5/15/2012--Sentencing

[swedie]

ok this is understandable and I agree on this.

But please leave Charles Adler out of the forum too.

I do like Charles A for what and who he presents. IMHO he tells it like it is. The DP debate; I could swing either way. I'm not for it nor against it. Yes it could save money somewhat, but would it really prevent certain crimes? I personally don't think so. Some criminals may welcome the DP. We know of some criminals who have taken their own lives just before their arrests or right after a brutal crime just because they probably could not bear to live their life inside prison. MOO Just the thought of these monsters being confined to a 3 X 2.5 meter cell, left alone with their thoughts of what they did and what they are missing out on for the rest of their pathetic lives makes me happy enough. No chance to have children, get married, buy a home, drive a car, go shopping, to movie theatres, visit McDonald's (gag), not able to hug their loved one or see them on a daily basis, no loved one to snuggle up with in a warm, comfy bed, no more home cooked meals, not even able to enjoy a walk through a park and enjoy the beautiful of our planet. I could go on and on and on. All the simple little things we take for granted, they have lost. To be dead is final; no remorse, no punishment, nothing to think about, worry about and miss. IMHO.

 

[CarrieBean]

I haven't read all of this book yet, but so far, it is good reading...

It is called:

"the sociopath next door"

The author is Martha Stout, ph.d.

This passage is written on the cover:

"1 in 25 ordinary Americans secretly has no conscience and can do anything at all without feeling guilty. Who is the devil you know?"

Thanks. I bookmarked this. It sounds like an interesting read. I believe I know one "devil", who I shut out of my life in a hurry.

 

[Mystic]

I am a newbie here at Websleuths and would truly appreciate it if someone could direct me as to how to find the astrology thread?

hope this works,

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=83174&highlight=astrology+stafford

 

[myzzy]

Thank you everyone for all the articles. Needed to take a break, it was a emotional ride for everyone here, i can only imagine how the family and friends felt. My thoughts are always with the family and those who were effected by this transitivity. Im thankful that Tori finally has justice and the family can now try to move forward and heal.

 

[crazyladi]

[The Greyhound Bus decapitator]


Apparently he's fine when on meds, but can become a killer when not. He should never be released without 24/7 supervision in case he decided to stop medication because he didn't like the way it made him feel.

My sister is skitzophrinic (sp?) and when she stops taking her meds which she always does you can tell. She always feels that she can just come off them even though she is constantly supervised by my parents. She however isnt violent. I can guarantee he will hurt someone again. This is a wrong call and a smack in the face to the parents of the victim. Sorry this makes me really mad

 

[otto]

http://www.cjbk.com/LocalNews/Story.aspx?ID=1704996

"David Wilks the Minister of Parliament for Kootenay-Columbia, British Columbia, has tabled private member's Bill c-299 calling for a 5 year minimum jail sentence for those offenders convicted of kidnapping a child under 16 years of age when the offender is a stranger to the victim (Not a parental-type abduction)."

ETA

Oops, I think I originally said 10 years, but it's 5.

That's what's confusing me ... it's now 4 if no weapon is used ... 5-7 if a weapon is used. The bill doesn't seem to be much different than what the law already states.

 

[brighidin]

My sister is skitzophrinic (sp?) and when she stops taking her mess in which she always does you can tell. She always feels that she can just come off them even though she is constantly supervised by my parents. She however isnt violent. I can guarantee he will hurt someone again. This is a wrong call and a smack in the face to the parents of the victim. Sorry this makes me really mad

The mother of the victim, Tim McLean, has been quite vocal in the press (at least here in Winnipeg) but no one really listens.

I understand that he is mentally ill and had no control over what he was doing, but I don't think that means he should be allowed out and about in the community: he should be kept in Selkirk for the rest of his life, because if he is freed, there is no way to ensure he stays on his medication.

(Yody04: I can't stand Charles Adler either. His voice and his politics make me stabby. I feel for Rodney and I understand where he is coming from; I just don't agree with his proposed solution.)

 

[brighidin]

haha! no kidding.

 

[Maple1]

Yeah me too, hope I'm around and I will not forget Tori!

I wanted to share a couple of articles not directly about MTR but about David Shearing/Ennis. For him, it's now 30 years later - he's had 2 parole hearings (2008 & 2012) and it still behind bars so I have faith MTR will never get out either. I can barely remember Shearing's horrible crime as I was quite young but I do remember always being afraid of going camping afterwards...

http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/story.html?id=cf08bee1-8862-4515-9b56-9719cfc13ff3

http://www.canada.com/killed+family+applies+again+parole/6625342/story.html

Snipped from the Vancouver sun link above.

On Friday, he asked for day parole, starting with brief escorted trips out for therapy groups and eventually job interviews. He said he would count on the support of his wife of 14 years, who met and married him while he was still in prison.

Heather Ennis sat shoulder to shoulder with him Friday throughout the hearing, quietly fidgeting with her manicured nails, and then spoke at the end on his behalf.

The two have a "wonderful marriage," she said. "I have seen so much change in this man since we met (in 1993) ... I know the man's heart is in the right place and I'm just here to back him up."

Gag, gag gag.
IMO.
What has always concerned me about these murderer's, serial killers, sexual sadists, etc. is that they get to sit in there cell and relive the crimes they have committed through memories.
I can't believe that someone would marry someone in prison but here is the proof in this article. So if married, are they allowed conjugal visits? Someone mentioned in a previous thread that MR will probably have woman sending him money, etc. if found guilty. (prior to pub ban being lifted).
I hope he never gets lucky again.

Thanks for the article. I do recall this case as I am from BC. Just shocking to read some of the case facts.

I am going to write my MP regarding sexual offense prosecutions and the lack of signicant sentences. There should be no pardons for sexual offenses of any kind. I am sick of hearing about repeat offenders.
If the police and or crown had taken the woman who reported a pretty violent date rape by MR in jan of 2009, TM may very well be alive today.
My understanding is she made a complaint and he was questioned.
I don't think it is up to her whether or not charges would be laid.
I hope LE reviews how that case was handled and learns from it.
MR was pretty casual about it when Det. Smythe brought it up during one of the interview segments. Something about wining and dining woman in London. Who, MR asks... :jail:
Sorry, not very clear thoughts.

 

[Maple1]

Why Tori will always matter

http://www.lfpress.com/news/london/raffertytrial/2012/05/15/19762406.html

Here is an INCREDIBLE article written by Randy Richmond of the London Free Press. Very well written and captures what many Canadians feel for Tori!!!!!!!!!! Well done Randy.

Thanks
IMO. Especially moving article. :fence:

 

[Kittymama]

In that interview with Rodney and his mom, DG said that Rafferty was at the first candlelight vigil the weekend after Tori went missing. I didn't know that.

 

[Maple1]

Wills' Kingston cell empty, ready for Rafferty

By Tom Godfrey ,Toronto Sun

http://www.torontosun.com/2012/05/15/wills-kingston-cell-empty-ready-for-rafferty

Thanks for that. Seems like the perfect trio.

This was an additional story link regarding day parole for this womans murderer.
http://www.torontosun.com/2012/05/16/daughter-of-slain-oshawa-man-finds-out-life-doesnt-mean-life

Unfortunately for Tori's family they will have issues like this come up. Hopefully not for 23 years.

 

[BorgQueen]

Woah! I've not heard of some of these details before. Her mother's boyfriend threatened to slit TLM's throat? CM and TLM were shacked up with him? :what:

Rafferty and McClintic’s brief but twisted pairing began in that pizza shop, when he called her a “pretty little number,” according to McClintic. Then they had sex in his car.

Rafferty climbed on top of McClintic and began to choke her, she reported. McClintic returned home not long after, with cold pizza and “Mike’s” number written in the box. She didn’t know his last name, but he didn’t really talk much about himself, she said.

Eighteen-year-old McClintic wasn’t the first young woman Rafferty choked during sex. In all, 12 other women reported being choked by him. Some consented, others didn’t. One woman signed a note consenting to “sexual choking and passing out,” while another alleged he drugged, choked and raped her.

Her birth mother was a stripper who gave her up to a fellow stripper, Carol McClintic. Terri-Lynne McClintic says her adoptive mother gave up the trade when she started to care for the baby, but life would be anything but stable.

McClintic grew up shuttled between eight different communities, bouncing from Carol McClintic’s home to foster care, back home and back to foster care again. Violence was prevalent, as were Carol McClintic’s drinking and drug habits.

Terri-Lynne McClintic picked up on those habits early, starting to use marijuana at age eight. She would go on to consume an astonishing amount of drugs in her formative years, moving on to cocaine, ecstasy, morphine, OxyContin — whatever was most readily available wherever she found herself living.

The first time McClintic got into trouble with the police was when she stole some toys from a hardware store at age 10.

When she was 11, McClintic went into a foster home after reporting that her mother has been physically and verbally abusing her every day for the past two years. The following year Carol McClintic was arrested for public intoxication after police see a 12-year-old Terri-Lynne running away from her intoxicated mother.

A few months later, her mother’s boyfriend gets drunk and threatens to slit McClintic’s throat. He is criminally charged.
McClintic spent an inordinate amount of time either meting out violence or finding herself on the receiving end of it. As a child she microwaved a dog until it screamed. It had to be put down but she blamed the dog’s injuries on an attack from another dog.

Her first criminal charge came at age 15, when she flew into a rage after being asked to move out of her mother’s boyfriend’s house — the same boyfriend who had threatened two years prior to slit her throat — and punched her mother in the face so hard that she fractured Carol McClintic’s cheekbone.

Today McClintic cites very few positive influences in her life. She names a godmother and a man who died when she was young. She stopped going to school full-time after Grade 8. Around the same time she overdosed on drugs and lost portions of her memory.

Other than drugs, the prevailing themes in Rafferty’s life were women and sexual paraphilias. Though later in his life, particularly in the months leading up to Tori’s death and in the weeks after Rafferty bounced from woman to woman with astonishing speed, online diaries of a young woman detail a relationship she had with Rafferty for more than two years starting when he was 22.

They lived together for a while and she reported he was paranoid about her cheating on him. They also shared a computer, and while logged on under her profile, it appears the girlfriend researched veterinary schools, posted the online diaries and downloaded some Hollywood movies. Rafferty’s profile, on the other hand, was used to access an enormous amount of child .

After they broke up, computer records show he began searching for massage parlours and escort websites.

He then flooded the social networking and dating websites, setting up profiles and writing out long descriptions of himself, replete with misspellings, often proclaiming to value friendship above all else and describing himself as a hopeless romantic who wore his heart on his sleeve.


LONG ARTICLE but well worth the read.
http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/0...ynne-mcclintic-met-depraved-michael-rafferty/

Her life was terrifying, wasn't it? The making of a monster...

 

[otto]

Snipped from the Vancouver sun link above.

On Friday, he asked for day parole, starting with brief escorted trips out for therapy groups and eventually job interviews. He said he would count on the support of his wife of 14 years, who met and married him while he was still in prison.

Heather Ennis sat shoulder to shoulder with him Friday throughout the hearing, quietly fidgeting with her manicured nails, and then spoke at the end on his behalf.

The two have a "wonderful marriage," she said. "I have seen so much change in this man since we met (in 1993) ... I know the man's heart is in the right place and I'm just here to back him up."

Gag, gag gag.
IMO.
What has always concerned me about these murderer's, serial killers, sexual sadists, etc. is that they get to sit in there cell and relive the crimes they have committed through memories.
I can't believe that someone would marry someone in prison but here is the proof in this article. So if married, are they allowed conjugal visits? Someone mentioned in a previous thread that MR will probably have woman sending him money, etc. if found guilty. (prior to pub ban being lifted).
I hope he never gets lucky again.

Thanks for the article. I do recall this case as I am from BC. Just shocking to read some of the case facts.

I am going to write my MP regarding sexual offense prosecutions and the lack of signicant sentences. There should be no pardons for sexual offenses of any kind. I am sick of hearing about repeat offenders.
If the police and or crown had taken the woman who reported a pretty violent date rape by MR in jan of 2009, TM may very well be alive today.
My understanding is she made a complaint and he was questioned.
I don't think it is up to her whether or not charges would be laid.
I hope LE reviews how that case was handled and learns from it.
MR was pretty casual about it when Det. Smythe brought it up during one of the interview segments. Something about wining and dining woman in London. Who, MR asks... :jail:
Sorry, not very clear thoughts.

Wells Gray Park ... I remember that case ... difficult case to solve.

There must have been something about the rape that was difficult to verify or prove in court. Possibly she had been dating him, she invited him into her home, she had some history with him ... that would make rape really difficult to prove especially if there were no clear signs of physical injury and no immediate report of the rape. I'm not saying that this is what happened, but if those were the circumstances, police would have very little in terms of evidence that couldn't be interpretted two ways. If drugs and alcohol were voluntarily used ... that much harder to prove.

 

[swedie]

Her life was terrifying, wasn't it? The making of a monster...

And we don't know the half of it. Yes sounds like her life was terrifying to say the least. She grew up without direction, morals, comfort, love and values. The total absence of these necessities can take a perfectly innocent child and turn them into monsters. I do not condone her actions as there are many children who grow up in such similar situations and turn out ok, they are scarred but manage somehow in life. TLM was doomed from day one and the system failed to recognize a child falling through the cracks on many occasions IMHO. I'm not criticizing her Godmother but it would be interesting to know where she was throughout TLM's life and how much she knew about what was going on. MOO.

This article discusses MR and the faint hope clause. I highly doubt a parole board will even give it more than a two minute concern, and that will only be for the paper work which needs to be filled out IMO. All that can change also. Both TLM and MR could lose that right of the faint hope clause as there is nothing etched in stone saying the Canadian Justice System, our Government cannot make changes to bills. I pray for change in so many ways and not for the betterment of the murders but for society MOO.

http://www.jacksnewswatch.com/2012/05/15/jack-tori-stafford-the-sequel/

 

[swedie]

Informative videos. Watch one after the other. Some repetitive, but some informative regarding legal opinions and the legal arguments surrounding the search of computers/laptops. Also legal talk about Li (Greyhound bus dude). HTH.

http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/CanadaAM/20120515/rafferty-sentencing-hearing-120415/

 

[otto]

And ... while we were all watching the trial for the murder of Victoria Stafford, another young couple were in the same situation ... on trial for murdering an other young girl, aged 13 ... in Ontario: Rafal LaSota, 28, and his former fiancée, Michelle Liard, 22, are each charged with first-degree murder in the Dec. 10, 2008, slaying of Aleksandra Firgan-Hewie: "A poster on the bedroom wall of accused schoolgirl killer Rafal LaSota read, “I'll stop stabbing when you stop screaming.” (sounds familiar?)

"The attorney general’s office confirmed Tuesday it will seek a retrial or to have the Court of Appeal find Michelle Liard guilty. Firgan-Hewie’s slashed and stabbed body was found in a garbage bag behind the home of Liard’s former fiancé, Rafal LaSota, in December 2008.

...

During the trial, Liard admitted she was at LaSota’s home during and after the murder and that she scrubbed blood from his clothing. She said she never once set foot in LaSota’s bedroom in the seven hours she was there.

...


The judge also targeted any suggestion that Firgan-Hewie, 13, was the victim of a “thrill kill.” ... If the theory is that she would derive some sort of pleasure from inflicting pain and death on another person ... "

http://www.thestar.com/news/article...ial-crown-appeals-acquittal-of-michelle-liard

"There were 37 stab wounds and two dozen blunt-force trauma wounds on her tiny body."

This woman wrote a lot, including: "The only story written by Liard that was shown to the jury was one in which the narrator — who shares her nickname of “Meesh” — gleefully abducts, confines and tortures a young woman, who is eventually carved to death by a male accomplice. Her lover and co-conspirator in the story is a man named “Rafal.” ... and she is back on the streets. Thankfully, the prosecution will appeal.

It's a similar scenario where the couple will most likely never come clean about how/what caused the death ... most likely, they don't know because they did it together. When caught, it seems that one takes the fall. With Homolka, Bernardo took the fall. With Rafferty, McClintic tried to take the fall but ultimately they blamed each other ... in another case where a 14 year old girl and her 20 something boyfriend murdered her parents and brother, he admitted to killing the parents, but denied killing the brother. She also deneid killing the brother. They blamed each other.

 

[otto]

"At one break in the proceedings, the victim’s mother, Milena Firgan, noted how news accounts on the highly publicized murder of Victoria (Tori) Stafford contained disturbing similarities to Aleksandra’s death.

In both cases, the accused killers were drug abusers and the victim was a young girl.

In both cases, the victims were led by a trusted woman to somewhere where they could be isolated and killed.

In both cases, investigators found chilling writings by the female co-accused."

http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/a...rial-jury-didn-t-hear-about-vampire-fantasies

Milena ... what a beautiful name ... her daughter was the victim of a Bernardo/Homolka, Rafferty/McClintic type scenario ... thirteen years old. She was murdered in 2008. There's evidence the male accomplice was into kiddie ... same story ...

 

[otto]

 

[otto]

I took this by the river last weekend ... the purple ones move really fast