Abuse and JonBenet

[MurriFlower]

Maybe they(LE) thought or were told that sexual abuse is hard to prove.So they knew that RDI and that it had something to do with prior abuse but decided to target PR because it was.....easier?We put her under pressure and eventually she will spill the beans and we'll get the REAL killer?Still doesn't make it right,dunno.

Perhaps they were told that the 'evidence' was not conclusive to prior sexual abuse. I think that's something that's been debated here before, but it's not clear if it is true and if so was it consistent with her being 'diddled' by an adult, another child, herself or if it was the result of her chicken pox. Even if sexual assualt, it is then quite another thing to automatically assume JR (despite was LA said) and despite what is believed on this forum by RDI.

 

[BBB167893]

Hmm, I must be lost, because I remember the conversation beginning thus:



This is in reference to the injuries that occurred at the time of the murder. The discussion then went on to a criticism of JR not wanting to know about the sexual stuff. This isn't anything to do with what Fang or I want, or if their lawyers knew about the autopsy report, it's to do with BPD communicating with the parents of a victim. Instead they treated them like the prime suspects and gave them no respect at all.

Yeah, I think we did get off the track someplace.

 

[BBB167893]

Even if sexual assault, it is then quite another thing to automatically assume JR (despite was LA said) and despite what is believed on this forum by RDI.

You make a good point. We CAN'T automatically assume it was JR.

 

[MurriFlower]

You make a good point. We CAN'T automatically assume it was JR.

We CAN'T automatically assume it was sexual assualt either.

 

[BBB167893]

We CAN'T automatically assume it was sexual assualt either.

Just so I'm clear on this, are you referring to the possible sexual assault from that night (which is what most people here mean when they say "assault," thus the mix-up), or the possible sexual abuse from earlier on?

 

[MurriFlower]

Just so I'm clear on this, are you referring to the possible sexual assault from that night (which is what most people here mean when they say "assault," thus the mix-up), or the possible sexual abuse from earlier on?

Yeah point taken. I did reference Madeline's quote, which I assumed had gone off on the 'previous sexual assault' tangent that you had led her to. Only Madeline can tell us what she meant.

 

[BBB167893]

Yeah point taken.

Okay, then.

I did reference Madeline's quote, which I assumed had gone off on the 'previous sexual assault' tangent that you had led her to.

That I led her to? You give me too much credit, MurriFlower.

Only Madeline can tell us what she meant.

That's true.

 

[DeeDee249]

"I just can't make sense of anyone in the family putting her body on the plane in a suitcase." Alleluia

Now think about this a minute. Patsy allowing a stinky corpse to reside in her pristine home. Hell, freezes, over

Well, I think they were hoping LE would find her. I mean Officer French was THERE- right at the DOOR. He could have at least tried to see why it didn't open. He didn't even bother to look up where he would have seen the simple latch. Had he opened that door, this investigation would have not been compromised and we wouldn't still be here all these years later.
When that didn't happen, I think they began to think about what might happen if they had to leave her there, unfound. And that would have been unpleasant for the reasons I stated. So as soon as Det. Arndt said "take another look around" JR RAN to the basement.

 

[MurriFlower]

Well, I think they were hoping LE would find her. I mean Officer French was THERE- right at the DOOR. He could have at least tried to see why it didn't open. He didn't even bother to look up where he would have seen the simple latch. Had he opened that door, this investigation would have not been compromised and we wouldn't still be here all these years later.
When that didn't happen, I think they began to think about what might happen if they had to leave her there, unfound. And that would have been unpleasant for the reasons I stated. So as soon as Det. Arndt said "take another look around" JR RAN to the basement.

Well, this is a what if question:

What if Officer French had found her at 6.30am? How do you think this would have changed the course of events?

 

[DeeDee249]

Well, this is a what if question:

What if Officer French had found her at 6.30am? How do you think this would have changed the course of events?

Well, the most important thing is that the parents (and Det. Arndt) would not have been allowed to touch the body. Had proper police procedure been followed, at that point the wineceller would be sealed with crime tape, the house cleared and NO ONE allowed near the body. The body would never have come into contact with parental fibers AFTER the fact, so any fibers found in pertinent places (tape, cord) would not be able to be attributed to anyone throwing themselves on the body.
Then the coroner would have first examined the body in situ and there would have been no contamination.
FW and JR would not have handled the tape, making any prints found there attributed without a doubt to whoever put the tape on her mouth- AKA the killer/stager.
So much of what we speculate about here would not be matter for speculation had the body not been touched by anyone after it was placed in the wineceller. And I think the case would have been solved by now.

 

[madeleine]

When I said that maybe they thought sexual abuse would be hard to prove I was thinking of prior abuse.Sorry that I wasn't clear.

 

[madeleine]

Perhaps they were told that the 'evidence' was not conclusive to prior sexual abuse. I think that's something that's been debated here before, but it's not clear if it is true and if so was it consistent with her being 'diddled' by an adult, another child, herself or if it was the result of her chicken pox. Even if sexual assualt, it is then quite another thing to automatically assume JR (despite was LA said) and despite what is believed on this forum by RDI.

No we can't automatically assume it was JR and I personally don't but I wonder why the ones who so strongly thought RDI (LE) didn't check THIS further.I mean if true it would have been their golden goose,right?Why were they still fixated on PR after finding THIS out?Isn't it weird?
IF true I guess it would have been logical to start with the men in her family,family friends and the rest of the men who had access to her,gardener,photographer,etc.
What I don;t get is....this finding didn't change their views nor the line of investigation.Doesn't make sense to me.That's why I am thinking that MAYBE it was another try to crack the R's.Dunno.

 

[madeleine]

Well, this is a what if question:

What if Officer French had found her at 6.30am? How do you think this would have changed the course of events?

I am not even sure she was there at 6.30. FW says he checked that room and didn't see the body.It's either
1.He is lying(I still find it very strange that within 5 min after arrival he went straight to the basement)
2.JR is lying(his trips to the basement are still a mystery to me)
3.They are both lying(maybe this is what the war was about)
or
4.They are both telling the truth (which IMO is kinda hard to swallow,one doesn't see anything,one sees her instantly)

 

[MurriFlower]

No we can't automatically assume it was JR and I personally don't but I wonder why the ones who so strongly thought RDI (LE) didn't check THIS further.I mean if true it would have been their golden goose,right?Why were they still fixated on PR after finding THIS out?Isn't it weird?
IF true I guess it would have been logical to start with the men in her family,family friends and the rest of the men who had access to her,gardener,photographer,etc.
What I don;t get is....this finding didn't change their views nor the line of investigation.Doesn't make sense to me.That's why I am thinking that MAYBE it was another try to crack the R's.Dunno.

Hi madeline

Yes, I thought about the supposed prior assault too. I've decided either it is very 'iffy' as to whether it actually is the result of sexual assault, or it isn't relevant to the killing.

 

[WHITEFANG]

He was rather topped off with grapes

 

[WHITEFANG]

You make a good point. We CAN'T automatically assume it was JR.

Hold it riht thar, youngin.
I sae,
I say, who don said dat?

 

[WHITEFANG]

We CAN'T automatically assume it was sexual assualt either.

:clap:



Tom Haney told her flat-out two years earlier!

They disagreed?

 

[WHITEFANG]

Well, I think they were hoping LE would find her. I mean Officer French was THERE- right at the DOOR. He could have at least tried to see why it didn't open. He didn't even bother to look up where he would have seen the simple latch. Had he opened that door, this investigation would have not been compromised and we wouldn't still be here all these years later.
When that didn't happen, I think they began to think about what might happen if they had to leave her there, unfound. And that would have been unpleasant for the reasons I stated. So as soon as Det. Arndt said "take another look around" JR RAN to the basement.

You believe this woman would leave it to the cops to find the corpse after it began to putrefy and stink up her home?

Why do you suppose they didn't put her body in a bag, leave the area, dump the body somewhere, and upon arriving in Atlanta, notify the cops she was missing?

 

[DeeDee249]

You believe this woman would leave it to the cops to find the corpse after it began to putrefy and stink up her home?

Why do you suppose they didn't put her body in a bag, leave the area, dump the body somewhere, and upon arriving in Atlanta, notify the cops she was missing?

Of course not. Putrefaction wouldn't occur that day. They hoped LE would find her that day, before they left. But it looked like that wasn't going to happen, because after Officer French left and the FBI left, Det. Arndt was the only one there, and she was supposedly keeping an eye on them all, she wasn't searching the house. But if JR hadn't found her, and the Rs had left for the Fernie's, within a few days it would have come to that. He had no choice but to find her.
I can't see them dumping her body. Anywhere. I can't see them allowing her body to be destroyed by insects and vermin (sure to happen if she was dumped outside). Keeping her in the house was their only option, IMO. Dumping her and leaving her behind in Boulder presents the problem of what to tell BR and others about where she was. So to call from Atlanta and report her missing, where was she missing from? Boulder? Then why did you travel to Atlanta? Missing from Atlanta? Bringing her body on the plane to Atlanta has the same problems that bringing her to Charlevoix, plus the added complication of what reason to give to the older kids who are meeting them to go to Charlevoix.
The dumping of her body fits in NO theory, as far as I am concerned.

 

[BBB167893]

When I said that maybe they thought sexual abuse would be hard to prove I was thinking of prior abuse.Sorry that I wasn't clear.

That's how I took it, too.