2010.07.15 What I saw at the Hearing

[sleutherontheside]

Laptops are allowed in the courtroom but must operate on battery. I'm not sure what the mistrial comment is. This was a pretrial hearing not the trial. Maybe I am confused.

 

[McSev]

I thought long and hard about posting my feelings, but you will either agree or disagree with me, and that is ok.

I was at the hearing. Afterwards my friend and I were about 20 feet ahead of George and Cindy as they headed towards the parking garage surrounded by a horde of cameras and reporters. As I got in my car, I noticed George, Cindy and another couple come out of the elevators into the parking garage. They stopped and the other woman hugged Cindy who was obviously crying. Both George and Cindy looked worn, weary and defeated.

As to Cindy's statement that she believes Caylee is still alive. You could hear the collective intake of breath in the courtroom when she made that statment. Does she really believe it or is it just a futile attempt by a grandmother to deny the reality of the death of her grandchild? I don't know, but the thought of Cindy spending the rest of her life looking into the eyes of every brown haired, hazel eyed child/girl/young woman she sees(depending how how old Caylee would have been at the time) and wondering 'could you be my granddaughter Caylee'? is just heartbreaking to me. If she does believe what she said, she is creating a H*ll for herself that she will never be able to break free of. I know what she has and hasn't done, has and hasn't said and I understand why people are angry with her. The devastated woman I saw in the parking garage this afternoon has my compassion. Because regardless of anything else, she lost her granddaughter whom she loved.

I have to say that this is one of the fairest and most kind observations of this grandmother I've seen yet. Props to you for having the fortitude to post it, even though there are those of us (me, for example) who have challenges with this lady because of our perception of her moral and ethical choices about the reality of her daughter's deceptions.

That said, I did hear her on the stand today and I do believe that there's a dawning reality that this situation is neither one she can control or can escape: there's too much LE and the SA have "in writing" and "on video" and "in transcipts" that she won't be able to avoid, and her testimony and cross examinations from here on out will be in a courtroom, official and somewhat intimidating, on the record and * in front of* her daughter. This isn't the court of public opinion and tv reporters and limos: this is the real deal.

 

[sleutherontheside]

Regarding the phone and texting issues.......

(18) Failing to turn off cell phone. If your phone is on or rings it is subject to
seizure, inspection and forfeiture.

http://www.ninthcircuit.org/judges/county_judges/orange/downloads/JudgeJordan/Div70CountyCivilGuidelinesProcedures.pdf

While this isn't specific to Judge Perry it is based upon OC Courthouse policy and was revised as of 12/09.

 

[spqr]

Laptops are allowed in the courtroom but must operate on battery. I'm not sure what the mistrial comment is. This was a pretrial hearing not the trial. Maybe I am confused.

Double check, but at the beginning of the hearing...JB's assistant (that was at the last hearing) was sitting directly behind JB. He opened a white laptop/notebook on the FLOOR facing the Bench/defense table. A female then passed him a power cord to power it. Then the camera moved and I lost sight. Anyone else catch this?

 

[littlemisslegal]

i too sat in my car and saw them get out of elevator 3rd floor. i was trying to get my cell phone charged and put on seat belt. only a few cars were left in parking garge. i seen what you saw . tired, exhausted, heart wrenching people leaving a courtroom . so sad for all - no matter who tells the story - caylee is gone.

 

[littlemisslegal]

Double check, but at the beginning of the hearing...JB's assistant (that was at the last hearing) was sitting directly behind JB. He opened a white laptop/notebook on the FLOOR facing the Bench/defense table. A female then passed him a power cord to power it. Then the camera moved and I lost sight. Anyone else catch this?

before hearing started news media was told go to balcony if they need power for lap tops. lots were up stairs. they were told no power lower level

 

[CentralFLMama]

Clearly they dont enforce that. No one's phone rang, that I heard, but I counted at least 3 per row that were out and being used for texting, etc.

 

[Whome?]

It amazes me that anyone would be admitted into a court room with electronic devices period. In my neck of the woods, even if you are reporting for jury duty, you have to go through a metal detector, and surrender cell phones, ipods, etc. I sure like the Sunshine Law, but maybe Florida has a long way to go regarding restriction of communication devices in the court room.

Who is to say that someone can't eavesdrop on the judges chamber, or even get details of sidebar convos with proper equipment? Wouldn't that make a huge mess during the trial!

ITA they have the same procedure
where I live,you'd never get in a court
room with a cellphone etc. All attys
NEVER have cell phones I-pods etc
out in court. HHJB better get them on
the ball in his court room. Maybe he
is being a little lenient now,but will
crack the whip during the actual
trial. JMHO
:thewhip: :whip2:

 

[littlemisslegal]

Clearly they dont enforce that. No one's phone rang, that I heard, but I counted at least 3 per row that were out and being used for texting, etc.

ashtons phone powered off when he entered courtrom and sat down- that sound of off tone.

 

[beach]

Regarding the phone and texting issues.......

(18) Failing to turn off cell phone. If your phone is on or rings it is subject to
seizure, inspection and forfeiture.

http://www.ninthcircuit.org/judges/...rdan/Div70CountyCivilGuidelinesProcedures.pdf

While this isn't specific to Judge Perry it is based upon OC Courthouse policy and was revised as of 12/09.

Seizure. That is precisely what happens in almost every courtroom I have worked in - the bailiff seizes the cell phone. It is returned after court is adjourned.

I cannot get over all the cell phones in Orlando courtrooms. Even the attorneys sitting at counsel tables...Blows.My.Mind.

I gotta say, that is the one thing that has surprised me about HHJP - that he hasn't :gavel: about that issue. I would've thought no one would dare have a cell phone out in the open in his courtroom, especially the attorneys!

 

[WholeLottaRosie]

Regarding the phone and texting issues.......

(18) Failing to turn off cell phone. If your phone is on or rings it is subject to
seizure, inspection and forfeiture.

http://www.ninthcircuit.org/judges/county_judges/orange/downloads/JudgeJordan/Div70CountyCivilGuidelinesProcedures.pdf

While this isn't specific to Judge Perry it is based upon OC Courthouse policy and was revised as of 12/09.

So I wonder why this isn't enforced. And the comments about security and listening in on testimony and sidebars is a concern. Since the court doesn't seem to care, maybe someone should email KB a link to this thread. Might spark her doing a report.

 

[mitzi]

I was also at the hearing today for the full time. (Yep, cost me $12 for parking, too!). What I saw before court was that George exited the elevator on the courtroom’s floor- alone. Cindy arrived later. During the proceedings, I sat directly behind the A’s and saw very little interaction. However, there was some small whispering at the beginning between the family members. Even though I was so close, unfortunately, I could not make out anything that they actually did whisper.
I think the most striking thing to me was after Cindy returned to the gallery after her testimony, Mallory put her arm around Cindy and gave her a large cheek kiss, and spent time patting her on the back. Which says to me that there isn’t a distance between Lee and the parents.

Bold mine.

I guess Mallory in her "little girl short shorts" and flippie flops has taken the place of KC and Caylee with Cindy. Looks like Mallory's been sippin' at the old koolaid stand. Could be that finally Mallory is holding #1 position with CA. She might be glad KC is going down.

The whole darn lot of 'em sicken me. :sick:

Thanks to all for your bird's eye views of the hearing.

 

[sleutherontheside]

Double check, but at the beginning of the hearing...JB's assistant (that was at the last hearing) was sitting directly behind JB. He opened a white laptop/notebook on the FLOOR facing the Bench/defense table. A female then passed him a power cord to power it. Then the camera moved and I lost sight. Anyone else catch this?

I should have been more specific. Laptops or computers brought in by people in the "gallery" must be on battery. Attorney's would be allowed power source. I was referring to the concern about wireless being allowed and a mistrial.........that laptops are NOT prohibited.

An aside....in order to access the wireless there (ninthpublic is the link) users must agree to a wireless internet policy. I can't pull it up since I am not there but I feel certain that there are protections in place.

Additionally wireless networks can lock out or at least monitor unauthorized "linking in".

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Ditto. The family dynamic, the body language, the letters, everything is pointing to (IMO) they think George betrayed KC, family, etc., because he was (I'm guessing) honest at Grand Jury testamony.

.....I'm thinking they're not happy with him about the letter he sent Casey about the molestation allegations...this got a lot of media attention (for the obvious reason) and he sent it knowing it would come out IMO, and it ruined Casey's chance of using these allegations during mitigation.

I'm thinking the rest of the family would be willing to sacrifice their public image to save Casey from the death penalty, but George showed that he is not in that letter, and I'm wondering if the rest of them resent him for it.

 

[gibby207]

I have to say that this is one of the fairest and most kind observations of this grandmother I've seen yet. Props to you for having the fortitude to post it, even though there are those of us (me, for example) who have challenges with this lady because of our perception of her moral and ethical choices about the reality of her daughter's deceptions.

That said, I did hear her on the stand today and I do believe that there's a dawning reality that this situation is neither one she can control or can escape: there's too much LE and the SA have "in writing" and "on video" and "in transcipts" that she won't be able to avoid, and her testimony and cross examinations from here on out will be in a courtroom, official and somewhat intimidating, on the record and * in front of* her daughter. This isn't the court of public opinion and tv reporters and limos: this is the real deal.

Yes... and she sees it, she knows it, she feels it. She was broken today, but did it. Props to her. She doesn't want to, because she wants to protect her daughter, and I get that. My issue lies in how my own mother would react, and she'd hate me, spit daggers, prolly kill me herself if I were in KC's shoes. lol My reality is my mom; KC's and Caylee's reality is Cindy.

 

[john's mom]

However, I caught moments where he was smiling broadly and even laughing with Conway - and George had a wide smile for media guy Jim L. as they were leaving.
George is still allowing himself to be the fall guy - for example how the Defense kept trying to get Cindy and Debbie P. to say that GEORGE is the one who planted the "smells like a dead body" into Cindy's mind, and that's why she said that. Cindy and George had to know in advance that the Defense was going to push that theory today in court - and George allowed it.
George allowed his Inmate daughter to draw comfort from the fact that he was there today.

BBM: Does anyone remember George saying early on that he told Cindy it was the pizzaand garbage that smelled? He didn't want to tell her it was decomp. I'm sure he didn't say it smells like a dead body on that very first day. He was praying it wasn't his Caylee and also trying to protect Cindy from freaking out.

 

[Gnatcatcher]

BBM Thank you for posting this, Macushla. That is precisely what I did at home in front of my PC as I heard Cindy say that. You've confirmed my exact reaction and gut feeling. Thank you!

For some reason, this is the only comment I seem to have missed. Does anyone know of a specific mark or link with just Cindy saying that she thought Caylee was still alive? I don't know how I missed that. When exactly did she say that?

 

[gibby207]

.....I'm thinking they're not happy with him about the letter he sent Casey about the molestation allegations...this got a lot of media attention (for the obvious reason) and he sent it knowing it would come out IMO, and it ruined Casey's chance of using these allegations during mitigation.

I'm thinking the rest of the family would be willing to sacrifice their public image to save Casey from the death penalty, but George showed that he is not in that letter, and I'm wondering if the rest of them resent him for it.

Yes. I agree. I'm a poster of the Caylee thread "back in the day". I don't post a lot now as it's usually rehashing, but this day... this was one for the books, and to see the changes in them and analyze and think. George is the odd man out, to me, IMO. I think they already resent him for it.

 

[beach]

For some reason, this is the only comment I seem to have missed. Does anyone know of a specific mark or link with just Cindy saying that she thought Caylee was still alive? I don't know how I missed that. When exactly did she say that?

It was toward the very end of her testimony. IIRC, it was on cross by LDB.


ETA: Correction: it was at the end of Baez's re-direct, according to a news article in Today's News thread.

 

[gibby207]

For some reason, this is the only comment I seem to have missed. Does anyone know of a specific mark or link with just Cindy saying that she thought Caylee was still alive? I don't know how I missed that. When exactly did she say that?

IIRC, it was near the end of her redirect by Baez (or Linda)... Don't quote me, and of the 4 hours of court, I don't have the exact time.. Sorry!!