2009.08.07 Emails between Oak Ridge and OCSO

[momtective]

Momtective,

Thanks for providing the precip totals. Looks like it rained every day except one since the last day Caylee was seen until the likely dump date. Would definitely have been a muddy mess.

Yep, of the 30 day period from June 15-July15 there were only 5 days that it did not rain. The only day it didn't rain in those last 2 weeks in June was the 17th. In July it didn't rain on the 2nd,3rd,9th, & 10th.
My $$ is on KC's shoes/boots and pants being tossed in the trunk...or at the very least the shoes/boots.

 

[Jolynna]

I looked at Arm and Hammers webpage to see if I could find an ingredient list, to no avail. Im not sure if the product in question was even Arm and Hammer, but that stuck in my head from somewhere?... If you could provide me the actual product that was used, I will get the ingredient list no problem. ( as a go green mama, I frequently torture cleaning product manufacturers with unending questions about their ingredients)... We have some special respiratory concerns with 2 of our kiddos, and I have to make certain that the products we choose won't interfere with their limitations. We use greenworks, and simple green, when good old fashioned white vinegar wont do the job. We try to keep it as basic as we can around here. I'll see what I can find out for you

It was Arm and Hammer. There is a picture of it here (last part of the slideshow) http://www.wesh.com/slideshow/news/20316093/detail.html There is also a picture of the plastic bottle with brown liquid.

 

[coco puff]

respecfully snipped and bolded by me.

While I have nothing but the utmost confidence in the State's CSI's on the testing in this case, I am worried that the defense is going to try and use things like these emails to try and show that the State basically did not know what they were doing when they collected these air samples. This would contribute to their "junk science" claim by highlighting that the CSI (Vincent) collecting these air samples really didn't know what he was doing...and to be perfectly honest, he did seem to be a little unprepared to do this task: "When I do a sample with one TST what do I do if anything, to block off the second hose line?", for example. The defense could argue that the air samples were compromised in some way due to his obvious inexperience dealing with this type of testing. And I don't know his scope of work, but I was surprised to read that he didn't know what LIBS and VFA's stood for. I'm just a typical person with no real education on this type of thing at all (other than the stuff I've learned here at my beloved Websleuths :blowkiss but even I knew what those acronyms stood for :waitasec:.

Snipped.

The good news is that the car and the odor are still intacked. Even if they challenge the collection and analysis process, there can be do-overs. That smell is not going anywhere, ever. No matter how many delay's the defense has in mind. State's exhibit A will forever smell like there has been a dead body in the damn car.

 

[momtective]

It was Arm and Hammer. There is a picture of it here (last part of the slideshow) http://www.wesh.com/slideshow/news/20316093/detail.html There is also a picture of the plastic bottle with brown liquid.

It's Arm and Hammer laundry detergent.

Ingredients
Arm & Hammer laundry detergent is gentle on clothes in more ways than one. It contains colour safe bleach, so that you can remove even the most stubborn of stains without having to worry about colours running and fabrics being ruined. The ingredients in Arm & Hammer laundry detergent include anionic and non-ionic surfactants, Arm & Hammer baking soda, water softener, soil anti-redeposition agent and other ingredients designed to target tough stains.
http://www.associatedcontent.com/ar...view_arm_hammer_laundry_detergent.html?cat=46

 

[Tracey276]

Evidence from KC's trunk pointing to something dead:

1. Decomposition smell
2. the hair
3. "coffin flies"
4. adipocere-like substance on toweling (consistent with human or pig decomposition.
5. The stain

There was NO meat found in the trash. Yet something that smelled ripe was drawing coffin flies. They had burrowed between the crevices of KC's trunk and were all over the substance on the paper toweling. http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c341/jazlynsmum1/papertowelanalyis.png

Casey's shoes or pants could have transferred the plant pollen from where Caylee's body was found to KC's car trunk. Too bad Cindy washed the pants.

Respectfully bolded by me above. I find this to not be just a coincidence, that CA washed the pants. Put all she suspected/possibly knew at the time, IMO, CA washed the pants to absolutely get rid of any evidence that could implicate KC in something nefarious.

 

[Brini]

It's Arm and Hammer laundry detergent.

Ingredients
Arm & Hammer laundry detergent is gentle on clothes in more ways than one. It contains colour safe bleach, so that you can remove even the most stubborn of stains without having to worry about colours running and fabrics being ruined. The ingredients in Arm & Hammer laundry detergent include anionic and non-ionic surfactants, Arm & Hammer baking soda, water softener, soil anti-redeposition agent and other ingredients designed to target tough stains.
http://www.associatedcontent.com/ar...view_arm_hammer_laundry_detergent.html?cat=46

Yep! Arm and Hammer will destroy DNA. Nothing will get rid of decomp.

 

[3doglady]

It was Arm and Hammer. There is a picture of it here (last part of the slideshow) http://www.wesh.com/slideshow/news/20316093/detail.html There is also a picture of the plastic bottle with brown liquid.

Is the cleaner in the white spray bottle Arm & Hammer also? I tried to enlarge it but still can not read it.

 

[Brini]

I looked at Arm and Hammers webpage to see if I could find an ingredient list, to no avail. Im not sure if the product in question was even Arm and Hammer, but that stuck in my head from somewhere?... If you could provide me the actual product that was used, I will get the ingredient list no problem. ( as a go green mama, I frequently torture cleaning product manufacturers with unending questions about their ingredients)... We have some special respiratory concerns with 2 of our kiddos, and I have to make certain that the products we choose won't interfere with their limitations. We use greenworks, and simple green, when good old fashioned white vinegar wont do the job. We try to keep it as basic as we can around here. I'll see what I can find out for you

Thanks for the alt. product mention!

I have to use vineger water around my pets. To clean huge slabs of plexiglas.

 

[Mendara]

[/B]

Respectfully bolded by me above. I find this to not be just a coincidence, that CA washed the pants. Put all she suspected/possibly knew at the time, IMO, CA washed the pants to absolutely get rid of any evidence that could implicate KC in something nefarious.

I have always thought this. She smelled the car and knew it was the smell of death, her daughter was alive and she was lying to police and caylee was gone. The last thing on her mind was house cleaning and laundry - she saw the pants and I bet they were covered in something awful and she washed them! On purpose and planned to claim ignorance. It looked bad for Casey and CA hates looking bad. This still infuriates ME!

 

[magiemay]

Yep, of the 30 day period from June 15-July15 there were only 5 days that it did not rain. The only day it didn't rain in those last 2 weeks in June was the 17th. In July it didn't rain on the 2nd,3rd,9th, & 10th.
My $$ is on KC's shoes/boots and pants being tossed in the trunk...or at the very least the shoes/boots.

does anyone remember what day KC called the weather service on her cell phone?? Just wondering if she maybe called to see if it would be a good day to dispose of the body?

 

[john's mom]

I asked a recent Veterinary School Grad if she had use for or access to chloroform.
Her answer was NO!

 

[sarah7855]

I thought the Body Farm in Oakridge TN did the air sample testings.

Reading the emails, it sounds like the samples were collected by CSI Vincent (and from a couple emails that I included in my original post, sounds like he wasn't quite sure of the collection procedure), and sent to Oakridge for the actual testing; ie: analyzing the compounds in the GC/MS and producing the report. So, if something was off in the collection process, then the results and report would be off, too. I had always thought that the samples were collected and analyzed by the Body Farm, looks like that's not the case.

I'd like to clarify that I don't think that the CSI or Body Farm was wrong in any way, just that I hope and pray that those emails aren't snapped up by the defense to bolster their "junk science" theory.

 

[Jolynna]

Is the cleaner in the white spray bottle Arm & Hammer also? I tried to enlarge it but still can not read it.

The other cleaner stuff is sneaker cleaner. Tony said Clint H. left it at his apartment and that when Clint left it, it wasn't empty.

Tony said the Arm and Hammer was what he normally used. It would be usual then for Arm & Hammer detergent to be in Tony's trash and not necessarily something KC would get specifically to clean up body fluid.

Tony and LE talk about the trash on page 45, http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFiles/Lazaro%20%20Tony.090808.pdf.

"Arm and Hammer is something I use"-- Tony
​

 

[AZlawyer]

does anyone remember what day KC called the weather service on her cell phone?? Just wondering if she maybe called to see if it would be a good day to dispose of the body?

6/27/08 around 8:30 pm, about 9 hours (IIRC) after she left the car at Amscot.

 

[sarah7855]

does anyone remember what day KC called the weather service on her cell phone?? Just wondering if she maybe called to see if it would be a good day to dispose of the body?

Could have been, however, I'm in Orlando too, and have had that # programmed into my cell for probably 10 years now, it's been around that long. And embarrassingly enough, I've dialed that number when I am trying to avoid a person (to look like I am on a call) or for like reasons. LOL, my secret is out! Casey could have been calling to check the weather, but it could have also been a benign call just like mine. The time and pings would probably help us figure out better. Also, it just tells you the current temp and generic weather conditions: "winter park weather, partly cloudy with a chance of rain, high of 95, low of 82" etc. Nothing detailed. So I would think that if she really wanted to know the weather forecast, she'd look online if she had access.

And honestly, it rains every darn day here in the summer, like has been said. So that leads me to believe even more that the call was just for some other random reason.

 

[Jolynna]

6/27/08 around 8:30 pm, about 9 hours (IIRC) after she left the car at Amscot.

She wanted to know if she'd need to bring an umbrella to keep her whites white for "white night" at Fusian.

 

[sarah7855]

6/27/08 around 8:30 pm, about 9 hours (IIRC) after she left the car at Amscot.

Now I think it was random even more. The recording is made in the morning, and it stays there all day. So calling at 8:30PM for weather conditions for a day that's already passed makes no sense.

 

[AZlawyer]

Now I think it was random even more. The recording is made in the morning, and it stays there all day. So calling at 8:30PM for weather conditions for a day that's already passed makes no sense.

So the recording doesn't provide a forecast?

 

[sarah7855]

So the recording doesn't provide a forecast?

Not for any further out than the day you are calling. Recording is made every morning, early on.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

Evidence from KC's trunk pointing to something dead:

1. Decomposition smell
2. the hair
3. "coffin flies"
4. adipocere-like substance on toweling (consistent with human or pig decomposition.
5. The stain

There was NO meat found in the trash. Yet something that smelled ripe was drawing coffin flies. They had burrowed between the crevices of KC's trunk and were all over the substance on the paper toweling. http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c341/jazlynsmum1/papertowelanalyis.png

Casey's shoes or pants could have transferred the plant pollen from where Caylee's body was found to KC's car trunk. Too bad Cindy washed the pants.

Too bad Cindy exclaimed out loud into a media mic something like - the odor was caused by a piece of pizza that had been sitting in the trunk of the car for how many days? - Do you know how hot it gets in Florida?

Too bad Cindy said the above AFTER she was the one who made a 911 call and said with alarm in her voice that - It smells like there has been a dead body in the car.

Too bad Cindy says what ever she feels like saying whenever she feels like saying it.

Too bad Cindy can't keep her mouth shut and caused all kinds of mistruths that caused confusion and problems for the investigators.

Or, on second thought, good thing Cindy said/did all of the above because we all know now that her word is worth squat and we cannot believe a word she says. Do you swear to tell the truth and nothing but the truth so help you God Cindy? How are you going to answer that one Cindy? Remember you are freshly cleansed of your sins Cindy - keep that in mind when you sit in that chair for all the world to hear your testimony. God is not mocked Cindy.