Adult Entertainment Industry: Case related

[ps149]

This is interesting-

SAFETY TIPS FOR ESCORTS

The Ultimate and Most Comprehensive List (A Must Read for Escorts)

 

[Mountain_Kat]

He wines and dines then, makes them feel like they can be buddies, he'll take her to nice dinners, and she'll get paid on top of it, AND that is how I think he gets them to let their guard down. He comes across as the person who is going to help them the most.

We are sharing a brain, Moon! :what:

Let's look at Melissa. She was on again off again with her boyfriend. No idea what he did for a living, or if he was pimping Melissa out (I suspect he was, but that's just gut feeling), but she definitely didn't want him to know where she was going that last night. And then we have this:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...island-serial-killer-victims-secret-life.html

Earlier that evening, the blond beauty told her boyfriend that she might be going to Long Island, a frequent haunt of hers. She regularly hung out there with a girlfriend who also worked as an online escort, as well as at the home of a regular client. Her boyfriend said he would oftentimes pick her up from the john's house.

"She would go to Long Island a lot," said her boyfriend Johnny Terry, who spoke exclusively with The Daily Beast. "She had some older man she was chummy with."


So, in my mind, Melissa could easily have been swayed by a killer playing the sugardaddy angle.

Megan was being pimped out by her boyfriend. By all accounts, she loved him, but the guy is a complete dirtbag, and I can easily see Megan having her heart broken too many times, and just getting fed up. A killer playing the role of sugardaddy wouldn't have to work hard to have won Megan over, imo. And it's interesting to note that Megan bragged to her Mom about her clients including doctors, lawyers, etc.

Amber had an expensive drug habit. And she'd gotten the worst kind of review a girl can get...setting johns up to be robbed. That had to have hurt her business on Long Island, and cut into her income. So it's not hard to see how SugarDaddy might have made a call, cajoled and promised big money, and Amber couldn't resist.

(Just thinking outloud.)

 

[Justiceforever]

This is interesting-

SAFETY TIPS FOR ESCORTS

The Ultimate and Most Comprehensive List (A Must Read for Escorts)

Absolutly a must read for anybody in the business! Thanks for posting this PS149! Someone in the industry may read this and take it to heart. It could save a life. Following these same safety guidelines is why I am here to talk @ it today.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

Absolutly a must read for anybody in the business! Thanks for posting this PS149! Someone in the industry may read this and take it to heart. It could save a life. Following these same safety guidelines is why I am here to talk @ it today.

As someone who worked in retail management, I'd add this to money concerns: invest in a counterfeit pen. They are cheap and you can get them at any office supply store.

 

[MoonUnderfoot]

I think that is a very important question. Maybe Moon can tell us the AVERAGE going rate and what that includes in NY. Wherever you go you still have to keep your rates competitive, so it might give us an idea of what the GB4 charged on CL.

I'm not sure what you are saying/ asking however @ the other thing. Could you ask/say it in a different way? Sometimes I'm a little slow

Average rate for a nice decent provider is anywhere from $130-150. That would allow the john access to FS, or 'Full service'. I have though, sadly seen the girls who post for $60 an hour and often wonder why someone would go THAT low. I think those girls are probably easy targets, sad to say. As a former provider, I even feel a $60FS is, uh, 'sleazy'.

Now a BJ (sorry) for any where between $60 and $75 is not uncommon, though I know some who have gotten well near FS prices just for BJ.

You can't really say what the 'average' is for sure, but I would say that anywhere between $130 and $150 is a good start.

(I feel like those knuckleheads on those sex forums right now!)

 

[MoonUnderfoot]

I suppose you might open up (if that's what you mean by private) about yourself to a client who is interested, talking is a great way to pass the time, and get paid for a second hour. "OOPS your hours up! Imagine that!"

I couldn't talk to one of those fools for an hour if they paid me... Lol...
Pun intended I suppose! :banghead::banghead:

 

[Justiceforever]

Precious Dust, I think there is a certain underlying contempt that some providers feel for their clients and vice versa. I think in all honesty however, it is a projection of self contempt.
JMVHO

 

[Justiceforever]

Get it? TENSE?
:truce:

 

[Justiceforever]

<modsnip> it reveals ALOT about the underlying dynamics between some men and some providers (going both ways). This same contemptuous, passive/aggressive hostility is certainly just below the surface between the players in, I still think, ALOT of these exchanges. I believe it could be the catalyst to violence in some situations. I am convinced that LISK and MV have this same contempt for providers, only they take it to a whole different level because of their psychopathy .

 

[shadowraiths]

*A story about Everybody, Somebody, Anybody, and Nobody*

This is a story about four people: Everybody, Somebody, Anybody, and Nobody.

There was an important job to be done and Everybody was asked to do it.
Everybody was sure Somebody would do it.
Anybody could have done it, but Nobody did it.
Somebody got angry about that because it was Everybody's job.
Everybody thought Anybody could do it, but Nobody realized that Everybody
wouldn't do it.
It ended up that Everybody blamed Somebody when actually Nobody asked Anybody.

So I just did it

Cute and watered down version of The Responsibility Poem, coined by Charles Osgood, a CBS anchorman. Moreover, fwiw, it's copyrighted, and should, at the very least be attributed. Just sayin....

 

[Justiceforever]

Cute and watered down version of The Responsibility Poem, coined by Charles Osgood, a CBS anchorman. Moreover, fwiw, it's copyrighted, and should, at the very least be attributed. Just sayin....

Thanks Shadow! I didn't know who the author was. I probably should've put author unknown. Well now we know.

 

[shadowraiths]

Considering there were no reports of a shared john, I highly doubt we're looking at a john who lured the girls, and then murdered them. And even though the last two victims may have let their guard down, I still lean toward the stalking theory.

My theory hinges on them attending a bdsm or swing event... or even one of the sex clubs in the NYC area. While women can attend by themselves, men must be accompanied by a female. Therefore, I could see someone hiring an escort for the evening. Importantly, these sort of events would provide a means for the killer to identify his type. That is, they'd be unknowingly auditioning for him.

While I have seen ads posted by men requesting partners to attend these types of events... or go to the sex clubs with them, Iow, how often do escorts encounter these type of requests?

 

[shadowraiths]

Here's an excerpt of Melissa's ad:

Available to Men, Women, Couples
Services: Escort, Bodyrub, Dinner Date, Domination/BDSM, Fetish/Role Play, Naked Maid
Rates: $150 half hour / $250 hour / $1000 overnight
Special rate: $!00 - 15 m;inutes​

She also advertised "car dates" in another ad.

 

[LINative13]

I just came up with a very plausible explanation for this. He poses as a john/drug dealer. She left her perfectly good holiday in room to get a bag, meet me at the gas station for your bag. He plays up the whole nobody can know my identity because I am a drug dealer thing. Obviously because he is a drug dealer they think he has money. EUREKA!!!!!

Throw away phones are used by drug dealers as well.

 

[LR1]

Considering there were no reports of a shared john, I highly doubt we're looking at a john who lured the girls, and then murdered them. And even though the last two victims may have let their guard down, I still lean toward the stalking theory.

My theory hinges on them attending a bdsm or swing event... or even one of the sex clubs in the NYC area. While women can attend by themselves, men must be accompanied by a female. Therefore, I could see someone hiring an escort for the evening. Importantly, these sort of events would provide a means for the killer to identify his type. That is, they'd be unknowingly auditioning for him.

While I have seen ads posted by men requesting partners to attend these types of events... or go to the sex clubs with them, Iow, how often do escorts encounter these type of requests?

I could turn that around and say considering there were no reports from LE, friends, family or witnesses who might have also been in attendance of the girls ever attending any bdsm/swing events I highly doubt that is the common denominator.

The way I see it that angle is too risky for him. any kind of scene or gathering or event implies multiple people which implies potentially multiple witnesses. he's gotten away with it because he takes few risks and the risks he does take are done because he knows just how much he can get away with.

The reason there were no reports of a shared john is because they haven't figured out who that john was, YET.

 

[Just K]

For all we know he is the host of one of these group events. Just like any other type of stalking case, that ultimately escalates, all he/they/she/whatever had to do was see them once . Then the stalker hones in on her...maybe even waits around outside or somewhere inside he chats her up...slips her his number or asks for hers...then all he has to do is google her number, find her ads...sometimes it probably worked and sometimes it probably didn't.

 

[Justiceforever]

Considering there were no reports of a shared john, I highly doubt we're looking at a john who lured the girls, and then murdered them. And even though the last two victims may have let their guard down, I still lean toward the stalking theory.

My theory hinges on them attending a bdsm or swing event... or even one of the sex clubs in the NYC area. While women can attend by themselves, men must be accompanied by a female. Therefore, I could see someone hiring an escort for the evening. Importantly, these sort of events would provide a means for the killer to identify his type. That is, they'd be unknowingly auditioning for him.

While I have seen ads posted by men requesting partners to attend these types of events... or go to the sex clubs with them, Iow, how often do escorts encounter these type of requests?

Aren't luring, grooming and "dating "or talking on the phone considered elements of the stalking process, in some cases?

I have never had a request but I'm sure some do.

 

[Justiceforever]

I just came up with a very plausible explanation for this. He poses as a john/drug dealer. She left her perfectly good holiday in room to get a bag, meet me at the gas station for your bag. He plays up the whole nobody can know my identity because I am a drug dealer thing. Obviously because he is a drug dealer they think he has money. EUREKA!!!!!

Throw away phones are used by drug dealers as well.

I think that's highly plausible Native.

 

[shadowraiths]

The way I see it that angle is too risky for him. any kind of scene or gathering or event implies multiple people which implies potentially multiple witnesses. he's gotten away with it because he takes few risks and the risks he does take are done because he knows just how much he can get away with.

I agree that it's a long shot. Otoh, people in the scene go by pseudonyms, as opposed to real names.

Moreover, at least two well-known people in the BDSM scene were later found to be serial killers. That is, Edward Robinson Sr, aka Slave Master ( link ) and Robert Pickton ( link ). The former primarily trolled for his victims online (i.e, in BDSM chatrooms and on Usenet) and was well-known and respected by scene life stylers. The latter used his "Piggy Palace" parties to identify his victims.

At least one RCMP officer claimed she had seen one of Pickton's victims at a Piggy Palace event. ( link ) Another, who regularly attended Seattle kink events, was investigated due to photos he'd posted to a fetish site. ( link ) Word on the Seattle kink scene grapevine is that this officer may have played a role impeding the investigation into Pinkton bc he was allegedly known to attend Pinkton's parties.

Robinson's first known murder was in 1984 and Pickton's first known murder victim was in 1991. Robinson was apprehended for his murders in 2000, and Pickton, in 2002.

Both of these individuals were scene outliers. That is, the majority of those who engage in scene activity do so consensually, and do not harm their play partners. However, due to the type of practice people in the scene engage in, it is quite easy for a serial killer type to hide in plain sight.

So, while I do agree this angle is a long shot, imo, potential witnesses is not an issue. Simply due to a culture that is designed to protect players' anonymity.

 

[shadowraiths]

Aren't luring, grooming and "dating "or talking on the phone considered elements of the stalking process, in some cases?

A individual who lures, grooms, and/or dates his victim, isn't technically a stalker.

Here is a list of the types of stalkers ( link ). *IF* the killer is stalking these women, I would proffer that he would fall into the "predatory" category.

Predatory stalkers spy on the victim in order to prepare and plan an attack – often sexual – on the victim.​

Some time ago, I wrote up a brief description of what I call "The Hunter," as follows:

The Hunter

At first glance, The Hunter seems to be an evolved Watcher. However the underlying psychological characteristics of this typology qualify this type of predator for their own archetype. For example, unlike the watcher, the hunter is not even remotely shy. Nor does he fear people. If anything, he would pride himself on his hunting prowess and ability to move about with chameleon like fluidity. The Hunter can be further divided into a two-by-two matrix, as follows.

Type/Motive...Pursuit...Possess
Charmer..........XX...........XX
Stalker............XX...........XX​

Whether Charmer or Stalker, the hunter's primary motivation will either be the pursuit itself or the post-capture, possession. Hence, the above matrix. The following will give a brief overview of the matrix types and motives.​

Charmer

The charmer charms his way into the victim's life and is therefore known to the victim. This means that he must be good with people. And though he may be able to exhibit a wide range of emotions, he actually doesn't feel them. Notably, the charmer is excellent in reading people and reflecting back to them what they want to hear. He is the psychopath in its purest form. The charmer is the guy that we often think of as a con artist. The smooth talker with the silver tipped tongue. This guy seems almost too good to be true. Almost.​

Stalker

The stalker stalks his victim and is less likely to engage with them. He is less evolved than the charmer, yet more of an evolved watcher. Unlike the charmer, he does not have the people skills to woo his victim. His hunting prowess can however be exemplary.​

Pursuit

The pursuit is what galvanizes this type of hunter, who, otherwise, experiences life as a somewhat bland, colorless, existence. The hunter with this underlying motivation will have spent the majority of his time engaging in the pursuit. Once he has "caught" the victim, he will be returned to a state of boredom, and the victim's death and disposal is likely to be swift. Though, he may take trophies to record successful kills.

For this type of hunter, the greater the challenge, the better. He will consider each "hunt" to be a learning process, a means to hone his skills. Each kill brings him closer to becoming the ultimate chameleon. Or so he thinks. As his confidence grows, he is more likely than not prone to toy with law enforcement. Taunting them to flaunt his hunting prowess. This is the guy that will attempt to insert himself into an investigation and even be so bold as to get close to victim's families.

While he may not be above average in intelligence, he is likely to consider those he taunts to be of lesser intelligence. If suspected, he will play the victim card by telling a story that is designed to garner the sympathy or distract. His boldness is both his strength and his undoing. The former challenges the strongly held social behaviors and acceptable etiquette. Bc of this people can easily be caught off guard (i.e., "He was such a nice guy! No way he would do something like that!"). The latter increases the likelihood of being caught. Everyone eventually slips up.​

Possess

For this type, possessing his victim, holding their life and manner of death in his hands is what excites him. This type tends toward sexual sadism and will spend a protracted amount of time torturing his victim. And he will likely experiment, try different things, while focusing solely upon his victim's reactions. The victim's reactions are what feeds him. Therefore, this type will be inextricably drawn toward those who exhibit a wide range of emotions. He wants someone who will plead for her life. He wants a screamer.​

*IF* stalking the scene plays any sort of role in these murders, I would wager this guy falls into the stalker/possessor section of the aforementioned matrix.

I have never had a request but I'm sure some do.

My guess is that these sort of requests are rare. Which is what makes this scenario less plausible.