 7:20, GZ is NOT in cuffs - you can see his right hand holding a cell phone to his ear.

At some point after 7:19, Officer Ayalla and Sgt. Raimondo turned TM over and began CPR - could that have been when the unknown photographer noticed the GSR? Why was this person allowed close to the suspect and to the victim?:waitasec: I could go on, but it just doesn't add up!

Hinky seems mild, here. IMO, JMO, etc.
 
  • #934
But a bond hearing is an important thing. The state puts forth it's reasons for placing a million dollar bond on it's prisoner. And they are charged by the state with putting forth it's evidentiary reasons for that amount of bond. So they would send an investigator that can answer that question.

All of the investigators have the same information. They are constantly updated and clued in and cc'ed. Believe me, if they had evidence to prove that GZ swung first, this investigator would have known. AND he would be legally expected to disclose it under oath during a bond hearing. It goes to evidence of the need for the high bond.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but was it disclosed where TM was shot. There's been much speculation on the internet about the chest, back, and even the back of the head. If TM was shot in the back, I think that would have been presented at the bond hearing.

My apologies for not reading the entire thread - just trying to catch up.

Thanks,

Melanie
 
  • #935
That arm looks blue. I thought it was a black and red jacket?
ETA: NM, I see the cell phone. The fastest way this gets verified is if his cell record shows a call being made by his phone at the timestamp.

BBM Good point!! :floorlaugh: It does look blue and not black??

Who the heck knows? It still makes no sense to me that someone was that quick to take a photograph?? It had to have been before police arrived? I want to know who this person is and I want to know who George is calling because he yelled for neighbors to call 911! So he wasn't calling 911.
 
  • #936
IDK, Why should someone accept or feel good about an apology that has a lie in it? Or maybe my standards are too high?

ITA with what you say here. No emotion and contained lies! How is that an apology?
 
  • #937
All I can say is george should be thanking his lucky stars that he wasnt the one having his injuries documented by a coroner on that cold slab after making such a huge out of anger decision to follow an innocent minor who was walking home :banghead:
 
  • #938
I find it interesting that the pic was even taken.....someone was worried about proof that quick????????????

Why wouldn't they be? He just killed someone. And he saw at that point there was no other gun. He must have been very worried at that point.
 
  • #939
I see what looks like GZ using a cell phone, and on the right of that, it looks like grey clothing and a hand. Like TM laying right below GZ's feet face down, with someone snapping a pic of GZ's head obviously. jmo

ht_george_zimmerman_head_dm_120419_wmain.jpg
 
  • #940
Why would MOM say the gf name? It would serve no purpose. Based on his professionalism so far I give him the benefit of the doubt. If it were some other Orlando attorneys I would not. Not talking about RH

When you work a case, you read the statements and organize the statements of witnesses, over and over again. I have slipped in court and called a witness by their first name because that is how I organized their statements or my cross or direct of them, for example. It's easy to let a name slip out that you don't want to, when you are so immersed in the case.

I did not see the bond hearing. Did O'Mara seem smarmy? Sleazy? Arrogant? So far, he has not seemed that way to me and he has a good reputation. Neither Hornsby nor Nejame liked Baez but they both like O'Mara. So unless he seemed like a jerk at the hearing, I must give him the benefit of the doubt.

OMG! GZ saying he didn't know if he was armed or not. Wow!

Version 6.0.

First of all there was only one minor laceration..the other was a puncture wound. head bashing creates surrounding tissue damages..not just what I saw in those pictures..

Take it or leave it..but I have dealt with Head bashings..and never ever saw such minor boo boo's as in that picture. In fact I have seen worse damages in anyone who had a trip and fall, or slip and fall knocking into something..like a tree or a hard cornered object :bump:
Bumping.

Bond granted, 150,000

Little surprised it's that low.

I'm not. I knew he would make bond. I thought the judge would have to make it high enough to not seem like a joke but low enough that Zimmerman could find a way to be released. He will be released quickly, IMO.


The initial police report said clearly GZ was bleeding from his nose and back of his head.

The marks on the new picture line up with the marks some see on the police video.

There are medical records backing up the claim that GZ's nose was broken.

IMO its clear he was getting his arse whooped when he pulled that trigger.

I say GZ was acting in self defense and it is my opinion, as of now, there will be no 2nd degree murder conviction.
IMO there is no way 12 jurors will find him guilty.

JMO

BBM. I don't think that's clear at all. Rapists and murderers often have wounds from their victims or from the struggle. If that photo is accurate and I have no reason not to believe it isn't accurate, at this time, then Zimmerman had minor wounds to the back of his head.

I believe TM was clearly the aggressor as evidenced by the injuries to GZ's nose and head. He seems to have escalated the situation.

People who are attacked often fight back. Wounds on Zimmerman do not prove who was the aggressor here. But, I think logic does.

There is NOTHING official that hints that Trayvon was an aggressive person. The statement of his girlfriend and the call to LE by Zimmerman indicate Zimmerman pursued a scared teenager and confronted him.

Zimmerman's background suggests he has a propensity for aggression, not the kid he followed.

If a strange man followed me at night, then got out of his car and confronted me, you better believe I would fight back if he put his hands on me, which is exactly what I think happened here. Zimmerman is the one who said these "a$$holes" always get away, while chasing the kid. Trayvon did not get away.

I think injuries would be significant in proving to a jury that at some point, Zimmerman was in fear for his life and pulled the trigger. That would depend on the severity of the injuries and may make the difference as to whether the jury chooses second degree, manslaughter or acquittal. The greater the injuries, the better chance Zimmerman has of getting off.

So far, I'm not impressed. Nothing suggests to me that Zimmerman was getting his tail whooped or was defensively warding off an unprovoked attack from some kid he was following, a kid not involved in any crime, not walking with a band of other kids looking for trouble, etc.

Regardless of my personal feelings, though, I have thought from the beginning that there would be a good chance Zimmerman would walk, or at the most, get a manslaughter charge and spend very little time in county lock up.

Many people have racial biases. Many people feel fear or intimidated, as a result, when they see a black young man, regardless of the circumstances. Many people assume blacks are more aggressive, naturally. Some of those people will be on the jury. The state will have to have a lot in order to get any charges to stick, IMO. Black victims just don't see justice as easily as others.
 
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