Allison Baden-Clay - GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD #40

[DrWatson]

Thanks Doc, and is it consistent with having no broken ribs which we know she didn't have?

Yes - that would be quite consistent.

 

[alioop]

Just a thought that maybe they took their argument outside the house so as not to disturb the girls and that could be why they were on the patio at the back. Or one of them went outside for whatever reason and the other followed.

 

[alioop]

Just off the topic of today's discussion and not to sidetrack our discussion about the patio, but I was just re-reading the first bail hearing documents and it states "He told police that the deceased suffered from depression but was unlikely to self harm or commit suicide"

This is consistent with the defence's theory of suicide arising not from GBC's beliefs (because he had already told police that she was unlikely to suicide) but from the evidence gathered by the police, i.e. the zoloft and diary.

 

[Liadan]

This is from the bail hearing report...


In arguing against the suicide theory, Mr Boyle said the crown also had new evidence which he believed showed Mrs Baden-Clay's body was moved to the area near Kholo Creek where it had been found.

He said an expert had identified six species of plant on Mrs Baden-Clay's body, clothes and hair, only two of which were found in the area where she was found.

But he said all six had been identified in the area surrounding Mrs Baden-Clay's Brookfield Road home and patio.

"That is consistent [with the Crown's theory] with being moved from the house after death and then being placed in the area near Kholo Creek...it flies in the face if the suicide theory.

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...denied-bail-20121214-2beo5.html#ixzz2GPle8795

Oooh thaks for that! so looking at the patio - there are a few species of plants I can recognise there - chinese elm saplings,(Celtis sinensis), tippuana tipu (the large trees lower side of the house far end of patio), fishbone fern, corky passion vine creeping up the plants on the edge of the patio. Apart from the corky passion vine these would not have been around where she was found. I can't tell if there is a Caliandra (powder puff) tree at the far end of the patio.

and there is likely chinese star jasmine as it is around the front stairs tho not glaringly obvious in the patio picture

 

[alioop]

I am guessing but probably no jasmine at Kholo.

 

[Liadan]

I am guessing but probably no jasmine at Kholo.

Yeah I would pretty much bet on that! But depending on where he picked her up from in the garden we might be able to glean a bit of info. Sort of like a trail of leaves

 

[alioop]

very clever of you Liadan to think to look at the plant species.

 

[alioop]

Talking of plant material, forensics found no plant material on the wheel arches of the captiva or GBC's shoes, that was found at Kholo Creek. I wonder if they found any plant material at all. He could have got rid of his shoes and either cleaned the wheel arches or just got lucky or didn't drive on the grass at Kholo, just stayed on the bitumen.

 

[Makara]

Oooh thaks for that! so looking at the patio - there are a few species of plants I can recognise there - chinese elm saplings,(Celtis sinensis), tippuana tipu (the large trees lower side of the house far end of patio), fishbone fern, corky passion vine creeping up the plants on the edge of the patio. Apart from the corky passion vine these would not have been around where she was found. I can't tell if there is a Caliandra (powder puff) tree at the far end of the patio.

and there is likely chinese star jasmine as it is around the front stairs tho not glaringly obvious in the patio picture

Very clever Liadan. Thank you.

 

[Liadan]

Talking of plant material, forensics found no plant material on the wheel arches of the captiva or GBC's shoes, that was found at Kholo Creek. I wonder if they found any plant material at all. He could have got rid of his shoes and either cleaned the wheel arches or just got lucky or didn't drive on the grass at Kholo, just stayed on the bitumen.

I don't think GBC dumped the body - I think that was NBC. So whether he took the Captiva to NBC or NBC picked up the Captiva - I think he would have had to at the very least not know where Allison ended up to actually be able to say - I don't know where she is when asked by the police.

 

[alioop]

I don't think GBC dumped the body - I think that was NBC. So whether he took the Captiva to NBC or NBC picked up the Captiva - I think he would have had to at the very least not know where Allison ended up to actually be able to say - I don't know where she is when asked by the police.

Why would it be important to GBC to not lie about where Allison's was? He seems to tell lots of lies so is used to lying well before Allison's death. I think lying about Allison's whereabouts wouldn't have been a big concern for him.

 

[Liadan]

Why would it be important to GBC to not lie about where Allison's was? He seems to tell lots of lies so is used to lying well before Allison's death. I think lying about Allison's whereabouts wouldn't have been a big concern for him.

Well can I use that phrase- I feel it in my waters - but I reckon the old guy would have been the cleaner - as he was always cleaning up GBC's messes. And I think it would have been preferable for GBC to stay with the 3 girls than having to go out and do the dump deed. His dad was a hunter and could deal with that sort of stuff more easily.

And as for lying - yes he lies about everything but speaks half truths. He lies so much he wouldnt be able to keep track of them. And if he had hid her - there would have been a million one places he could have suggested she would be cause he wouldn't keep his mouth shut. Simply like she went for a walk, she fell down a hole, she was watching TV last nite, she always goes walking. So I do think that NBC took over - it was already a schmozzel with his story and I can't see him actually being part of the dumping.

 

[BreakingNews]

From the picture of the patio above you could imagine and this is just a guess that the ground slopes down towards the property boundary. Just since the house is high one one side and not on the other. Maybe there were stairs down on that slope but given the general look of the house I would say it wasn't likely to have 'nice to have' features.

I can remember seeing 3-4 steps at the back of the house - photos from the real estate rental ad maybe???

 

[alioop]

Well can I use that phrase- I feel it in my waters - but I reckon the old guy would have been the cleaner - as he was always cleaning up GBC's messes. And I think it would have been preferable for GBC to stay with the 3 girls than having to go out and do the dump deed. His dad was a hunter and could deal with that sort of stuff more easily.

And as for lying - yes he lies about everything but speaks half truths. He lies so much he wouldnt be able to keep track of them. And if he had hid her - there would have been a million one places he could have suggested she would be cause he wouldn't keep his mouth shut. Simply like she went for a walk, she fell down a hole, she was watching TV last nite, she always goes walking. So I do think that NBC took over - it was already a schmozzel with his story and I can't see him actually being part of the dumping.

You are entitled to your opinion , we all share our opinions including me, but the police haven't charged NBC so I think that there is insufficient evidence against anyone other than GBC. That's all we have to work with from the current legal process.

Edit. I mean insufficient evidence at this stage.

 

[Amee]

Yeah I would pretty much bet on that! But depending on where he picked her up from in the garden we might be able to glean a bit of info. Sort of like a trail of leaves

Great to you see back Liadan.

 

[Liadan]

You are entitled to your opinion , we all share our opinions including me, but the police haven't charged NBC so I think that there is insufficient evidence against anyone other than GBC. That's all we have to work with from the current legal process.

I do agree Alioop its only my opinion, but could they proceed with the murder charge on GBC and then later get NBC as an accessory of murder after the trial of GBC.

 

[alioop]

I do agree Alioop its only my opinion, but could they proceed with the murder charge on GBC and then later get NBC as an accessory of murder after the trial of GBC.

Yes they could Liadan, good point. Usually trials for accessories are held separately anyway, if they plead not guilty of course. Maybe the police are playing a waiting game to see what eventuates at and following the committal and then trial if GBC is committed. Just because any one else hasn't been charged yet, doesn't mean it won't happen at some point.

 

[Makara]

I can remember seeing 3-4 steps at the back of the house - photos from the real estate rental ad maybe???

I saved all of the photos of the house from the rental advert and there are no steps visible at the back of the house.

MOO.

 

[marlywings]

And as for lying - yes he lies about everything but speaks half truths. He lies so much he wouldnt be able to keep track of them.

Thought I'd add this one from his list of lies for anyone who may not have read it. I wonder what the go was with the doctor hopping.

BBM

December 15, 2012

Other released documents reveal Baden-Clay went to the Kenmore Clinics Medical Practice at 8.30am the day after reporting his wife missing. He asked Dr Candice Beaven to look at cuts on his face.

"He told Dr Beaven that police had advised him to have his injuries documented," the documents state.

"No police officer on the brief stated that they advised the applicant to do this."

That afternoon, Baden-Clay went to a clinic in Taringa and again asked a doctor to look at scratches.

That night he was examined a third time on this occasion.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...baden-clays-face/story-e6freoof-1226537344568

 

[alioop]

And even if someone did suggest he see a doctor to have his injuries examined, then why did he think it necessary to go to 3 different doctors? What was he doctor shopping for? I wonder if he also asked the doctors to examine the scratches on his torso and under his arms or just those on his face?