4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered, Bryan Kohberger Arrested, Moscow, 2022 #80

[girlhasnoname]

So, on that note. Do you feel they will make an appearance for the Monday court date?

Tough call on that one IMO. I don't think we'll see the family there for the arraignment. MOO

 

[cottonweaver]

Towards the end of the Dateline episode it's said that (according to a source) BK's mail is re-routed to his lawyers office and thr lawyer decides what Bk will see.

I found that odd and wonder why it is being done as I have never heard of it before.

Has he, perhaps, asked for this because among the few love-letters there's a ton of 'hate' mail and he doesn't want to face that?
By hate mail, I mean mail that he hates! ( Letter-writers who deplore his crimes and tell him so?)

 

[Rolypolyoly]

BK was also a criminology student. So his B@E MO could be specifically targeting drugs. To break, look around for drugs, for own use or even something having street value, is not unrealistic. A break-in with things being moved (looking for substances) but nothing of value taken makes sense. Money of valuables are inevitably reported. I actually wonder if he broke into King Road house looking for drugs. This could explain looking at different floors but missing the basement of which he could be unaware. JMO.

It could be possible but I don't believe so.

To me, the breaking in and moving things around is to toy with people, make them feel scared, uneasy, paranoid, like they are being watched. I think there is a lot of power in that to a deranged mind, I think that's how he was getting his kicks whilst he was also escalating.

After hearing about the associate and BK installing her cctv, and the possibility of him using it to watch her, along with the possibility of him being the one who broke in, in the first place, it leads me to wonder about the air conditioning contractors who attended the house with LE, we all wondered what that was all about and speculated maybe they were looking for the knife, but maybe they were looking for cameras?.

Or maybe it had nothing to do with looking for nothing at all.

JMO.

 

[maconrich]

Some random thoughts:

If he added a security system for a friend / colleague / whatever, wouldn't she have changed her password(s) as soon as he left? Seems basic no matter who set up the system.

Drugs - yes some users / addicts do B&E's, but IME many turn to dealing instead. Not major drug dealers, but selling enough so they can meet their needs. Maybe he was using again; or maybe he was dealing? Or maybe buying / selling other things that might not be considered legal? Purely hypothetical and just possibilities (and things we may never know for sure). MOO.

BK apparently got started using heroin by a friend that lived two houses away (from where he grew up), and he reportedly used a lot with a female friend in high school. He was also good friends with the Casey girl who spoke out early (after his arrest). One of the best articles I've seen regarding his background to date names the friends. Their facebook pages and obits are still available online if anyone cares to check them out (and the photo of Bryan with Jeremy and a girl is still up on Jeremy's page).

link to the article (from 2/23)

https://www.idahostatesman.com/news/local/crime/article272531864.html

I'm sure a good number of people that knew BK haven't spoken to the media, and I don't blame them at all. But from what I've seen so far (things that have been verified), I'm not seeing that he can't get along with women or that he hates them. And that includes the fact that he's taken courses from female professors. It seems like those would be avoided in favor of clearly superior male professors - IMHO. I do reserve the right to change my mind if something solid (and factual) comes out, but for now, I'm not buying it. And I don't consider a man that is heard calling a woman a bwitch one time as a women hater. Inappropriate, perhaps: rude, yes.

I'm also not convinced that he was a mega loner all his life. He might not have the best social or people skills, but it seems like he had friends, hung out with people and went to parties and such. At least in PA. It's entirely possible he would have made friends in WA with time (if he hadn't already and we just don't know about them at this point). Again IMHO.

So if this dude did it, IMHO it was for another reason. And a reason beyond someone saying no to a cup of coffee or something stupid like that.

And IMHO I don't believe that the killer (whoever he was) went in with the intent to only harm one person. I'm inclined to think all three women were the targets. With Ethan, unless he tended to park there when he didn't stay over, it's possible the killer wasn't surprised he was there. Especially if the killer had been watching the house.

All MOO and again, random Sunday morning thoughts...

 

[Chloegirl]

Some random thoughts:

If he added a security system for a friend / colleague / whatever, wouldn't she have changed her password(s) as soon as he left? Seems basic no matter who set up the system.

Drugs - yes some users / addicts do B&E's, but IME many turn to dealing instead. Not major drug dealers, but selling enough so they can meet their needs. Maybe he was using again; or maybe he was dealing? Or maybe buying / selling other things that might not be considered legal? Purely hypothetical and just possibilities (and things we may never know for sure). MOO.

BK apparently got started using heroin by a friend that lived two houses away (from where he grew up), and he reportedly used a lot with a female friend in high school. He was also good friends with the Casey girl who spoke out early (after his arrest). One of the best articles I've seen regarding his background to date names the friends. Their facebook pages and obits are still available online if anyone cares to check them out (and the photo of Bryan with Jeremy and a girl is still up on Jeremy's page).

link to the article (from 2/23)

https://www.idahostatesman.com/news/local/crime/article272531864.html

I'm sure a good number of people that knew BK haven't spoken to the media, and I don't blame them at all. But from what I've seen so far (things that have been verified), I'm not seeing that he can't get along with women or that he hates them. And that includes the fact that he's taken courses from female professors. It seems like those would be avoided in favor of clearly superior male professors - IMHO. I do reserve the right to change my mind if something solid (and factual) comes out, but for now, I'm not buying it. And I don't consider a man that is heard calling a woman a bwitch one time as a women hater. Inappropriate, perhaps: rude, yes.

I'm also not convinced that he was a mega loner all his life. He might not have the best social or people skills, but it seems like he had friends, hung out with people and went to parties and such. At least in PA. It's entirely possible he would have made friends in WA with time (if he hadn't already and we just don't know about them at this point). Again IMHO.

So if this dude did it, IMHO it was for another reason. And a reason beyond someone saying no to a cup of coffee or something stupid like that.

And IMHO I don't believe that the killer (whoever he was) went in with the intent to only harm one person. I'm inclined to think all three women were the targets. With Ethan, unless he tended to park there when he didn't stay over, it's possible the killer wasn't surprised he was there. Especially if the killer had been watching the house.

All MOO and again, random Sunday morning thoughts...

<modsnip> IMO there is a connection, at least peripherally (I'm never saying specifically the folks that live there, but the atmosphere of the partying, possibly neighbors, or a perception of adjacent resources/purchases).

Maybe he got his drugs nearby, saw them and became infatuated. It would not be the first time something like this has occurred.

I suppose if you have a drug issue and you're relocating (whether you're using or not upon arrival) one of the first things you would probably do is figure out what your resources are. If you do breaking and entering to be able to afford drugs but no longer do them, you can be emboldened to continue this habit for a lot of reasons (money, access, curiosity, whatever).

IMO, I had not thought of this, but in the DL episode they explained that his erratic driving was what got him pulled over twice and this was LE looking for drug patterns.

 

[Cool Cats]

It could be possible but I don't believe so.

To me, the breaking in and moving things around is to toy with people, make them feel scared, uneasy, paranoid, like they are being watched. I think there is a lot of power in that to a deranged mind, I think that's how he was getting his kicks whilst he was also escalating.

After hearing about the associate and BK installing her cctv, and the possibility of him using it to watch her, along with the possibility of him being the one who broke in, in the first place, it leads me to wonder about the air conditioning contractors who attended the house with LE, we all wondered what that was all about and speculated maybe they were looking for the knife, but maybe they were looking for cameras?.

Or maybe it had nothing to do with looking for nothing at all.

JMO.

Air conditioning contractors?
Interesting because in High School Bryan studied air conditioning - HVAC - after he quit some type of ROTC.

2 Cents

 

[BeachSky]

Are they going to be able to use this?
I don’t think he left the sheath on purpose.
If this purchase is true then where is the knife & the sheath papa rogers? JMO

Kohberger allegedly broke into female colleague’s home

Bryan Kohberger has been charged in a separate with killing four University of Idaho students.

www.newsnationnow.com

According to Dateline, Kohberger reportedly bought a KA-BAR knife and sheath in April 2022 from Amazon before he moved to Pullman, Washington, to attend university.

 

[TL4S]

You may well be right!

But I think another possibility is that X and/or E came into the kitchen--perhaps in response to the noises upstairs, perhaps to eat the food that had been delivered minutes earlier--and ran into the intruder holding a bloody knife as he was coming downstairs from the upper floor.

Their (or maybe it was just "her") instinct was to run back to the safety of their room. I don't know if homicidal humans have a "predator instinct", but seeing someone flee may have excited something in the intruder and so he pursued X and/or E back to their bedroom.

I agree that middle floor would seem a maze in anything but bright lighting. That's why I've wondered if the intruder had been to the house before. But pursuing a victim or victims might also have brought the intruder* to X's bedroom in that far corner. (It isn't really far in terms of steps; it's just that the bedroom door isn't visible from the kitchen because the middle-floor-bathroom is in the way.)

All of the above is speculation based on my understanding of the existing evidence.

* I've started using "intruder" instead of "BK" so I don't have to qualify that BK is innocent until proven guilty. It isn't that I have any reason to doubt that he is the culprit.

In this scenario, I think it's also possible X or E could have gone back to the bedroom to get a phone to call for help. JMO.

 

[SkylarSid]

The Dateline episode aired last night. Someone may be able to find it posted to their youtube soon, they did that last time with their former Idaho Murders episode.

If you don't have live TV, you can watch it by downloading the NBC ap.

 

[maconrich]

<modsnip> IMO there is a connection, at least peripherally (I'm never saying specifically the folks that live there, but the atmosphere of the partying, possibly neighbors, or a perception of adjacent resources/purchases).

Maybe he got his drugs nearby, saw them and became infatuated. It would not be the first time something like this has occurred.

I suppose if you have a drug issue and you're relocating (whether you're using or not upon arrival) one of the first things you would probably do is figure out what your resources are. If you do breaking and entering to be able to afford drugs but no longer do them, you can be emboldened to continue this habit for a lot of reasons (money, access, curiosity, whatever).

IMO, I had not thought of this, but in the DL episode they explained that his erratic driving was what got him pulled over twice and this was LE looking for drug patterns.

<modsnip: Quoted post was modsnipped> I'm not really sure what was going on, but I agree with you. And IME it seems like users find out where to get what they want pretty fast and without much effort. It may have led him to that area, to buy or sell, and could explain some of his trips there. And, yes, it's also possible he saw one of more of the girls while in the area.

Interesting on LE possibly looking for drug patterns due to his erratic driving. Of course I'm not sure and have wondered if the visual snow might contribute to that. Or even his out of state plates. Hard to say but interesting.

I'm not sure what I think about the possibility of him breaking into houses. Not something I'm ruling out though.

 

[schooling]

You may well be right!

But I think another possibility is that X and/or E came into the kitchen--perhaps in response to the noises upstairs, perhaps to eat the food that had been delivered minutes earlier--and ran into the intruder holding a bloody knife as he was coming downstairs from the upper floor.

Their (or maybe it was just "her") instinct was to run back to the safety of their room. I don't know if homicidal humans have a "predator instinct", but seeing someone flee may have excited something in the intruder and so he pursued X and/or E back to their bedroom.

I agree that middle floor would seem a maze in anything but bright lighting. That's why I've wondered if the intruder had been to the house before. But pursuing a victim or victims might also have brought the intruder* to X's bedroom in that far corner. (It isn't really far in terms of steps; it's just that the bedroom door isn't visible from the kitchen because the middle-floor-bathroom is in the way.)

All of the above is speculation based on my understanding of the existing evidence.

* I've started using "intruder" instead of "BK" so I don't have to qualify that BK is innocent until proven guilty. It isn't that I have any reason to doubt that he is the culprit.

There was no need to go into the house prior. There were real estate photos and click through virtual tours (not of the true crime type) all over the web up until weeks after the murder. That documented every square inch of the house.

It was a college property after all and the landlord likely needed it booked year after year with the turnover of students. Privacy was of little concern. Though to his credit he likely never imagined anything like this.

If BK was motivated he could have carefully studied it, memorized it, and constructed a mental map. And then sat outside of the house and gotten a pretty good idea of the photos/layouts relation to the physical space. No different than law enforcement and military forces do.

 

[TL4S]

I'm not sure I believe the alleged killer intended to kill only one victim. However, I believe one premise alleged for this theory is that the killer believed/was confident that he could enter the house, sneak up stairs without awakening or disturbing others sleeping in different rooms, kill his 'target' :-( and leave unnoticed. There is a second premise attached to this theory IMO; that the killer knew his target and her room and had watched her long enough to feel confident that under 'usual circumstances' (as surmised by the killer) she would be alone in her bed at that hour. So the killer saw all the cars and did not see it as a problem. MOO

EBM clarity

ETA: Needless to say, according to this theory murderer miscalculated and/or met with the unexpected and was prepared and willing to follow through such was his need to end his 'target's' life, plus to serve his self preservation. But who knows,maybe rage at finding a second unexpected person fueled the additional and equally horrendous killings that followed. Speculation. MOO

The wrench in the works for me is Murphy. I can't see KG sleeping in MM's room without Murphy, yet I don't see the killer, who doesn't necessarily know who is in which room when he goes upstairs, having the time to lock Murphy away in the empty room, then subdue not one, but two people. It's just my personal perspective. I can better see the scenario where KG is sleeping in her room with Murphy, hears something from MM's room, so locks Murphy in her room despite him trying to get out. If she ends up in MM's room and finds herself face to face with the killer, there's no reason she couldn't have still ended up on the bed during the attack. Actually, that makes more sense to me than the idea that he killed one girl without the other one at least partially getting away, off the bed. It's all total speculation, of course.

 

[Nova]

S&BBM for focus

IMO

Even if none of what Dateline reported turns out to be true, the show further tainted a jury pool, cast BK as such a creep that his own family suspected him, and most will just take the allegations, turn them into facts, and be on their merry way. I think the best that has come from this episode is 2 hours of reasons why the gag order must remain in place IMO.

DATELINE's ratings for Friday night were about 2.5 million viewers. That was actually an increase over the previous week, but it includes mostly people like you and me who don't live in Idaho and will never be on the Kohberger jury.

In a nation of 330,000,000 Americans, 2.5 million viewers is about 3/4 of 1%. And that total is many times the number of people in Idaho who watched.

I wouldn't worry too much about tainting that jury pool. Even if we assume many of the viewers were true crime fanatics such as we are, those who are "experts" on the case are likely to be excused during voir dire.

 

[TL4S]

I'm endlessly amazed at the tight timeline. The white elantra was seen going past at 4:04, X was on Tik Tok at 4:12, and the elantra was seen leaving at 4:20. From parking to leaving was 16 minutes or less. I believe KG and MM were killed before 4:12, so those 8 minutes account for the killer parking, walking into the house, walking upstairs, and killing two people. From 4:12 to 4:20, the killer walked downstairs, killed two more people, walked back out to the car, and left. Clearly it doesn't take long to take down people with a large knife like that, so I wouldn't have expected him to be there for an extended amount of time, but still...

 

[U.N. Known]

Towards the end of the Dateline episode it's said that (according to a source) BK's mail is re-routed to his lawyers office and thr lawyer decides what Bk will see.

I found that odd and wonder why it is being done as I have never heard of it before.

I've never heard of that either, though I suppose I have no reason to have heard of it! Of course, that contradicts other reports that the mail is going to the jail.

I think having the mail of a person awaiting trial for 4 homicides routed to his attorney makes sense. If that is true for BK, he had to have given his permission. We know that he (and others accused or convicted of similar crimes) has "fans" crawling out of the woodwork.

The guilty don't need access to the fan club and the not guilty don't need to concern themselves with jailhouse groupies.

 

[U.N. Known]

There was no need to go into the house prior. There were real estate photos and click through virtual tours (not of the true crime type) all over the web up until weeks after the murder. That documented every square inch of the house.

It was a college property after all and the landlord likely needed it booked year after year with the turnover of students. Privacy was of little concern. Though to his credit he likely never imagined anything like this.

If BK was motivated he could have carefully studied it, memorized it, and constructed a mental map. And then sat outside of the house and gotten a pretty good idea of the photos/layouts relation to the physical space. No different than law enforcement and military forces do.

This topic has been discussed at length previously, so I'll only add that it really depends on the person (RE bolded). I have seen the real estate photos and the video tours (created after the murders). There were things that were not evident from the photos that noticeable in the tours. I would have needed a walkthrough!

There is also the added element of the residents' furniture that isn't in the real estate photos and the random thing(s) sitting out that may obstruct the normal path.

JMO

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

RSBBM: Just a passing comment, yes seems in the context of this discussion and other reports we've had (which are well known by many on the thread) re BK likely being something of a night owl, all the OP is saying here is that in their opinion he rarely slept at night. MOO.

My point is that since we know he didn't sleep at night, the family could have checked the car during the day. IOW, his lack of night sleeping would likely not prevent them from checking the vehicle. They'd just do it at another time when he did sleep, that's all.

JMO.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

The wrench in the works for me is Murphy. I can't see KG sleeping in MM's room without Murphy, yet I don't see the killer, who doesn't necessarily know who is in which room when he goes upstairs, having the time to lock Murphy away in the empty room, then subdue not one, but two people. It's just my personal perspective. I can better see the scenario where KG is sleeping in her room with Murphy, hears something from MM's room, so locks Murphy in her room despite him trying to get out. If she ends up in MM's room and finds herself face to face with the killer, there's no reason she couldn't have still ended up on the bed during the attack. Actually, that makes more sense to me than the idea that he killed one girl without the other one at least partially getting away, off the bed. It's all total speculation, of course.

This is the scenario that's always made the most sense to me.

 

[U.N. Known]

The wrench in the works for me is Murphy. I can't see KG sleeping in MM's room without Murphy, yet I don't see the killer, who doesn't necessarily know who is in which room when he goes upstairs, having the time to lock Murphy away in the empty room, then subdue not one, but two people. It's just my personal perspective. I can better see the scenario where KG is sleeping in her room with Murphy, hears something from MM's room, so locks Murphy in her room despite him trying to get out. If she ends up in MM's room and finds herself face to face with the killer, there's no reason she couldn't have still ended up on the bed during the attack. Actually, that makes more sense to me than the idea that he killed one girl without the other one at least partially getting away, off the bed. It's all total speculation, of course.

Why?
LE noted that MM and KG texted Kaylee's ex-friend several times not long before the murders. It's completely conceivable (IMO) that they were in MM's room together and purposely or accidentally fell asleep there. They were lifelong friends who hadn't seen each other in a while and were going to be separated for some time after KG left. They may have just wanted to hang out. The dog may have been asleep in the other room or just doing his own thing.

We don't know if their doors were open before the killer arrived or whether or not the dog was crated.

 

[schooling]

This topic has been discussed at length previously, so I'll only add that it really depends on the person (RE bolded). I have seen the real estate photos and the video tours (created after the murders). There were things that were not evident from the photos that noticeable in the tours. I would have needed a walkthrough!

There is also the added element of the residents' furniture that isn't in the real estate photos and the random thing(s) sitting out that may obstruct the normal path.

JMO

You may have needed a walkthrough. But you also wouldn’t enter someone’s home with them there (hot prowling often done without pictures) at 4am with the intent of killing them.

IMO a lot of people are trying to put themselves in the killers shoes and apply rational thought to extremely irrational behaviors.

I wouldn’t even lightly poke someone I didn’t know with a finger. So I don’t even attempt to pretend to know the mind of a quadruple KaBar murderer.

The guy was dumb enough (my characterization) drove to the scene in his own car. I’m not putting it past him to walk into the house after only looking at a few pictures.

An unexpected couch or a misplaced desk isn’t going to stop someone like this from grabbing their knife and heading toward the door. MOO