2010.07.19 Defense is Investigating George

[Whome?]

http://www.wesh.com/caseyanthony/24328486/detail.html
George Anthony's attorney, Brad Conway, said mitigation evidence would involve events that lead up to Caylee's death.
"They're going to have to prove the relevancy of a suicide attempt after the fact," Conway said.

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/en...nvestigating-george.html?wpmp_switcher=mobile

Jose Baez told WESH’s Bob Kealing that Casey’s defense team is “obligated to investigate everything.” But Kealing said when he asked if the defense is investigating Cindy and Lee Anthony, Baez didn’t answer.
Mitigation would involve evidence leading up to Caylee’s death, Brad Conway, George Anthony’s attorney, told WESH. Conway questioned why George’s suicide attempt, which came after Caylee’s death, would be relevant.
Conway didn’t sound surprised by the news about the defense team investigating George. “I expected they would investigate George just like any other witness,” Conway told WESH.

But Jeff Dowdy, an attorney with death penalty experience, told WESH that he questioned the defense’s contention that George Anthony was being investigated just for the mitigation phase. “That just doesn’t make any sense,” Dowdy said.
Instead, Dowdy speculated that the defense will treat George Anthony as a hostile witness because his testimony is valuable to the prosecution.

RUN George RUNNNNNNNNNN !!!!!

Get to Richard Hornsby as fast as you can

:Bicicleta: :run: :run: :run:

 

[RedSox Mom]

According to this article:

http://www.wesh.com/caseyanthony/24328486/detail.html

George Anthony's attorney, Brad Conway, said mitigation evidence would involve events that lead up to Caylee's death.


"They're going to have to prove the relevancy of a suicide attempt after the fact," Conway said


So if I am reading this correctly and Brad is quoted correctly, then it seems like Baez is wrong in thinking this is a mitigating factor. It would be interesting to hear from a lawyer on whether Baez is wrong, Baez is covering for the bus he's looking for, or whether it could be used as mitigating.

I can see George getting up there and saying "You must save my daughter or I won't be able to survive. If you can't do it for her, do it for me and my family", but that wouldn't be used in the mitigation phase, I don't think.

Thoughts?

This post has nothing to do with molestation, but everything to do with the suicide attempt.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

http://www.wesh.com/download/2008/1126/18155354.pdf

ORANGE COUNTY SHERIFF’S OFFICE INVESTIGATIVE REPORT
CASE NUMBER 07-074777

pg. 48 of 50

Jesse talking to police – Corporal Yuri Melich, Corporal Eric Edwards

Jesse also mentioned that in September of 2005, Casey had told him she didn’t feel comfortable around her brother Lee. Casey allegedly told him that before this day, Lee had tried to have sex with her. Jesse didn’t ask her to elaborate, but from the context of the conversation, he believed that Casey meant Lee had tried to pressure Casey into having sexual intercourse with her (refer to transcript pages 4-5).

Thank you. I suppose that's why they ran a paternity test on Lee outruling him as Caylee's father. They released the results and they were negative.

If KC told Jesse that 'Lee tried to have sex with her', why does he follow by saying by the content of the conversation ..... ?
How could one say it any clearer than 'Lee tried to have sex with me.' ? :waitasec:

 

[Snaz]

Snaz, I hate to say this, but as someone who has this kind of abuse in their family (and many many of us do, and never speak of it)... this is the kind of statement that can be seen as a double-edged sword.

I'm sorry for the confusion, but I actually meant that George loved CAYLEE in the only way he knows how to love...not KC.... if that's what you are thinking I meant.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

She should have been disciplined YEARS ago- they were too cowardly to do the tough love thing with Casey, it was always whatever would keep the peace...and as result she felt nothing but absolute contempt for them both, but particularly for CA.... GA was impotent with CA undermining anything he ever tried to do to control her. If they couldn't discipline/control her they should have let the Legal system do it for them. Their enabling has cost Caylee her life.

I don't believe that any amount of discipline or tough love could have veered Casey from her psychopathic course, in fact any attempt to 'fix' a psychopath only makes them more cunning, more dangerous, and puts you firmly in the line of fire. However, if they had faced the truth of what she was, instead of trying to pretend to the rest of the world that everything was just peachy in Anthonyland, they could have protected themselves from her, and more importantly they could have protected the most vulnerable, and most precious family member from her, and Caylee would be alive today.

The only thing you can do when faced with a psychopath is cut all ties, no therapist in the world can help, and the only way the legal system can help is after the fact. Even if Casey had been arrested and charged earlier with her fraud and credit card crimes she would have been free within a very short period of time. As long as she had access to Caylee that child was in mortal danger, and unfortunately the family did not / would not recognise this and take the steps to protect her.

http://bub.typepad.com/idea_froth/2007/08/guarding-agains.html

 

[impatientredhead]

According to this article:

http://www.wesh.com/caseyanthony/24328486/detail.html

George Anthony's attorney, Brad Conway, said mitigation evidence would involve events that lead up to Caylee's death.


"They're going to have to prove the relevancy of a suicide attempt after the fact," Conway said


So if I am reading this correctly and Brad is quoted correctly, then it seems like Baez is wrong in thinking this is a mitigating factor. It would be interesting to hear from a lawyer on whether Baez is wrong, Baez is covering for the bus he's looking for, or whether it could be used as mitigating.

I can see George getting up there and saying "You must save my daughter or I won't be able to survive. If you can't do it for her, do it for me and my family", but that wouldn't be used in the mitigation phase, I don't think.

Thoughts?

This post has nothing to do with molestation, but everything to do with the suicide attempt.

http://www.law.fsu.edu/journals/lawreview/downloads/264/king.pdf
This covers the topic somewhat.

I would keep in mind that 99% of the people on death row had someone, a mother-father-spouse-child, that begged a jury not to execute them. It will probably be heard during the defense presentation but I don't think any of the Anthony clan will be the most compelling subjects for the jury to base their decision on.

 

[Eidetic]

Actually ~ I did when it was happening to me.
I even went as far as sleeping with my clothes on finally, and when my mother caught me doing that, she raised the roof.
I was afraid at the time to tell her ~
When I did finally break down she did nothing to protect or correct the situation other than confronting my step father.
He denied it, and it was case closed ~ though he did stop his attempts then.

My mother reacted similarly. Once I got up the courage to tell (I was 9 it was the 16 year old son of her best friend) she did nothing. Did not talk to me about it, did not tell me it wasn't my fault, didn't hug me, ask me if I was alright, get me help if she felt too overwhelmed to take it on herself... nothing. She even had the nerve to ask me to go to the losers wedding when I was around 19-20 :furious:

My father didn't even know about it until I was around 15 begging him to let me live with him instead of her when they finally divorced. He raised hell.

I've been contemplating writing her a letter with every nasty word and image I remember and have had to deal with on my own, but it probably still wouldn't affect her. And that will be my reason when she asks me why she isn't more involved with mine and my future children's lives when the time comes. The time will come because she can't keep her mouth shut when it comes to her own feelings, she wants everyone to feel sorry for her crappy relationships she has with her 5 children when she has no one to blame but herself for failing us.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7wGtfwfRIU"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7wGtfwfRIU[/ame]


Sorry for the OT and hijacking George's thread!

 

[Dear Prudence]

What got me was in his bill the PI put down that he was canvassing the area. For what????? Canvassing area sounds like a justification for billing extra hours. GA got a motel room and shut the door, what in the world is there to cavass. And those police reports, you mean JB could not have requested them at a cost much less than the PI???? Oh, of course, JB is busy with depos....... jmo

This is just my opinion, but I wonder if the PI was at the motel room to find out if George was really alone the whole time he was there. River did say that GA called her from the motel, IIRC. What we don't know is if that's true at all or if it's the whole truth. I'm sure the defense is aware of her allegations and might entertain the idea of using her to discredit George.

As far as canvassing around the motel the PI could possibly be looking to see if certain illegal activities are common for the area, again in order to discredit George.

If Baez is just looking to use the suicide attempt for sympathy I can't understand what they would find out by talking to the motel people.

 

[Eidetic]

http://www.wesh.com/download/2008/1126/18155354.pdf

ORANGE COUNTY SHERIFF’S OFFICE INVESTIGATIVE REPORT
CASE NUMBER 07-074777

pg. 48 of 50

Jesse talking to police – Corporal Yuri Melich, Corporal Eric Edwards

Jesse also mentioned that in September of 2005, Casey had told him she didn’t feel comfortable around her brother Lee. Casey allegedly told him that before this day, Lee had tried to have sex with her. Jesse didn’t ask her to elaborate, but from the context of the conversation, he believed that Casey meant Lee had tried to pressure Casey into having sexual intercourse with her (refer to transcript pages 4-5).

How do we go from outright sexual advances/pressure in 2005 to boobies and flashlights along with threats that she claimed stopped the incidents in 2008?

Her own stories to two different people at two different times aren't adding up.

 

[Horace Finklestein]

I really, REALLY resent the "reasoning" they seem to be trying to employ here. Even if she was molested...so what? Lots of people are molested and they don't end up murdering their child. Plus, you'd think genius pioneer Lyon would be working with them on this since it's basically a ploy for pity/mitigation.

 

[whiteangora]

I really, REALLY resent the "reasoning" they seem to be trying to employ here. Even if she was molested...so what? Lots of people are molested and they don't end up murdering their child. Plus, you'd think genius pioneer Lyon would be working with them on this since it's basically a ploy for pity/mitigation.

Speaking of A Lyon, I was just peeking at another forum and the subject of J Barrett, the mitigation specialist from DePaul was being discussed. Do y'all think J Barrett is gone now too since AL left the case?

 

[ThinkTank]

Speaking of A Lyon, I was just peeking at another forum and the subject of J Barrett, the mitigation specialist from DePaul was being discussed. Do y'all think J Barrett is gone now too since AL left the case?

I think maybe she is gone.
We have not seen any invoices for payment submitted to the JAC for her work though.

 

[Dear Prudence]

This was posted on the Today's Current News thread (ty nums :wave

Casey Anthony: Why is the defense investigating George?

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/en...nvestigating-george.html?wpmp_switcher=mobile

<snipped>

But Kealing said when he asked if the defense is investigating Cindy and Lee Anthony, Baez didn’t answer.

But Jeff Dowdy, an attorney with death penalty experience, told WESH that he questioned the defense’s contention that George Anthony was being investigated just for the mitigation phase. “That just doesn’t make any sense,” Dowdy said.

Instead, Dowdy speculated that the defense will treat George Anthony as a hostile witness because his testimony is valuable to the prosecution.

I agree that it doen't make sense that the defense would investigate George just for mitigation. What's to investigate? Just talk to George.

 

[beach]

Attorney Brad Conway and Attorney Jeff Dowdy (with DP experience) both say that JB's excuse for mitigation makes NO SENSE.
And I assert that one does not have to be an attorney to figure out that what JB is saying does not make sense.

Of course it doesn't make sense. If this was about ONLY mitigating factors, there would be NO NEED FOR AN INVESTIGATION!

Sorry, I'm not shouting at you, Think! This silly excuse is making me crazy! :banghead:


George is not going to try to DENY that there was ever a suicide attempt. There would be no need to investigate ANYTHING, if it really was ONLY about mitigating factors. This is about creating reasonable doubt, imo.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

My mother reacted similarly. Once I got up the courage to tell (I was 9 it was the 16 year old son of her best friend) she did nothing. Did not talk to me about it, did not tell me it wasn't my fault, didn't hug me, ask me if I was alright, get me help if she felt too overwhelmed to take it on herself... nothing. She even had the nerve to ask me to go to the losers wedding when I was around 19-20 :furious:

My father didn't even know about it until I was around 15 begging him to let me live with him instead of her when they finally divorced. He raised hell.

I've been contemplating writing her a letter with every nasty word and image I remember and have had to deal with on my own, but it probably still wouldn't affect her. And that will be my reason when she asks me why she isn't more involved with mine and my future children's lives when the time comes. The time will come because she can't keep her mouth shut when it comes to her own feelings, she wants everyone to feel sorry for her crappy relationships she has with her 5 children when she has no one to blame but herself for failing us.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7wGtfwfRIU


Sorry for the OT and hijacking George's thread!

Eidetic :hug:.

When I was twelve, my mom was in the hospital having a baby. I went over to this girl's house who was in Junior High already. She had an older brother whose friend was there too - sophomores. No mom home. At first it was fun and then the friend attacked me - literally trying to rape me. I was fighting loudly and fending him off - screaming and lashing. All of a sudden the mother walked in the door and he stopped. I was crying hysterically and so happy to see her. What she did next is unbelievable to me but I didn't digest it for years. She grabbed me by my shirt and called me a '' and told me to get out of her house.

I did tell my dad and he called the boy's parents but nothing I know of came of it. My next door neighbor gf walked over to the same house about two weeks later with a bag of stuff that belonged to the girl and I wanted my stuff back too. The mother answered the door and I said "here's _____ stuff, she has some of my stuff too.' She went inside the house for a minute and came back with my stuff and shoved it so hard at me she knocked me off the front porch. My gf and I couldn't believe it. What a wacko grownup/mother. It was her daughter who was older than me, it was her son's friend who had tried to rape me.

Several years later I had a gf that I hung with all the time. One time I told her that ____ _____ had tried to rape me when I was twelve. She looked at me and said, 'he did not'. I'll never forget how hurt I was that she thought I would say something like that about someone if it wasn't true. It took me awhile to digest that too and looking back, I still don't understand why my friend would automatically deny my claim - she didn't ask me one question. I had never lied to her - I was a good friend to her. :waitasec:

My story doesn't even involve family members but it has left a scar. Actually I'd like to wring that fricken mother's neck now. I'm older now than she was when she treated me that way and I cannot understand her reaction and how low it made me feel at the time. Shame on her. It goes to show you how some people always blame the person outside of their own though.

 

[ThinkTank]

According to this article:

http://www.wesh.com/caseyanthony/24328486/detail.html

George Anthony's attorney, Brad Conway, said mitigation evidence would involve events that lead up to Caylee's death.


"They're going to have to prove the relevancy of a suicide attempt after the fact," Conway said


So if I am reading this correctly and Brad is quoted correctly, then it seems like Baez is wrong in thinking this is a mitigating factor. It would be interesting to hear from a lawyer on whether Baez is wrong, Baez is covering for the bus he's looking for, or whether it could be used as mitigating.

I can see George getting up there and saying "You must save my daughter or I won't be able to survive. If you can't do it for her, do it for me and my family", but that wouldn't be used in the mitigation phase, I don't think.

Thoughts?

This post has nothing to do with molestation, but everything to do with the suicide attempt.

IMO JB is not wrong in "thinking" it would be a mitigating factor.... IMO JB is flat out lying when he says that is the reason for his private investigator to investigate George.

 

[ZsaZsa]

I don't believe that any amount of discipline or tough love could have veered Casey from her psychopathic course, in fact any attempt to 'fix' a psychopath only makes them more cunning, more dangerous, and puts you firmly in the line of fire. However, if they had faced the truth of what she was, instead of trying to pretend to the rest of the world that everything was just peachy in Anthonyland, they could have protected themselves from her, and more importantly they could have protected the most vulnerable, and most precious family member from her, and Caylee would be alive today.

The only thing you can do when faced with a psychopath is cut all ties, no therapist in the world can help, and the only way the legal system can help is after the fact. Even if Casey had been arrested and charged earlier with her fraud and credit card crimes she would have been free within a very short period of time. As long as she had access to Caylee that child was in mortal danger, and unfortunately the family did not / would not recognise this and take the steps to protect her.

http://bub.typepad.com/idea_froth/2007/08/guarding-agains.html

Cindy was given good professional advice- kick her out and take custody of Caylee. That would have been better than what she did, which was nothing.
I realize nothing is going to change the personality of a sociopath, but tough love and the legal system could have taken her out of the home and away from Caylee.

 

[LambChop]

This is just my opinion, but I wonder if the PI was at the motel room to find out if George was really alone the whole time he was there. River did say that GA called her from the motel, IIRC. What we don't know is if that's true at all or if it's the whole truth. I'm sure the defense is aware of her allegations and might entertain the idea of using her to discredit George.

As far as canvassing around the motel the PI could possibly be looking to see if certain illegal activities are common for the area, again in order to discredit George.

If Baez is just looking to use the suicide attempt for sympathy I can't understand what they would find out by talking to the motel people.

Why do you need a private detective from Minn. to get copies of the police report when a paralegal could get the records? Guess there just are no reliable PI in Orlando area. Wonder if this man is licensed in Florida or if Florida allows other investigators from other states to come in and conduct their own investigations????? jmo

 

[beach]

She should have been disciplined YEARS ago- they were too cowardly to do the tough love thing with Casey, it was always whatever would keep the peace...and as result she felt nothing but absolute contempt for them both, but particularly for CA.... GA was impotent with CA undermining anything he ever tried to do to control her. If they couldn't discipline/control her they should have let the Legal system do it for them. Their enabling has cost Caylee her life.

I don't believe that any amount of discipline or tough love could have veered Casey from her psychopathic course, in fact any attempt to 'fix' a psychopath only makes them more cunning, more dangerous, and puts you firmly in the line of fire. However, if they had faced the truth of what she was, instead of trying to pretend to the rest of the world that everything was just peachy in Anthonyland, they could have protected themselves from her, and more importantly they could have protected the most vulnerable, and most precious family member from her, and Caylee would be alive today.

The only thing you can do when faced with a psychopath is cut all ties, no therapist in the world can help, and the only way the legal system can help is after the fact. Even if Casey had been arrested and charged earlier with her fraud and credit card crimes she would have been free within a very short period of time. As long as she had access to Caylee that child was in mortal danger, and unfortunately the family did not / would not recognise this and take the steps to protect her.

http://bub.typepad.com/idea_froth/2007/08/guarding-agains.html

Cindy was given good professional advice- kick her out and take custody of Caylee. That would have been better than what she did, which was nothing.
I realize nothing is going to change the personality of a sociopath, but tough love and the legal system could have taken her out of the home and away from Caylee.

I know this isn't about George and I don't want to help veer OT, but I just wanted to say that I find this whole debate fascinating. I honestly see both sides of this. I tend to favor ZsaZsa's approach because that is how I would've handled it, however, I have zero experience in dealing with a sociopath. I can see where my approach might have very well backfired big time.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Cindy was given good professional advice- kick her out and take custody of Caylee. That would have been better than what she did, which was nothing.
I realize nothing is going to change the personality of a sociopath, but tough love and the legal system could have taken her out of the home and away from Caylee.

Agree with you on that. Doing nothing, or attempting to act way too late cost Caylee her life. Going under the wheels of the bus now, and in the upcoming trial is the price they'll pay for supporting her after the fact.

Casey would be absolutely loving watching her family squirm, watching the public outcry against them, reading their pathetic letters to her in prison begging for acknowledgement from her, and watching them cry out in despair as she accuses them of one horrific deed after the other. Mark my words, this is all just wicked fun for Casey, in her mind they deserve it, she's behind the direction the defence is taking, and she is going to love every moment of the trial.