2012.05.17 Doc Dump Thread

[suzihawk]

Guys, I'm not a mod, but there is a ton of other stuff to be talking about that should have tons of debate.

Like for example why any officer or detective would tell a witness that the screams came from GZ, not TM as if he knew that information.

Like two separate witnesses collaborating GZ's story that he was at the bottom getting beat up.

Like the location of the body actually being closer to the cut through then we originally thought.

etc, etc

It appears that the THC found in Trayvon's system is quite a big deal to some posters. Since it's a part of this doc dump, it should be a subject that is open to debate, IMO.

 

[elementary]

Dr.Drew is a paid talking head IMO what is outrageous is dimissing drug use when the reason GZ was even watching TM to begin with is because he was acting suspicious like he was on drugs and his blood shows he had THC in his system.IMO It lends truth to what GZ said to the 911 dispatch that night.

It might help to actually know something about marijuana and how it makes you behave. The film, "Reefer Madness" is laughable but I can understand if someone perceives the effects of MJ that way, which in that movie, showed people to act like raving lunatics. There is no weird behaviour on MJ unless you think stuffing your face is weird. There is no way GZ would have known if Trayvon were stoned unless he was on PCP or something. But I am sure there are lots of people out there who believe that MJ makes you wacky and suspect. Until you actually research it. Still waiting for that.

I don't understand the clinging to misinformation about MJ. I just don't understand it, when one can research it very readily.

And even though Pinsky, IMO, is a contemptible shill, the fact is, as an addictions physician, he knows his drugs. And IMO, the whole MJ issue is a tempest in a teapot because the effects of MJ are being distorted.

 

[vlpate]

Guys, I'm not a mod, but there is a ton of other stuff to be talking about that should have tons of debate.

Like for example why any officer or detective would tell a witness that the screams came from GZ, not TM as if he knew that information.

Like two separate witnesses collaborating GZ's story that he was at the bottom getting beat up.

Like the location of the body actually being closer to the cut through then we originally thought.

etc, etc

ITA, and I'm trying to find the g/f's statement, is that here and I'm missing it? TIA!

 

[songline]

AS I mentioned upthread, Trayvon had only 1.5 to 2 nanograms in his blood. Pinsky said that if he had been smoking at the time, it would be 100. It's possible, he also said, that he smoked it 2 hours ago. But possibly days ago as well.

We can imagine all day long but it was there in his blood and he smoked it minutes or 2 hours ago. All else is just imagine....

What if he was smoking till he felt he was being followed? Stopped because he did not want to get busted.
I can also imagine - what if he thought he lost GZ and did light up, but then saw him and got mad that he cant smoke in peace.
Whatever we want to make of this will only be our interpretation. I have nothing against marijuana, IT WAS in his blood, and other things that I read I think GZ sized him up right, I only wish that GZ was at a barbeque that day with family. But somehow he was where he was and I am sorry he got out of the car to get an address for the 911 operator, but he did.
So far the Docu Dump has not shown us anything to change my opinion of what has happened that night.

 

[jaded cat]

Do we know he was carrying at the 5? I've always pictured appendix-carry, and I've seen references to that style on the news. I'm pretty sure if he was carrying it up front, it'd be no big deal to slide it out.

Hope you don't mind answering a question for me? Carrying at the 5? Does it matter if you are left or right handed?

 

[beach]

It appears that the THC found in Trayvon's system is quite a big deal to some posters. Since it's a part of this doc dump, it should be a subject that is open to debate, IMO.

Jumping off of your post -

I agree, it is open for debate but we all should probably take it to a topical thread. It seems to be dominating the discussion of all the docs released today. Lots of other enlightening things were released and they are getting lost in here.

I will be happy to open one in just a few minutes. Got a chicken baking and I need to finish dinner. Will be back to do it. Patience please.

 

[suzihawk]

I want to know why it is clearly in the report that Zimmerman's jacket is described as "One (1) grey/orange colored Free Country brand name jacket, size extra large, collected from Zimmerman at the Sanford Police Department" when it was clearly a black/red jacket that is seen in the video and described as that color by the officer on scene? If that kind of obvious mistake is made then what else is wrong in the reports about what was collected?

From what I'm gathering, the grey/orange jacket is the one brought to the police station by his wife after the officer's collected his clothes (the black/red jacket). But your point is very well taken. It's the kind of mistake that shouldn't be made by officer's documenting evidence.

JMO

 

[jjenny]

Do Drew's words hold that much weight? He is just one of the many talking heads. Personally, I think the THC might be important in this case. I think it adds credibility to what GZ said in the 911 call. JMO

Doesn't hold any weight to me.

 

[LambChop]

Really and you came to this how? With that little bit of THC in the blood I highly doubt that GZ could tell that TM was "on" drugs.

Really it's POT not meth, not percs, not herion, it's Pot which is LEGAL in 92% of the United States in small amounts.

I've talked to LE after smoking and once I had someone bring me a a few Pot cookies for a friend that is terminal so he would at least eat something. They were sitting on my desk and the cop picked them up, laughed and we had a fairly long conversation about it. He agreed with me that he would much rather deal with someone who was stoned than someone on the above mentioned drugs.

Pot has many Good uses and for me, it has helped me to be able to do my activities of daily living better than any pain pill I have taken. There is also a medication for cancer patients derived from pot.

There is so much more about this case than the small amount of TLC in TM blood...to me it is a moat point but one that those who feel GZ had the right to do what he did will jump all over simply because it's against the law...

I thought you had to have over a certain amount before LE will arrest you. Is it over an ounce? Trying to remember what it was years ago. Plus when GZ said he was on something I believe he meant something stronger than pot. To me smoking pot is like having a couple of beers. lol Plus we do know he was suspended for having an empty bag so we know he used it. jmo

 

[Badlands]

Anyone could end up in the same position as GZ and IMO that is scary as H3ll.Very possibly when all is said and done GZ is telling the truth but is still facing life in prison even though IMO he had every right under the law to save his own life.

Anyone?? It sure wouldn't happen to me because I wouldn't be stupid enough to follow someone with a gun, while they're just walking through my neighborhood.

 

[songline]

It might help to actually know something about marijuana and how it makes you behave. The film, "Reefer Madness" is laughable but I can understand if someone perceives the effects of MJ that way, which in that movie, showed people to act like raving lunatics. There is no weird behaviour on MJ unless you think stuffing your face is weird. There is no way GZ would have known if Trayvon were stoned unless he was on PCP or something. But I am sure there are lots of people out there who believe that MJ makes you wacky and suspect. Until you actually research it. Still waiting for that.

I don't understand the clinging to misinformation about MJ. I just don't understand it, when one can research it very readily.

And even though Pinsky, IMO, is a contemptible shill, the fact is, as an addictions physician, he knows his drugs. And IMO, the whole MJ issue is a tempest in a teapot because the effects of MJ are being distorted.

I do know a few things, I was a teen in the 60's it can make some people sleepy and dragg themselves around,
which is not a natural walk.
Let me stop there because I have anything against smokers, but yes you can tell when someone is stoned.

 

[i.b.nora]

Cityslick mentioned "Like the location of the body actually being closer to the cut through then we originally thought."

Is there something in the document about the actual location of the body? Or about the location of the scuffle?

As I mentioned before, I am unable to view scribd documents with my antique computer, so any help would be appreciated.

 

[TorisMom003]

Based on the released reports of the swabs done on the gun, I'd have to say that there was no struggle for the gun as Zimmerman claimed.

Swabs from gun~
DMS-21A ~ From grip of gun ~ George's present; Trayvon's excluded
DMS-21B ~ From trigger of gun ~ Not interpretable
DMS~21C ~ From slide of gun ~ At least one male ~ Can not determine if it was George or Trayvon.

Also, on a different note, Zimmerman told SFD that he was on Librax and Tamazepam. This is marked on the report that also lists Zimmerman's injuries.

MOO

 

[m00c0w]

Hope you don't mind answering a question for me? Carrying at the 5? Does it matter if you are left or right handed?

Imagine your body is a clock. Carrying the gun at the 5:00 position (right-back side) is extremely popular. This is how I normally carry. If you're a righty, you'd most likely carry in-the-waistband at the 1-2:00 or the 4-5:00. The opposite if you're a lefty.

As for right vs left-handed, it actually has to do with your eye dominance. I know lefties that shoot right-handed, and vice versa.

<modsnip>

 

[Dr.Fessel]

The ME did the autopsy on a John Doe, Sanford did not tell them who Martin was till 2/28 at 12:30 noon.

The autopsy was done on feb 27 at 10:30 am

 

[HiHater]

Where did the first aid kit come from? If it was a first responders, why is it pictured in evidence? Weird.

Also, do we know if the THC was a trace amount or not? It's really much ado about nothing, especially when we don't know what GZ was on...

 

[AJ Noiter]

Based on the released reports of the swabs done on the gun, I'd have to say that there was no struggle for the gun as Zimmerman claimed.

Swabs from gun~
DMS-21A ~ From grip of gun ~ George's present; Trayvon's excluded
DMS-21B ~ From trigger of gun ~ Not interpretable
DMS~21C ~ From slide of gun ~ At least one male ~ Can not determine if it was George or Trayvon.

Also, on a different note, Zimmerman told SFD that he was on Librax and Tamazepam. This is marked on the report that also lists Zimmerman's injuries.

MOO

Just because they didn't find his DNA on it doesn't mean he wasn't trying to get it.

Edit: Also, I'd like to point out that they did not say "they did not get his DNA on it" in two of the three (66%) they could not make a determination.

 

[AJ Noiter]

Where did the first aid kit come from? If it was a first responders, why is it pictured in evidence? Weird.

Also, do we know if the THC was a trace amount or not? It's really much ado about nothing, especially when we don't know what GZ was on...

Why did they mark the emergency blanket and gloves as evidence also? Everything at the scene must be documented, whether police put it there or otherwise. That's my thought.

 

[TorisMom003]

From what I'm gathering, the grey/orange jacket is the one brought to the police station by his wife after the officer's collected his clothes (the black/red jacket). But your point is very well taken. It's the kind of mistake that shouldn't be made by officer's documenting evidence.

JMO

No, the "orange/grey" jacket is the one that was tested for gunshot residue, DNA, etc. Trust me, I looked at those reports on the color very closely because it is a clear contradiction to what the officer on scene stated along with the video of Zimmerman at the police station.

 

[elementary]

We can imagine all day long but it was there in his blood and he smoked it minutes or 2 hours ago. All else is just imagine....

What if he was smoking till he felt he was being followed? Stopped because he did not want to get busted.
I can also imagine - what if he thought he lost GZ and did light up, but then saw him and got mad that he cant smoke in peace.
Whatever we want to make of this will only be our interpretation. I have nothing against marijuana, IT WAS in his blood, and other things that I read I think GZ sized him up right, I only wish that GZ was at a barbeque that day with family. But somehow he was where he was and I am sorry he got out of the car to get an address for the 911 operator, but he did.
So far the Docu Dump has not shown us anything to change my opinion of what has happened that night.

No, not minutes or the nanograms would be closer to 100 not 1.5-2. The latter, according to Dr Pinsky suggests a couple of hours ago.

How did GZ size him up right? Being stoned on MJ is not going to make you act weird. If you don't want to believe, then fine. But distorting info is not helping the defence of GZ, IMO. Wait, maybe it is! (just thinking of the Pinellas outcome).