Found Deceased AL - Kamille "Cupcake" McKinney, 3, kidnapped from birthday party, Birmingham, 12 Oct 2019 #4

[MsBetsy]

To me the first guy looks like someone just out walking or jogging. He even swerves to avoid the children. I'm not sure about the second guy. He interacts with the children and they do follow him. My impression of the man they arrested was he was very tall and fit and had short hair. The guy in the video didn't look tall. But the LE said he was the suspect just not naming him. I have no idea.

Yes, the second man is a suspect but we do not know if it's the same man they arrested. Imo

 

[margarita25]

I keep googling every few hours, hoping for some good news.

I hate to think this way, but at this point in the search, does it sound like LE is doing the grid search looking for a living child, or recovering a body?

I think any kind of evidence, whether it be her body or other evidence moo.

 

[oviedo]

The witness might have only seen the man picking her up and putting her into the truck.

I do think I've seen that but I'm not sure where. However, not all sources have reported that the 11-year-old was the only witness. Here is one example.

3-year-old girl kidnapped from Birmingham birthday party; Amber Alert cites ‘extreme danger’
According to other children, a man and a woman in a dark SUV picked up Kamille. An 11-year-old boy said he saw a man get out of the SUV, pick up Kamille and put her in the vehicle. Police do not believe this is a custodial issue. Both of Kamille’s parents as well as her extended family are on the scene.

Except the witness said he saw a man get out of the SUV...

 

[margarita25]

I am believing the witness at this point moo.

 

[MizStery]

‘Thanks margarita25! I wish I had my old emoji from the previous WS editor ‘just darn’ anyhow we now have to try to imagine , ‘a Websleuths group hug’

(Don’t do that!)
RSBM
The subject of tracking and scents is indeed worthy of discussion, especially since that is what they’re doing right now. Getcho butt back here

margarita25 remembering those dogs barking in the background at that interview at his home how could that ‘’ Chis Watts continue to lie .......at a loss for words.

This reminds me of the Chris Watts porch interview where the dogs are barking in the background.

So going along these lines, might the dogs have indicated on a location, such as the vehicle or the PS/QJ residence is certainly a question as well.

Your post n4k speaking of a large body of water in today’s search got me thinking just maybe the scope of today’s search could include many more tracking resources (just a theory as there has been no indication what resources search teams will use today)like boats and water sniffing K9 dogs? Just My Opinion

I believe they will search Avondale Park today. 0.8 miles from TB. Large body of water there. Has anyone seen where they have searched any water?

 

[margarita25]

‘Thanks margarita25! I wish I had my old emoji from the previous WS editor ‘just darn’ anyhow we now have to try to imagine , ‘a Websleuths group hug’

margarita25 remembering those dogs barking in the background at that interview at his home how could that ‘***’ Chis Watts continue to lie .......at a loss for words.

Your post n4k speaking of a large body of water in today’s search got me thinking just maybe the scope of today’s search could include many more tracking resources (just a theory as there has been no indication what resources search teams will use today)like boats and water sniffing K9 dogs? Just My Opinion

Indeed. Can we get specs on the water body? Size? Depth? Temp, etc? Water dogs are specialized dogs as we learned Dylan Redwine’s case. Will there be divers IF it’s the body of water? Why would he frequent a body of water? Is it the water? We don’t know yet.

Today mind has slept off the CP theory. New thoughts today that aren’t CP.

(ETA: @Miztery, I drove by the Watts house recently There are toys piled on the doorstep including a huge giraffe. We will never forget. Words can’t describe the feeling of emptiness and the VOID, you could feel it in the air. The lawn is all dried out, was like an eerie, abandoned..it was awful I cried for hours..there was no feeling of peace there at all, you could feel that something really bad happened there...o/t.)

 

[maureen718]

I've been following since the beginning, this is the first thought I have to contribute.
I've been thinking about what the Chief is saying while showing the video. He's saying he is interested in the "third" guy, the "first" guy who walks by the children. Then he says we know who the children are and the second guy.
Okay so, I think he refers to the first guy to walk past the kids as the third guy could be because he is following the line of thought that PS is suspect person one, the second guy in video is the second suspect and now the first person in the video is the "third" suspect or someone he really wants to identify. This still leaves Ms QJ as possibly involved or she connects with PS shortly after the timeframe this crime occurs. I think this goes toward a theory that Cupcake has been moved around.
All just MOO

 

[n4k]

Do you know how far that is from Where KM went missing?

0.8 miles. A straight shot.

Google Maps

 

[MFH]

I believe they will search Avondale Park today. 0.8 miles from TB. Large body of water there. Has anyone seen where they have searched any water?

The reason I think this is not too likely, is that once you cross the train tracks going from Tom brown village to Avondale park, the area is a busier area with a lot of nightlife and people around. Also I think more places to be caught on cctv as well. It would be really risky at that time of night to head in that direction if you didn’t want to be spotted IMO.

The park itself isn’t as popular at night, but it would be hard to reach if you were trying to not be seen.

I absolutely could be wrong so JMOO

 

[n4k]

The reason I think this is not too likely, is that once you cross the train tracks going from Tom brown village to Avondale park, the area is a busier area with a lot of nightlife and people around. Also I think more places to be caught on cctv as well. It would be really risky at that time of night to head in that direction if you didn’t want to be spotted IMO.

The park itself isn’t as popular at night, but it would be hard to reach if you were trying to not be seen.

I absolutely could be wrong so JMOO

I hope you are right, but 7-8 pm is a bit early for Avondale area night life. Also, if there were two abductors, keeping kid down would be easy. Remember, no one was looking for her in the first five minutes (the amount of time it would take them to drive that route). Also, they would only cross 5th, not drive down it. Again, praying you are correct.

 

[Lillymac]

MOO...I don’t think so. I think they (POI’s arrested) are not involved at all. They might have some connection to Tom Brown but it’s limited to knowing a person who lives there now or knowing someone who lived there in the past. It’s very possible the females being held has lived there in the past too. The first 2 suspects arrested are red herrings IMHO.

I think if that is the correct vehicle it was a miracle they found it. First it was a dark green with tan trim Toyota, then it it maybe was a 4 runner, but it turned out to be blue with a silver bumper and its a Sequoia.
Plus I can't believe they made no effort to hide the car especially if it had just been used in a child abduction.
If the guy arrested was involved in this abduction there is absolutely no reason he should not have been rearrested for it. I'm thinking no dna match and cops are still looking for the abductor. I'm glad both he and the woman are now exposed for their other crimes, but I think red herring too. jmo

 

[margarita25]

If it’s .8 miles and a straight shot that would be one of the first places to look, moo. First thing I do when I look at a map in any case is isolate the water bodies and “green areas” and parks, moo. I’m surprised LE would just be looking there now? Surely they’ve looked there before now. That’s 101, moo. .8 miles? That is under a one mile standard search radius. Surely...

 

[MsBetsy]

Except the witness said he saw a man get out of the SUV...

Right, and it doesn't make sense that the suspect in the video would get in the SUV and then get back out again to pick her up. Imo

 

[margarita25]

Right, and it doesn't make sense that the suspect in the video would get in the SUV and then get back out again to pick her up. Imo

Hmmmmm

 

[MFH]

I hope you are right, but 7-8 pm is a bit early for Avondale area night life. Also, if there were two abductors, keeping kid down would be easy. Remember, no one was looking for her in the first five minutes (the amount of time it would take them to drive that route). Also, they would only cross 5th, not drive down it. Again, praying you are correct.

True, but I think the brewery was showing football all day, and there are a few restaurants too. 41st street is the area that is busiest with people and the most direct route from TBV to the park. There are only a few places that face the park on 5th, which is a busier road. It is definitely the closest large field/park area to TBV though.

Just for people not local, the area across the train tracks is a completely different feel/atmosphere than the area of TBV.

I really am interested where the searches since Friday have been, as well as where the search is today. I think that location would tell a lot.

All IMOO

 

[margarita25]

So if the park is only .8 miles away and he “frequented” it, that would mean he is very very close and local.

We don’t know it’s the park yet do we? Sorry just woke up, foggy.

 

[n4k]

True, but I think the brewery was showing football all day, and there are a few restaurants too. 41st street is the area that is busiest with people and the most direct route from TBV to the park. There are only a few places that face the park on 5th, which is a busier road. It is definitely the closest large field/park area to TBV though.

Just for people not local, the area across the train tracks is a completely different feel/atmosphere than the area of TBV.

I really am interested where the searches since Friday have been, as well as where the search is today. I think that location would tell a lot.

All IMOO

You are 100% correct. I'm looking west and wondering about Eastlake Park, too. A somewhat central location to site of abduction and Crestview. I'm really thinking LE's grid search announcement may have been an attempt to flush out the perp to try to get them to move her. First, within an hour or so, they have enough volunteers, and then yesterday they post that they have enough within the department, so do not need the public. Wouldn't they assess whether they needed the public BEFORE going public with a request for volunteers?

 

[Gardener1850]

Sorry, I'm lost reading recent posts and trying to catch up. Have LE revealed where they are searching today? Or is the discussion of certain apartment buildings and parks all just speculation? TIA.

 

[maureen718]

It doesn't make sense that the first person in the surveillance video hasn't identified themselves days ago. With all the canvassing of the area and the focus on finding KM that the person hasn't told LE that they saw the kids playing by themselves as they walked by that night. Tom Brown Village doesn't seem like an area random people unassociated with the area just happen to walk by, it's not Broadway in New York City where someone from anywhere usa could be at anytime any day. This person has very little chance of not knowing they walked by these kids at a crucial time in KM's disappearance. MOO

 

[coffeebeans03]

I hope you are right, but 7-8 pm is a bit early for Avondale area night life. Also, if there were two abductors, keeping kid down would be easy. Remember, no one was looking for her in the first five minutes (the amount of time it would take them to drive that route). Also, they would only cross 5th, not drive down it. Again, praying you are correct.

True, but I think the brewery was showing football all day, and there are a few restaurants too. 41st street is the area that is busiest with people and the most direct route from TBV to the park. There are only a few places that face the park on 5th, which is a busier road. It is definitely the closest large field/park area to TBV though.

Just for people not local, the area across the train tracks is a completely different feel/atmosphere than the area of TBV.

I really am interested where the searches since Friday have been, as well as where the search is today. I think that location would tell a lot.

All IMOO

I am from the area as well and agree that is a pretty busy time. When I go eat around that time I have to park in the parking lot for the park/library usually is usually half way full with people going to eat and for drinks and a decent amount of foot traffic.